Biggest Grossing Tours Of All Time

[U2FanPeter]

highest average per show gross adjusted for inflation

Though it's an apples/oranges comparison, just out of curiousity does 360 beat the 3 Tenors tour show average when adjusted for inflation?

 

[CosmoKramer]

Though it's an apples/oranges comparison, just out of curiousity does 360 beat the 3 Tenors tour show average when adjusted for inflation?

I don't have much info on the 3 Tenors but the fast answer is no, U2 360 would not beat the 3 Tenors.

It is my understanding that the 3 Tenors only played a couple dozen shows when they toured. I would say their average gross back in the 90's would have been around 7 million per show (today it would be higher and of course higher then U2360). However, like you said, its apples to oranges because of the number of dates played. I mentioned in my post that this record was for tours on a "large scale", which to me would be a minimum of 75 dates WW (thats just my scale, others may feel it is 50 shows or 100 shows).

If U2 played just 20 dates world wide (stadium shows), they would be able to charge much more per ticket and would probably bring in 15-20 million per show (that is a pure guesstimate). Figure this: if they played 1 east coast date in say NY (Giants Stadium), that show can fit 80k people. During U2 360 (first NA Leg) they played to 139k in Boston, 162k in NY, 84k in Wash & 136k in Chicago. Granted there were some "repeat" customers their but never the less, they still played to 521,000 people. I would have to believe that out of 521k people, 15% (80k) would pay twice what they payed initially if this were U2's only show in their area (since only 20 shows WW, you might even through the Toronto attendance in that number). So 80k people at $200 a ticket would be $16 million.

With all that said, the 3 Tenors were very impressive for the few dates that they did play (sing)..lol

 

[U2FanPeter]

I dug up a couple numbers in past u2 "peeling" threads. and some were never published.

3T did $8mil at the Skydome in Toronto 14 years ago. Vancouver did $5.5m at BC Place on 12/31/96.

It is fair to say the comparing a 13(?) date tour to 100 isn't fair. Though saying 3T is a multi artist bill(actually it was a single 2 hour show) when u2 have booked arena acts as Stadium openers is a weak argument.

 

[spookyz]

I have a strong feeling that U2 actually might be the top grossing draw of 2010. We all know that Pollstar used estimations for the Australian leg. These estimations turned out to be way too low.
Here's what U2 actually grossed in 2010:

GROSS: $192,420,949
ATTENDANCE: 1,813,221
SHOWS: 32

Here's what U2 grossed according to Pollstars estimations:

GROSS: $160,900,000
ATTENDANCE: 1,606,269
SHOWS: 32

Here's what Bon Jovi grossed according to Pollstar:

GROSS: $201,100,000
ATTENDANCE: 1,909,234
SHOWS: 80

I'm quite sure that Pollstar also used estimations for Bon Jovi's Australian/Asian tour. Only 2 figures from this leg were available on Pollstars Top Boxscore Year End Chart.

Here's what Bon Jovi did in Australia/New Zealand/Japan according to Pollstars estimations:

Total Gross: $54.592.612
Total Attendance: 318.080
Average Gross: $4.962.965
Average Attendance: 28.916
Shows: 11
Average Ticket Price: $172

To be honest, this seems to be a little to high. How can they generate an average ticket price of $172, when the rest of the tour had an average ticket price of $92?

I think if we'll ever get any boxscores from December 2010, Bon Jovi might turn out to have grossed less than $192,420,949.

 

[Maoilbheannacht]

http://www.u2interference.com/forum...uts-attendance-other-statistics-199248-7.html

Found another interesting quote:

Moggio: "ANYONE who thinks U2 will gross more than $600 million on their 360 tour (based on 90-100 shows AND ONLY because of strategic scheduling), is completely out to lunch."

Here is another classic from MOGGIO:

Also, I NEVER said that even if the 360 tour grosses $1 Billion that it wouldn’t top The Stones. If it grossed that, of course it would. If it grossed $800 million, it would too.

http://www.u2interference.com/forum...uts-attendance-other-statistics-199248-9.html

Thing is, if U2 adds a few more shows in Europe after the summer leg in North America, they actually will gross $800 million on the 360 tour!

Though saying 3T is a multi artist bill(actually it was a single 2 hour show) when u2 have booked arena acts as Stadium openers is a weak argument.

This is something MOGGIO would say. Most of the openers for U2 are not global or even regional "arena acts" or were announced as an opening act AFTER U2 tickets had gone on sale and soldout. There is really no evidence that ANY of the openers have had any significant impact on ticket sales for these U2 360 shows. The benefit has been to the openers who get to play in front of crowds in various markets that would be impossible on their own.

 

[CosmoKramer]

Here is another classic from MOGGIO:



http://www.u2interference.com/forum...uts-attendance-other-statistics-199248-9.html

Thing is, if U2 adds a few more shows in Europe after the summer leg in North America, they actually will gross $800 million on the 360 tour!

Okay, Ill see your "completely wrong" Moggio prediction and raise you the following:
http://www.u2interference.com/forum...uts-attendance-other-statistics-199248-5.html
Moggio: "In fact, the combination of overall album sales & inflation since the end of their record-breaking $558 million grossing, '05-'07 A Bigger Bang tour, pushes that total close to $650 million today...and will be roughly $700 million by the end of their next tour in 2011."

Even though $558 million will NOT equal $700 million by the end of this year with regard to inflation, lets say it were true. So according to Moggio, the Stones are a bigger draw then U2 because by the end of 2011, A Bigger Bang's total gross, when adjusted for inflation, would be roughly $700 million (144 shows). Well, at the end of 2011 (assuming U2 doesn't add another single date) U2 will have grossed $740-$750 million(110 dates). So, by his own admission, U2 IS a bigger draw then the Stones.

