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#341 |
Resident Photo Buff
Forum Moderator Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Somewhere in middle America
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That sounds more like the rallying cry of those who oppose it, and not the actual raison d'être of providing affordable health care to people who previously could not afford it.
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#342 | |
Blue Crack Addict
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: In a dimension known as the Twilight Zone...do de doo doo, do de doo doo...
Posts: 20,739
Local Time: 02:52 AM
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I think the biggest issue related to health care should be more with looking into why the hell every single hospital-related procedure or whatever costs so much. My dad, when he was sick, could not get properly treated at the hospitals closest to us, because they were small town ones and didn't have the sort of equipment and such he needed to get treated. So he had to take an ambulance to another hospital nearly 2 hours away (my mom would take him when she could, but that required taking time off at her part time job she had, at a retail store, which was easier said than done, and it also required the mercy of our older van not dying out on us, which happened too often, unfortunately). And paying for the ambulance service is fine, but when you add that cost (which was a pretty big one, if I recall rightly) into the treatments and the time spent in the hospital, which was a couple months, plus all the pills my dad had to take for this and that (most of which were probably really unnecessary, in my opinion, and didn't help much, if at all, anyway), plus the costs for my mom if she managed to get a moment free to travel to the city two hours away to see my dad and talk with the doctors about what was going on, it adds up very, very quickly. And when you're relying on a part-time job to keep yourself and your family in an apartment, and possibly having to use some of that money for cab service to get to that job if your car dies on you (and cab services add up, too, if you use those on a regular basis), or to make sure your family can eat, sorry, hospital bills aren't going to be at the top of your list of things to pay off right away. Even if you want to pay them, after you use up all your money for the other important necessities, you don't have enough to do it anyway. And if you do absolutely need to get them paid, then sometimes you may have to turn to that "evil government aid" that is known as Medicare/Medicaid to help you out. |
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#343 |
Blue Crack Addict
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 28,174
Local Time: 03:52 AM
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We don't need to hear about the reality of human lives Moonlit Angel-stereotypes will suffice
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#344 | |
Blue Crack Addict
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: NY
Posts: 18,918
Local Time: 03:52 AM
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Now let's look at costs a bit, all from Cost of Baby Delivery - Consumer Information and Prices Paid - CostHelper.com, which cites various sources. - Vaginal delivery without complications $9,000-$17,000 - C-section delivery without complications $14,000-$25,000 - Bill received by healthy baby upon discharge $1,500-$4,000 On top of that let's add: - An average of $130/visit during the pregnancy, and the average number of visits during a healthy pregnancy is 14, totaling almost $2,000 And this does NOT include costs spent on high-risk pregnancies (ie. women who develop gestational diabetes, fibroids, early ruptures, etc) nor does it include costs incurred by babies who need to spend time in the NICU - this is where they really ding you and you can easily be looking at $100K/case. Seems that if you take a pro-life view and want all of these wonderful bundles of joy to be born, then you'd have a vested interest in, you know, providing coverage for these women so that they don't instead opt for the much cheaper option of abortion, which by the way, the Guttmacher Institute estimates to be an affordable $468 on average in the USA. |
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#345 |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
FOB Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Harvard Supermodel Activist of the Decade Runner-Up
Posts: 9,562
Local Time: 11:52 PM
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Obviously these women were deprived of an abstinence only sex education curriculum.
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#346 | |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Winterfell
Posts: 3,825
Local Time: 03:52 AM
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#347 |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Winterfell
Posts: 3,825
Local Time: 03:52 AM
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Yes. Privatize it. It's a ponzi scheme as it is. Let me invest it in the free market because that will return my money 20 fold!
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#348 |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: boom clap
Posts: 4,435
Local Time: 11:52 PM
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I typed something, but then deleted it because your use of exclamation points is setting off Poe's Law alarm bells.