Keep in mind that when talking about the number of dates, its all relative. If artist A is popular enough to play 150 shows, then they will play 150 shows (typically). If artist B played 100 shows, it doesn't necessarily mean that they could play 150 or even 110 shows for that matter because demand might not be there. With all that said, the Stones essentially played well beyond their demand with 144 shows because several of them failed to come close to selling out (1/2 full). So, U2 could easily play an additional 20 shows in say the US but the attendance numbers would be very low compared to capacity, yet would still add 20-25 million to the tour total.

 

[Moggio]

By show 100, when the tour hits Nashville, the 360 tour's ticket sales gross will hit $660 million, U2's will hit $600 million. By show 110, the 360 tour's ticket sales gross will hit $720 million, U2's will hit $650 million.

So, considering their heavily utilized "strategic scheduling" (which is something NO ONE on the outside knew was going to be happening before the tour dates were announced), that has never been used this much on ANY tour in history and the fact that U2 have had several top arena-sized draws to help sell more tickets, U2 AND THE 360 TOUR IS SELLING AS I EXPECTED.

And remember, OVERALL, THE ROLLING STONES STILL ARE THE LARGEST ACTIVE DRAWING BAND IN THE WORLD. Their lead over U2 isn't a large one but regardless, it is a lead nonetheless.

Also and again, only about half of the 360 tour shows have been and/or will be truly "sold out." This is because once you analyze the capacities listed for many of the shows, you'll find the attendances were/are below what the actual overall stadium capacities really are.

Oh and btw, almost all of you can go fuck yourselves...especially CosmoKramer and Maloil, since they love to misquote me by taking my statements out of context.

By for now...

 

[U2FanPeter]

Also and again, only about half of the 360 tour shows have been and/or will be truly "sold out." This is because once you analyze the capacities listed for many of the shows, you'll find the attendances were/are below what the actual overall stadium capacities really are.

I'm quite critical of the liberal use of "official sell out", but I thought it's a higher close to 2/3rds rather than 1/2. At show time, not 4 months out with many US dates still having tix available.

 

[CosmoKramer]

By show 100, when the tour hits Nashville, the 360 tour's ticket sales gross will hit $660 million, U2's will hit $600 million. By show 110, the 360 tour's ticket sales gross will hit $720 million, U2's will hit $650 million.

So, considering their heavily utilized "strategic scheduling" (which is something NO ONE on the outside knew was going to be happening before the tour dates were announced), that has never been used this much on ANY tour in history and the fact that U2 have had several top arena-sized draws to help sell more tickets, U2 AND THE 360 TOUR IS SELLING AS I EXPECTED.

http://www.u2interference.com/forums/f225/f225/u2-3...-199248-7.html

Moggio: "ANYONE who thinks U2 will gross more than $600 million on their 360 tour (based on 90-100 shows AND ONLY because of strategic scheduling), is completely out to lunch."

I will wait for you to get back from lunch to explain how you "expected" U2 to gross $650 million (according to your "Moggio Mathematics") yet you originally "expected" them to gross no more then $600 million and that number is pre "Moggio Mathematics", since you clearly state that it INCLUDES strategic scheduling, so lets say it is $540 million according to your "formula". That means you are $110 million OFF from your expectation....really???

If U2 adds additional European dates and pushes their gross past $800 million, how does that turn out once your "Moggio Mathematics" are applied to adjust (force) the total to what you think it should be?

 

[Moggio]

Let's wait and see how long it takes for CosmoKramer to figure out the quote of mine above in his previous post, where I stated nearly two years ago, that U2 won't have a ticket sales gross of more than $600 million within 90-100 shows and what I just stated a few hours ago, which is that U2 will have a ticket sales gross of $600 million by show 100 of the 360 tour in Nashville, are virtually the SAME THING. Also, in case this is not completely obvious, a ticket sales gross from 90-100 shows ($600 million) is different than from 110 shows ($650 million)...

...as we wait in the queue for Maoil with more misquotes from the past...

 

[spookyz]

By show 100, when the tour hits Nashville, the 360 tour's ticket sales gross will hit $660 million, U2's will hit $600 million. By show 110, the 360 tour's ticket sales gross will hit $720 million, U2's will hit $650 million.

So you're saying that U2 will have grossed $650 million and $70 million will be due to opening acts? I appreciate having someone critical joining the discussion again, seriously, but this is just insane.

There are only three opening acts, who can be referred to as major arena acts:
Muse, The Black Eyed Peas and Jay-Z

Snow Patrol is a theatre act everywhere outside UK/Ireland. Same goes for Elbow, Kasabian and Glasvegas. Interpol are also playing small arenas in Europe and theatres in the US (they grossed $28,741 in NJ and $72,500 in Chicago, two places where they will open for U2). Lenny Kravitz is a theatre act, too (the only US boxscore I have is from Missouri, where he grossed $119,117.) The Fray is a theatre act in North America: last year they grossed $71,164 in Edmoton, where they will open for U2. OneRepublic have never toured on their own, just as an opening act and so have Florence & The Machine. How on earth would these opening acts be able to generate a total gross of $70 million?

The Black Eyed Peas

They opened for U2 in Vancouver, Vegas, LA, Norman, Phoenix.
Here's what they grossed in these markets on their own (LA and Vegas are irrelevant, because these shows had already been sold out before Black Eyed Peas were added to the bill):

Black Eyed Peas, Ludacris, LMFAO
General Motors Place
Vancouver, British Columbia
April 11, 2010
$1,070,700
15,676 / 15,676
1 / 1
$81.76, $71.79, $49.35
Concerts West/AEG Live

Black Eyed Peas, Ludacris, LMFAO, Prototype
Jobing.com Arena
Glendale, Ariz.
March 31, 2010
$962,660
14,732 / 14,732
1 / 1
$84.75, $64.75, $49.50

Black Eyed Peas, Ludacris, LMFAO
BOK Center
Tulsa, Okla.
March 20, 2010
$832,529
13,310 / 13,310
1 / 1
$81.50, $61.50, $49.50
Concerts West/AEG Live

The Black Eyed Peas have grossed $2,865,889 in the markets where they opened for U2. Keep in mind that this was AFTER they had been able to increase their popularity in these markets by opening for U2. Keep also in mind, that demand is a lot higher for them because it was their OWN show, their own stage, a full setlist...
But anyway, let's just assume that The Black Eyed Peas contributed $2,865,889 to U2 360°s overall gross.

Muse
They will open for U2 in South America and were opening act in East Rutherford, Landover, Charlottesville, Raleigh, Atlanta, Houston and Dallas.
Here's what they grossed in these markets on their own:

Muse, Silversun Pickups Arena at Gwinnett Center
Duluth, Ga.
Feb. 27, 2010
$498,890
11,267 /
11,267
1 /
1
$45.50, $35.50
Frank Productions

Muse, Silversun Pickups 1st Mariner Arena
Baltimore, Md.
March 3, 2010
$385,887
8,462 /
8,462
1 /
1
$53.50, $33.50
Frank Productions

Muse, Silversun Pickups Patriot Center
Fairfax, Va.
March 1, 2010
$385,500
7,500 /
7,500
1 /
1
$51
I.M.P.

Muse, Silversun Pickups Fort Worth Convention Center
Fort Worth, Texas
March 17, 2010
$494,607
9,836 /
11,011
1 /
0
$47.50, $42.50
AEG Live

Muse, Metric Prudential Center
Newark, N.J.
Oct. 24, 2010
$643,970
12,505 /
13,847
1 /
0
$62, $39.50
The Bowery Presents

Muse
HSBC Brasil
Sao Paulo, Brazil
July 31, 2008
$225,192
3,629 /
4,400
1 /
0
$96.36, $59.26
Evenpro/Water Brother/Mondo Entretenimento

Muse
Vivo Rio
Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
July 30, 2008
$160,458
2,992 /
4,000
1 /
0
$165.67, $44.92
Evenpro/Water Brother/Mondo Entretenimento

Muse have grossed $2,794,504 in the markets where they opened for U2. Keep in mind that this was AFTER they had been able to increase their popularity in these markets by opening for U2 (except for Brazil). Keep also in mind, that demand is a lot higher for them because it was their OWN show, their own stage, a full setlist...
But anyway, let's just assume that Muse contributed $2,794,504 to U2 360°s overall gross.

So, let's assume that U2 360° grossed $5,660,393 due to the two biggest opening acts. We don't have any Jay-Z boxsores from Australia, but he actually never did a full scale Australian arena tour with multiple dates in Sydney and Melbourne, did he? Anyway, let's be optimistic and add another $3,000,000. So overall, the absolute maximum gross, Jay-Z, Muse and BEP could have possibly contributed to the total gross was $9,600,000. That would still be another $60 million to go. So all the other theatre level opening acts could generate a gross of $60 million? Come on.

By show 100, when the tour hits Nashville, the 360 tour's ticket sales gross will hit $660 million, U2's will hit $600 million. By show 110, the 360 tour's ticket sales gross will hit $720 million, U2's will hit $650 million.

Ok this means:

By show 100
360: $660 million
U2: 600 million
opening acts: $60 million

total
360: $720 million
U2: 650 million
opening acts: $70 million

the last 10 shows
360: $60 million
U2: $50 million
opening acts: $10 million

According to you, Interpol (9 shows) and Arcade Fire (1 show) will contribute a total of $10 million to the total gross. Interpol grossed $28,741 in NJ and $72,500 in Chicago, two places where they will open for U2. How would they be able to generate $10 million? Arcade Fire are big in atlantic Canada, but $10 million?

 

[CosmoKramer]

Let's wait and see how long it takes for CosmoKramer to figure out the quote of mine above in his previous post, where I stated nearly two years ago, that U2 won't have a ticket sales gross of more than $600 million within 90-100 shows and what I just stated a few hours ago, which is that U2 will have a ticket sales gross of $600 million by show 100 of the 360 tour in Nashville, are virtually the SAME THING. Also, in case this is not completely obvious, a ticket sales gross from 90-100 shows ($600 million) is different than from 110 shows ($650 million)...

...as we wait in the queue for Maoil with more misquotes from the past...

Wow, now you are lying about your lies...this is a new one for you.

You wrote that U2 is grossing what you EXPECTED them to gross, which is $720 million for 360 and $650 million for U2 (which is a joke of course but we can play along) from 110 shows.