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#349 |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Winterfell
Posts: 3,825
Local Time: 03:52 AM
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#350 | ||
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: The American Resistance
Posts: 4,754
Local Time: 01:52 AM
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Has Obamacare addressed any of these drivers of increased costs? It purposely avoids tort reform. “Tort reform is not in the bill because the people who wrote it did not want to take on the trial lawyers. And, that is the plain and simple truth.” Howard Dean 2009. ObGyn is one of the highest by the way leading to the closing of maternity wards in many hospitals and a shortage of such doctors. The more engaged a consumer is in the market the more incentive there is for the market to drive down the price -- is the heath care consumer more or less engaged in the market by Obamacare. 8% of babies born in this country are to parents here illegally. Somebody (that would be us) is paying for that. I can't even ask with a straight face if Obamacare addresses that issue so I won't. Quote:
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#351 | |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Winterfell
Posts: 3,825
Local Time: 03:52 AM
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The free market is completely fair. No one was ever dropped for preexisting conditions and it is absurd and unAmerican to suggest otherwise. I agree! You want to drive down costs, get rid of lawsuits(the work of the devil) and limit this scientific technology. MRI machines are basically sorcery, and people who are weak enough to get sick should use the power of prayer to get better. Thats how they did it in the olden days. If they don't, well thats so called liberal darwinism for you. As for the large families it was a sign of a healthy Christen sex life! These illegal children should have no right to healthcare. As Newt said, "put them to work!" Newt 2011 When my forefathers who came here long ago, did they have healthcare? No! They worked for their money and didn't demand government handouts. They didn't get sick either! They didn't need healthcare and neither do these illegal kids. Jesus certainly didn't support caring for the sick and the needy. He said " teach a man to fish and he'll eat for a lifetime". These kids need to learn to fish for themselves and not rely on NObamacare. Why does this guy want to keep driving up costs? He's ruining the very fabric of America and is just going to turn us into another European socialist state!!!! The elderly worked all their lives and now Obama wants to put them before death panels? To hell with that I say!! NObamacare is unconstitutional and had he not held Roberts' family hostage the court would have struck it down. I weep as my country keeps going down the toilet. Who will save us? Future President Rmoney, that's who! He would never let something like a mandate slide if he was in charge! We need to throw the usurper and chief out the door and send him packing back to Ken... I mean Hawaii this November. |
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#352 | |
you are what you is
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 22,054
Local Time: 09:52 AM
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unless you find logic in the notion that the issue of illegal immigrants should be addressed in about a dozen different laws in which case I think you just lack common sense which would explain why you reckon the PPACA would be the place to (finally) attack the unbecoming lawsuit culture in the USA
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“Some scientists claim that hydrogen, because it is so plentiful, is the basic building block of the universe. I dispute that. I say there is more stupidity than hydrogen, and that is the basic building block of the universe.” ~Frank Zappa |
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#353 | |||||
Blue Crack Supplier
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 41,232
Local Time: 02:52 AM
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#354 | |
Blue Crack Addict
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: NY
Posts: 18,918
Local Time: 03:52 AM
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That's pretty hilarious. Did the parents of those 7 or 8 children live in urban centres where houses cost $2 million? Did those 7 or 8 children have to pay 500 bucks for a year's tuition at college or $45,000? Did the father of those parents make a fair wage so that he could support his family or was he toiling at 2 minimum wage jobs, like his wife? But I note that you didn't answer the question, so am I to assume that you'd rather not see pregnant women who can't afford to have the baby due to costs, whether that woman is an illegal immigrant or an unemployed or underemployed American if it means that you'd have socialized medicine? I'm not saying that stance is wrong, but let's at least be honest so that we know what we're talking about next time a pro-life conversation kicks up. |
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#355 | |
Acrobat
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Seattle
Posts: 402
Local Time: 12:52 AM
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Slightly unrelated question here. I have house insurance. But I always wondered what it was supposed to cover. Just emergencies or does it actually cover things that break/get damaged because of poor build quality?
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#356 | |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: The American Resistance
Posts: 4,754
Local Time: 01:52 AM
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#357 | ||
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: The American Resistance
Posts: 4,754
Local Time: 01:52 AM
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In case you haven't noticed, government can't afford to raise our children starting with pregnancy and continuing through college. |
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#358 | ||
Blue Crack Supplier
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 41,232
Local Time: 02:52 AM
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#359 |
Blue Crack Addict
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: In a dimension known as the Twilight Zone...do de doo doo, do de doo doo...
Posts: 20,739
Local Time: 02:52 AM
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Is there a chance we can retire the word "freeloaders" from all economic discussion for a while?
Also: Neither can many parents. I love the idea of parents being able to provide everything for their children, that's wonderful. But even with the best of intentions, many still have a hard time doing that. |
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#360 | |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Winterfell
Posts: 3,825
Local Time: 03:52 AM
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Kids get too much now a days because parents provide too much. We need to lower the age that you can start working down to at least 10, although I'd be happy at 13. When I was 11 I got a job off the books sweeping floors in a factory. It will teach them responsibility. |
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