According to your original post from two years ago (the time of the post is irrelevant,since all of your "predictions" are based on a "formula" and the formula shouldn't have changed), you EXPECTED U2 360 to play 95-100 shows and gross $600 million WITH strategic scheduling (aka a business model) and support acts (which really don't add the 10% gross increase that you think to a tours total). That would mean that you EXPECTED U2 to gross roughly $540 million (we are comparing your original predicted U2 gross to your NEW predicted U2 Gross not U2 360 gross). So you are $110 million off...great formula

The fact that they are playing 110 shows as opposed to 100 shows is part of the expectation. If you had a real "formula", shouldn't you be able to calculate the number of shows based on the configuration of the stage that would be needed to meet their demand? The problem is, you severely underestimated their demand(its okay, so did I but I can admit that I was very wrong). You EXPECTED U2 to gross $540 million and now you EXPECT them to gross $650 million. Which one is it? The number of shows is irrelevant to the final figure because it should be factored into your expectation.

Also, what would the Stones A Bigger Bang tour gross be when you adjust for opening acts? I mean, Kanye West, Alice cooper, Our Lady Peace, John Mayer, Black Eyed Peas, Pearl Jam, Smashing Pumpkins, Alanis Morissette, Motley Crue, Metallica, Bonnie Raitt, Nickelback!

Let me know when you are back from lunch, so that we can discuss

 

[CosmoKramer]

So you're saying that U2 will have grossed $650 million and $70 million will be due to opening acts? I appreciate having someone critical joining the discussion again, seriously, but this is just insane.

There are only three opening acts, who can be referred to as major arena acts:
Muse, The Black Eyed Peas and Jay-Z

Snow Patrol is a theatre act everywhere outside UK/Ireland. Same goes for Elbow, Kasabian and Glasvegas. Interpol are also playing small arenas in Europe and theatres in the US (they grossed $28,741 in NJ and $72,500 in Chicago, two places where they will open for U2). Lenny Kravitz is a theatre act, too (the only US boxscore I have is from Missouri, where he grossed $119,117.) The Fray is a theatre act in North America: last year they grossed $71,164 in Edmoton, where they will open for U2. OneRepublic have never toured on their own, just as an opening act and so have Florence & The Machine. How on earth would these opening acts be able to generate a total gross of $70 million?

The Black Eyed Peas

They opened for U2 in Vancouver, Vegas, LA, Norman, Phoenix.
Here's what they grossed in these markets on their own (LA and Vegas are irrelevant, because these shows had already been sold out before Black Eyed Peas were added to the bill):

Black Eyed Peas, Ludacris, LMFAO
General Motors Place
Vancouver, British Columbia
April 11, 2010
$1,070,700
15,676 / 15,676
1 / 1
$81.76, $71.79, $49.35
Concerts West/AEG Live

Black Eyed Peas, Ludacris, LMFAO, Prototype
Jobing.com Arena
Glendale, Ariz.
March 31, 2010
$962,660
14,732 / 14,732
1 / 1
$84.75, $64.75, $49.50

Black Eyed Peas, Ludacris, LMFAO
BOK Center
Tulsa, Okla.
March 20, 2010
$832,529
13,310 / 13,310
1 / 1
$81.50, $61.50, $49.50
Concerts West/AEG Live

The Black Eyed Peas have grossed $2,865,889 in the markets where they opened for U2. Keep in mind that this was AFTER they had been able to increase their popularity in these markets by opening for U2. Keep also in mind, that demand is a lot higher for them because it was their OWN show, their own stage, a full setlist...
But anyway, let's just assume that The Black Eyed Peas contributed $2,865,889 to U2 360°s overall gross.

Muse
They will open for U2 in South America and were opening act in East Rutherford, Landover, Charlottesville, Raleigh, Atlanta, Houston and Dallas.
Here's what they grossed in these markets on their own:

Muse, Silversun Pickups Arena at Gwinnett Center
Duluth, Ga.
Feb. 27, 2010
$498,890
11,267 /
11,267
1 /
1
$45.50, $35.50
Frank Productions

Muse, Silversun Pickups 1st Mariner Arena
Baltimore, Md.
March 3, 2010
$385,887
8,462 /
8,462
1 /
1
$53.50, $33.50
Frank Productions

Muse, Silversun Pickups Patriot Center
Fairfax, Va.
March 1, 2010
$385,500
7,500 /
7,500
1 /
1
$51
I.M.P.

Muse, Silversun Pickups Fort Worth Convention Center
Fort Worth, Texas
March 17, 2010
$494,607
9,836 /
11,011
1 /
0
$47.50, $42.50
AEG Live

Muse, Metric Prudential Center
Newark, N.J.
Oct. 24, 2010
$643,970
12,505 /
13,847
1 /
0
$62, $39.50
The Bowery Presents

Muse
HSBC Brasil
Sao Paulo, Brazil
July 31, 2008
$225,192
3,629 /
4,400
1 /
0
$96.36, $59.26
Evenpro/Water Brother/Mondo Entretenimento

Muse
Vivo Rio
Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
July 30, 2008
$160,458
2,992 /
4,000
1 /
0
$165.67, $44.92
Evenpro/Water Brother/Mondo Entretenimento

Muse have grossed $2,794,504 in the markets where they opened for U2. Keep in mind that this was AFTER they had been able to increase their popularity in these markets by opening for U2 (except for Brazil). Keep also in mind, that demand is a lot higher for them because it was their OWN show, their own stage, a full setlist...
But anyway, let's just assume that Muse contributed $2,794,504 to U2 360°s overall gross.

So, let's assume that U2 360° grossed $5,660,393 due to the two biggest opening acts. We don't have any Jay-Z boxsores from Australia, but he actually never did a full scale Australian arena tour with multiple dates in Sydney and Melbourne, did he? Anyway, let's be optimistic and add another $3,000,000. So overall, the absolute maximum gross, Jay-Z, Muse and BEP could have possibly contributed to the total gross was $9,600,000. That would still be another $60 million to go. So all the other theatre level opening acts could generate a gross of $60 million? Come on.




Ok this means:

By show 100
360: $660 million
U2: 600 million
opening acts: $60 million

total
360: $720 million
U2: 650 million
opening acts: $70 million

the last 10 shows
360: $60 million
U2: $50 million
opening acts: $10 million

According to you, Interpol (9 shows) and Arcade Fire (1 show) will contribute a total of $10 million to the total gross. Interpol grossed $28,741 in NJ and $72,500 in Chicago, two places where they will open for U2. How would they be able to generate $10 million? Arcade Fire are big in atlantic Canada, but $10 million?

Spookyz-Moggio needs to find a way to justify how far off he was with his predictions. As you noted many of the shows completely sold out (or sold the vast bulk of their tickets) prior to the announcement of an opening act. Furthermore, as you pointed out, these acts wouldn't have added much anyway to the shows total gross. Muse played to 2,992 people in Brazil, are we to assume that all 2,992 people who went to the show are going to go to see a 1/2 set for 4 times the price at the U2 360 show.....lol


Moggio-You are very knowledgeable and I really feel you have a lot to offer but you are too thickheaded to just admit when you are wrong. If the Stones tour again, they might very well pass out U2 in tour gross and tour gross per show (adjusted for inflation) and if that happens, I will be the first in line to admit it (until U2 goes on the road again). If someone asked me who the biggest tour act of all time was, I would still say the Stones, regardless of what 360 does because the Stones maintained their hold on the "title" for 20+ years. Pink Floyd took the title briefly in the late 80's I think or early 90's it might have been but the Stones came back and reclaimed it. Then U2 took the title for a very brief time in 2005 but the Stones took it back. Now, it appears U2 will have the title again and we will see how long it stands.

With that said, the biggest CURRENT act in the world will be (not yet officially) U2 followed by the Stones/Madonna.

 

[Maoilbheannacht]

...as we wait in the queue for Maoil with more misquotes from the past...

Would it be inaccurate to say that you are capable of correcting someone if they do misqoute you as opposed to just claiming that was done?

I tell you what, I'll qoute your entire post of July 22, 2009, post #122 in the U2 360 tour: sellout, attendance and other statistics thread:

Here is the link:

http://www.u2interference.com/forum...uts-attendance-other-statistics-199248-9.html

Here is the ENTIRE post qouted, with the part I have a question about in bold:

The Australian leg of the Black Ice tour is THE HIGHEST GROSSING TOUR IN AUSTRALIAN HISTORY. A quick google news search can tell you that. And U2 don’t have a hope in hell in outgrossing AC/DC in their home country next year. For one, because if U2 do play Australia, they’ll only be playing Sydney and/or Melbourne, judging by the strategically scheduled 360 tour and how there’ll only be 10 or so shows left in the schedule after the UK/European & North American legs finish next year and since they’ll need to room schedule South American shows too. Nowhere does it say that there are going to be 12-16 shows in the ROW, after the UK/European & North American legs are complete. Are even if there were, that probably would still not be enough for a FULL Australian leg.

If you want to spend HOURS dragging up my old quotes from other forums ( you must not have a life?) from FOUR OR FIVE YEARS AGO, even though I’ve clearly stated to you that I’ve learned more about the concert business since then and have nailed down even more accurate way of predicting concert demand, then go right ahead. I can just as easily point out how you used to believe that no more than 1,000 fans from a nearby market would travel to see an act live. Or how you used to think that fans that lived more than 3 hours away from a market, if their market wasn’t being hit, would not travel to see an act live. Or how you said that no one knows just how many people will attend an event for sure, etc., etc., etc. And we both know that’s not true.

On the first UK/European leg of the A Bigger Bang tour :

The Stones had NO “strategically scheduled” shows in England or Scotland. They also had TWO Spanish shows initially scheduled but for whatever reason they were cancelled (though FOUR Spanish shows were performed on the second UK/European leg in 2007). YOU CONVENIENTLY DID NOT MENTION THESE SHOWS. So the Portugal show wasn’t “strategically scheduled”. Not playing the Easter Block of Europe at that point in time, doesn’t mean a thing regarding meeting or not meeting demand. So I have NO idea why you would argue that, apart from TRYING TO BLUR THE LINES. Also, The Stones played in Switzerland too, which diminishes your argument of “strategically scheduling” in Italy.

I have NO idea why you’re comparing the portions of the first North American legs of the 360 & A Bigger Bang tours, as it proves NOTHING, since there was NOT ONE “strategically scheduled” show on the first leg of the A Bigger Bang tour.

The Vertigo tour WAS NOT heavily underbooked because the way virtually the WHOLE 360 tour is “strategically scheduled” PROVES THAT IT WAS NOT. ANYONE who doesn’t even study the concert business can see that.

But since you keep asking for a quote, here’s a chance for interference’s to see just how full of it you really are:

UKMIX - Forums - Chart Analysis - Rolling Stones top U2 - top grossing tour (page 2)

All one has to do is read this thread beginning at page 2. There are SEVERAL interesting quotes in this thread from Maloil / STING 2 but here’s just ONE posted on December 2, 2006 at 10:33am:

“U2 have not met the demand in for them in virtually all of the regions they have played so far on tour.”

Virtually the WHOLE 360 tour IS “strategically scheduled” . And that fact that you’re trying to deny that is HUGELY funny. We can go over ANY market you want. Just let me know. Also, I NEVER said that even if the 360 tour grosses $1 Billion that it wouldn’t top The Stones. If it grossed that, of course it would. If it grossed $800 million, it would too.

The Stones don’t need to “strategically schedule” an ENTIRE tour like U2 now does. Why? BECAUSE THE STONES ARE A LARGER DRAW THAN U2 IS. GET IT?

Again, you could only claim A HANDFUL OF MARKETS at best where the first UK/European leg of the A Bigger Bang tour was “strategically scheduled“. Whereas virtually the WHOLE 360 tour IS.

GET THAT THROUGH YOUR HEAD.

ANYONE who’s studied the concert business knows that a select set of formulas are utilized to determine what concert demand will be for any given artist.


WHO ARE YOU TRYING TO FOOL?

So, if U2 successfully grosses $800 million on the 360 tour, which is possible if they add the smaller third Euro leg which has been rumored about, will you admit, as you do above, that U2 has TOPPED the Rolling Stones?

Remember, this is a post from July 22, 2009 when HOW U2 was touring was KNOWN as well as what type of opening acts they were using. So knowing that U2 was "strategically scheduling" their tour, and using certain opening acts, you stated that

Also, I NEVER said that even if the 360 tour grosses $1 Billion that it wouldn’t top The Stones. If it grossed that, of course it would. If it grossed $800 million, it would too.

There is also nothing in the post or qoute that states that figure for U2 topping the Stones was contigent on U2 only playing 90 to 100 shows.

Lets not forget the Stones played nearly 150 shows on their last tour in an aggressive attempt to squeeze every last drop of money out of the buying public. The Stones had the benefit of playing Arena and theater shows in order to add to their gross. U2 by contrast is ONLY PLAYING STADIUMS IN 360 on this tour.

 

[Maoilbheannacht]

By show 100, when the tour hits Nashville, the 360 tour's ticket sales gross will hit $660 million, U2's will hit $600 million. By show 110, the 360 tour's ticket sales gross will hit $720 million, U2's will hit $650 million.

...

Given the following opening acts on the Rolling Stones A Bigger Bang Tour, how would you adjust the gross for the Rolling Stones?

Opening acts on the a Bigger Bang Tour:

Kanye West, Alice cooper, Our Lady Peace, John Mayer, Black Eyed Peas, Pearl Jam, Smashing Pumpkins, Alanis Morissette, Motley Crue, Metallica, Bonnie Raitt, Nickelback!


So what would the Rolling Stones gross on a Bigger Bang be without those opening acts?

 

[Maoilbheannacht]

Here is a comparison of the U2 360 tour, which is not over yet, with the entire Rolling Stones A Bigger Bang Tour:

U2 360 TOUR: TOTAL STATS TO DATE

GROSS: $519,599,484
ATTENDANCE: 5,051,275
Average Gross: $6,661,532
Average Attendance: 64,760
Average Ticket Price: $102.87
Shows: 78
Sellouts: 78



The Rolling Stones A BIGGER BANG TOUR:

GROSS: $558,255,524
ATTENDANCE: 4,680,000
Average Gross: $3,903,885
Average Attendance: 32,727
Average Ticket Price: $119.29
Shows: 143

Some important facts to consider:

Notice that U2's average attendance is nearly DOUBLE that of the Stones on a Bigger Bang!

Notice that U2's average gross is MORE than 70% higher than the average gross the Rolling Stones had on A Bigger Bang.

Also notice that with only 78 shows so far, U2 has already surpassed the Rolling Stones attendance for their 143 show A Bigger Bang Tour!

U2's attendance on 360, passed the Stones A Bigger Bang Attendance, with U2's 73thrd show of the tour which was the first night in Sydney Australia. So with only half as many shows at that point, U2's attendance on 360 had already defeated the Stones on A Bigger Bang.

If U2s 360 finishes with 110 shows, or 120-125 if a third leg of Europe was added, there would still clearly be enough demand for some U2 ARENA and THEATER shows around the world which the Stones would do, but U2 won't on this tour since it does not fit the theme of the tour. That is a fact that everyone, including MOGGIO must consider!

 

[Maoilbheannacht]

Also and again, only about half of the 360 tour shows have been and/or will be truly "sold out." This is because once you analyze the capacities listed for many of the shows, you'll find the attendances were/are below what the actual overall stadium capacities really are.

...[/B]

Yet, the Rolling Stones FAILED to sellout ANY stadiums on the A Bigger Bang Tour in Europe, and they were using a 270 configeration! LOL

In fact, how many stadium shows did the Rolling Stones play on a Bigger Bang where the stadium was completely soldout in the 270 configeration?

 

[Moggio]

Muse played THREE arena shows in Metro NYC last year, not one. And they are a consistent level A arena draw worldwide and can even headline STADIUMS in certain markets.

The Black Eyed Peas are mainly a level A arena draw. And their draw in Vegas and LA does count for contribution to the 360 tour ticket sales gross. And it's laughable to say otherwise, especially since they're considering performing headlining STADIUM dates in some major markets this year.

Jay Z is a level A arena draw worldwide (one of the few hip-hop acts that can sell hundreds of thousands of tickets per tour). He was announced as the opener for the Australian/New Zealand leg of the 360 tour BEFORE tickets went on sale. This was needed since almost none of those shows were "sold out."

The Fray are a consistent level A arena draw worldwide.

Interpol and Snow Patrol are level B theatre / mid-level A arena draws in North America and level A arena draws overseas.

Kaiser Chiefs are a level A arena draw overseas.

Lenny Kravitz is a level B theatre / mid-level A arena draw in North America and a level A arena draw overseas.

You'd have to subtract nearly the same amount from the A Bigger Bang tour as you would from the 360 tour because of the Stones' choice of openers. There's no doubt about that.

ALSO AND AGAIN, only about half of the 360 tour shows have been and/or will be truly "sold out." This is because once you analyze the capacities listed for many of the shows, you'll find the attendances were/are below what the actual overall stadium capacities really are.

CosmoKramer STILL can't understand my quotes correctly and STILL thinks I included U2's openers in the overall 360 tour gross total when I made my predictions regarding the first leg of the tour, or any leg for that matter, a few years back, despite that I actually didn't at the time. Oh and it was Paul McGuinness that stated U2 were only going to do 90-100 shows on the 360 tour. That's where I got the 90-100 shows from initially.

And Maoil, is STILL being Maoil by manipulating, lying and BS'ing...

 

[Maoilbheannacht]

You'd have to subtract nearly the same amount from the A Bigger Bang tour as you would from the 360 tour because of the Stones' choice of openers. There's no doubt about that.

MOGGIO,

Thank you for answering my question about how much you would substract from the Stones on a Bigger Bang because of the tour openers.


I would like to know though if you are still sticking by this statement that you made on July 22, 2009?

Also, I NEVER said that even if the 360 tour grosses $1 Billion that it wouldn’t top The Stones. If it grossed that, of course it would. If it grossed $800 million, it would too.

http://www.u2interference.com/forum...uts-attendance-other-statistics-199248-9.html

 

[roy keane]

Moggio has lost it. Again.

 

[Maoilbheannacht]

The Reason Why The Stones can't do a 360 stadium tour

The Reason Why the Stones Can't do a 360 stadium tour

Even if the Stones do a stadium tour again, it won't be in the 360 format that U2 are doing.

The reason for this is the continued decline in average attendance at Rolling Stones stadium shows since Steel Wheels and Voodoo Lounge tours from 1989 and 1994 respectively.

To do a 360 stadium show properly, you need to be able to fill nearly all of the seats in the stadium, even the ones on the side and in the back that don't get used in the standard 270 configeration.

U2 have averaged 64,760 per night on the 360 tour, and while not all of these shows are technical sellouts, nearly all of them look relatively full.

By contrast, on the Stones last tour for a Bigger Bang which had stadium shows in the 270 configeration, the vast majority of the Stones stadium shows FAILED to sellout in that configeration.

1. # of Stones Stadium shows with attendance at 60,000 or above on the A Bigger Bang Tour: 7

2. # of Stones Stadium shows with attendance at 50,000 to 60,000 on the A Bigger Bang Tour: 15

3. The Stones average attendance for their Stadium shows on A Bigger Bang was only around 40,000 to 45,000.


While U2 will be filling stadiums, in 360, in both Utah and Colorado, the Stones were unable to sellout arena's in both these states in a 270 configeration! Take a look:

November 22, 2005
Salt Lake City Utah
Delta Center
GROSS: $1,854,465
ATTENDANCE: 13,897
CAPACITY: 14,731
SHOWS: 1
SELLOUTS: 0
Average Ticket Price: $133.44

November 24, 2005
Denver Colorado
Pepsi Center
GROSS: $2,707,590
ATTENDANCE: 15,091
CAPACITY: 15,385
SHOWS: 1
SELLOUTS: 0
Average Ticket Price: $179.42


I think it is safe to say that it is unlikely that Colorado or Utah will be seeing the Stones play a stadium there again in a 270 configeration let alone a 360 configeration given that they FAILED to sellout much smaller arena's in both states.

 

[hedge]

Moggio

 

[Moggio]

 

[cathalmc]

U2 360 TOUR: TOTAL STATS TO DATE

Shows: 78
Sellouts: 78

I'm sure people following this thread have probably had this debate already, so excuse me if this is an old argument. But is somebody in Live Nation claiming ALL the U2 shows were sold out? That's obviously false, and not just because people with tickets didn't show up.

 

[hedge]

I'm sure people following this thread have probably had this debate already, so excuse me if this is an old argument. But is somebody in Live Nation claiming ALL the U2 shows were sold out? That's obviously false, and not just because people with tickets didn't show up.

Oh Cathal man. we've had this argument/analysis many times.
where have you been????

or sorry, you've been going to all the shows yourself!

single handedly making sure that the U2 360 tour becomes the highest grossing of all time!

Yes - LN are claiming a 100% sellout of all the dates so far. We all know that there could have been more folk in the stadiums at some of the shows. The promoters argument is that if all tickets that were put on sale were sold - then its a sellout. Regardless of whether that is 60,000 in a 70,000 capactiy stadium or 69999.

It is a standard industry practice for these to be declared "sell-outs". All touring set-ups will have a slightly different (or in the case of 360 a massively different) agreed maximum allowed tickets for sale in any one particular venue. For example - seats on the pitch, pitch standing, seats sold behind the stage, seats sold with "restricted view". So it is very difficult to say that Wembley Stadium, for example, should have a capacity of 80,000 for a concert.

Its a bit of a smoke and mirrors trick too - by acts appearing to sellout a venue it is seen to increase demand in that town for that acts next tour.

 

[robbrecon72]

According to USA Today by the time the 360 tour wraps up in North America it will have grossed $717 million dollars and sold 7.1 million tickets. These numbers will be slightly higher considering they are still selling tickets. This also means that the South American leg and North American leg this year will gross at least $198 million dollars and sold 2,048,725 tickets!!! Amazing as usual.

Stadium concerts - USATODAY.com Photos

 

[spookyz]

This one is especially for Moggio and Maoli...
Does anyone have figures for these tours:

Rolling Stones
Steel Wheels Tour 1989-1990
Gross: ???
Attendance: ???
Shows: 115
Average Gross: ???
Average Attendance: ???
Average Ticket Price: ???

Pink Floyd
Division Bell Tour 1994
Gross: ???
Attendance: ???
Shows: 110
Average Gross: ???
Average Attendance: ???
Average Ticket Price: ???

Guns'N'Roses
Use Your Illusion Tour 1991-1993
Gross: ???
Attendance: ???
Shows: 192
Average Gross: ???
Average Attendance: ???
Average Ticket Price: ???

These tours were huge. I know that Amusement Business have not reported any boxscores outside North America before 1995, so there won't be any exact figures. But I know that there are some estimations. I heard Steel Wheels and Divion Bell both grossed about $170 million in total. Is there any source for that? And what about total attendance for these tours?
The only thing I found for the Use Your Illusion Tour is a total attendance of 7 million (I guess this includes the Guns'N'Roses/Metallica Stadium Tour dates as well). How accurate is this number? That would be the highest attended tour ever with only U2360° having a good chance to beat it. I didn't find anything about total gross though. How much could this tour have grossed?

 

[Moggio]

This one is especially for Moggio and Maoli...
Does anyone have figures for these tours:

Rolling Stones
Steel Wheels Tour 1989-1990
Gross: ???
Attendance: ???
Shows: 115
Average Gross: ???
Average Attendance: ???
Average Ticket Price: ???

Pink Floyd
Division Bell Tour 1994
Gross: ???
Attendance: ???
Shows: 110
Average Gross: ???
Average Attendance: ???
Average Ticket Price: ???

Guns'N'Roses
Use Your Illusion Tour 1991-1993
Gross: ???
Attendance: ???
Shows: 192
Average Gross: ???
Average Attendance: ???
Average Ticket Price: ???

These tours were huge. I know that Amusement Business have not reported any boxscores outside North America before 1995, so there won't be any exact figures. But I know that there are some estimations. I heard Steel Wheels and Divion Bell both grossed about $170 million in total. Is there any source for that? And what about total attendance for these tours?
The only thing I found for the Use Your Illusion Tour is a total attendance of 7 million (I guess this includes the Guns'N'Roses/Metallica Stadium Tour dates as well). How accurate is this number? That would be the highest attended tour ever with only U2360° having a good chance to beat it. I didn't find anything about total gross though. How much could this tour have grossed?

Here are my estimates:

Rolling Stones
Steel Wheels / Urban Jungle Tour 1989-1990
Gross: $189 million
Attendance: 6.3 million
Shows: 115
Average Gross: $1,643,478
Average Attendance: 54,783
Average Ticket Price: $30

Pink Floyd
Division Bell Tour 1994
Gross: $183.978 million
Attendance: 5.4 million
Shows: 110
Average Gross: $1,672,527
Average Attendance: 49,091
Average Ticket Price: $34.07 (the actual North American leg average price)

Guns N' Roses
Use Your Illusion Tour 1991-1993
Gross: $125 million
Attendance: 6.5 million
Shows: 192
Average Gross: $651,042
Average Attendance: 33,854
Average Ticket Price: $19.23



Another tour that should be added to the list is Roger Waters' current The Wall Live. Last year, the North American leg grossed $89.5 million from 56 shows. And this year's UK/European leg will gross a similar figure. There's also talk of potential shows in Australia and South America for the fall...and even a possible second North American leg for 2012. By the end of it, The Wall Live should easily gross over $200 million worldwide...

 

[fedeu2]

Here are my estimates:

Rolling Stones
Steel Wheels / Urban Jungle Tour 1989-1990
Gross: $189 million
Attendance: 6.3 million
Shows: 115
Average Gross: $1,643,478
Average Attendance: 54,783
Average Ticket Price: $30

Pink Floyd
Division Bell Tour 1994
Gross: $183.978 million
Attendance: 5.4 million
Shows: 110
Average Gross: $1,672,527
Average Attendance: 49,091
Average Ticket Price: $34.07 (the actual North American leg average price)

Guns N' Roses
Use Your Illusion Tour 1991-1993
Gross: $125 million
Attendance: 6.5 million
Shows: 192
Average Gross: $651,042
Average Attendance: 33,854
Average Ticket Price: $19.23



Another tour that should be added to the list is Roger Waters' current The Wall Live. Last year, the North American leg grossed $89.5 million from 56 shows. And this year's UK/European leg will gross a similar figure. There's also talk of potential shows in Australia and South America for the fall...and even a possible second North American leg for 2012. By the end of it, The Wall Live should easily gross over $200 million worldwide...

The attendance estimate for the Use your illusion tour must be wrong. Its common knowledge that the all time record is held by the Voodoo Lounge tour with 6.45 M. Obviously this record will be smashed by U2 sometime during the upcoming US leg of their 360 tour.
Also, the estimation for the Steel wheels tour seems a bit too high.

 

[Moggio]

The attendance estimate for the Use your illusion tour must be wrong. Its common knowledge that the all time record is held by the Voodoo Lounge tour with 6.45 M.

Actually, my 6.5 million estimate is conservative compared to several reports stating that the Use Your Illusion tour sold 7 million tickets. But regardless, it had to have been at least 6.5 million.

Obviously this record will be smashed by U2 sometime during the upcoming US leg of their 360 tour.

It will probably be broken, but it won't be "smashed." I don't considering selling 7.1 million tickets a huge difference from selling 6.5 million tickets. Not to mention, you'd have to subtract the 360 tour's 7.1 million attendance to roughly 6.4 million, if you want to find out how many tickets U2 sold because of their openers...