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Old 07-18-2009, 12:27 AM   #91
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In fact, the combination of overall album sales & inflation since the end of their record-breaking $558 million grossing, '05-'07 A Bigger Bang tour, pushes that total close to $650 million today...and will be roughly $700 million by the end of their next tour in 2011...
Unless inflation goes up in the next few years, $558 million will only equal about $650 million in 2011.
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Old 07-18-2009, 02:22 AM   #92
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It is important to remember that U2 is touring in the middle of a global financial crisis, so the results of U2360 are even more impressive.
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Old 07-18-2009, 12:33 PM   #93
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No it won't. Because when The Stones hit the road again in 2010, they'll break their own tour gross record, just like THEY ALWAYS DO.

In fact, the combination of overall album sales & inflation since the end of their record-breaking $558 million grossing, '05-'07 A Bigger Bang tour, pushes that total close to $650 million today...and will be roughly $700 million by the end of their next tour in 2011...

The difficulty the Rolling Stones face for their next tour and topping U2 is that if they can't increase their attendance, 4,680,000 on the last tour, then their only option will be to substantially increase their ticket prices, perhaps by roughly 50% over what they charged last time, BUT not suffer any decrease in attendance because of the higher prices. This means outside the USA/Canada increasing the average price from $105 dollars to $160 dollars. In the USA/Canada, this would mean increasing the average ticket price from $136 dollars to $210 dollars. Outside the USA/Canada, having an average ticket price of $105 dollars meant they were only able to attract an average of 39,000 people per show on the last tour. It seems that $160 dollar ticket price, especially under the current economic conditions, would decrease average attendance.

In the United States, while the Rolling Stones could certainly sellout arena's at $210 dollars a ticket, selling out multiple stadiums at $210 dollars a ticket seems rather unlikely.

The U2 360 tour will be achieving much of its increased gross over the last tour, not because of increased ticket prices, but because of increased attendance. The projections are for a $600 million to $750 million gross, with 6 million to 7 million in attendance. Essentially, U2 is nearly doubling the gross they made on the last tour by increasing the attendance level by 50%. Average attendance per show is making a dramatic increase on U2 360 over the Vertigo Tour. It will in fact have both the highest average attendance and highest average gross of any U2 tour ever, and probably any tour ever. By contrast, the Stones average attendance per show seems to have steadily decreased each tour since 1989.


If the Stones were able to increase their ticket prices by 50% without any decrease in attendance, then they would gross roughly $850 million on the next tour, about 13% more than some of the maximum projections for U2 360. The problem for the Stones is that attendance is likely to decrease, with such a price increase based on what has been happening on Stones tours since 1989. A 50% increase in price over the last tour may result in a 15% or more decrease in attendance. If the decrease in attendance was just 15%, it would lead to a gross of just $720 million instead of $850 million, which may be too little to surpass U2 360.
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Old 07-18-2009, 12:41 PM   #94
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Maoil, I'm curious, what are your 15 or 20 favorite bands ever?

Sorry for the off-topic, but I wanted to know.
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Old 07-18-2009, 12:44 PM   #95
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The ONLY way the Stones will increase attendance is by officially announcing that this is "THE FINAL CHANCE EVER TO SEE THE ROLLING STONES". I know I'd like go see them next time and probably bring my wife and maybe another couple or something. That's 4 more people that didn't see them last tour. I've heard the Stones are planning on a tour going from 2010 - 2012, ending on the 50th anniversary of their first gig.

Bottom line: If the Stones play enough gigs over the course of 2010 - 2012, increase ticket prices, and advertise that it is their farewell tour... then yes, I believe they will out-gross U2 one last time.
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Old 07-18-2009, 01:12 PM   #96
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The ONLY way the Stones will increase attendance is by officially announcing that this is "THE FINAL CHANCE EVER TO SEE THE ROLLING STONES". I know I'd like go see them next time and probably bring my wife and maybe another couple or something. That's 4 more people that didn't see them last tour. I've heard the Stones are planning on a tour going from 2010 - 2012, ending on the 50th anniversary of their first gig.

Bottom line: If the Stones play enough gigs over the course of 2010 - 2012, increase ticket prices, and advertise that it is their farewell tour... then yes, I believe they will out-gross U2 one last time.
I agree. Announcing it as the last tour would help them increase attendance while also increasing ticket prices at the same time.

Do you have a source for the Stones next tour ending on the 50th anniversary of their first gig?
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Old 07-18-2009, 04:41 PM   #97
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Maloil conveniently doesn’t want to repost my posts from the UK Chart Mix Forum because they show that AC/DC is a larger than U2 is in several markets worldwide. BIG SURPRISE.

Let’s not forget that AC/DC last toured in 2001, not 2000.

And AGAIN FOR THE THIRD TIME NOW, the reason why AC/DC haven't sold out the few stadiums shows that they scheduled in the US this summer, is because they've ALREADY PLAYED the NYC and Boston metro areas...and hence are returning to these markets again. This is called a return engagement. And it's common knowledge that when an artist returns to the same metro area on any given tour, they're going to draw less than their first stop there, unless demand hasn't been met. This return OBVIOUSLY happened on the Black Ice tour, 8-9 months later - which is not nearly a year later. Also, how many shows they performed doesn’t really matter because the fact is they ALREADY PLAYED the NYC & Boston metro areas. And all that happens when you lower the prices, is that the attendances increase, not the GROSS.

The FACT is that the Rolling Stones are a HIGHER GROSSING act than U2 are, regardless of the nitpicking involved with individual markets.

The Rolling Stones DID NOT utilize the same strategy on the North American legs of their A Bigger Bang tour that U2 is now utilizing in order to enhance concert demand WORLDWIDE.

Concerts are NEVER “technically” sold out but can be “officially” sold out. There are ALWAYS tickets available, if you know where to look.

EVERYONE here who’s read Maloil / STING 2’s posts over the course of the past four or five years KNOWS that he said that the ENTIRE Vertigo tour was heavily underbooked. But of course, judging by the strategically scheduled 360 tour, this only shows to be true in the case of A HANDFUL OF MARKETS.

The combination of overall album sales AND inflation (and not just inflation) since the end of their record-breaking $558 million grossing, '05-'07 A Bigger Bang tour, pushes that total close to $650 million today...and will be roughly $700 million by the end of their next tour in 2011.

ANYONE who thinks U2 will gross more than $600 million on their 360 tour (based on 90-100 shows AND ONLY because of strategic scheduling), is completely out to lunch.

There is NO reason to believe that the next Stones tour will not eclipse their previous tours, in terms of GROSS. The Rolling Stones are a HIGHER GROSSING act than U2 are…and WILL ALWAYS BE, unless The Stones either quit or die… PERIOD.



But let’s go over a few stats, AGAIN, shall we:


The Rolling Stones:

’89’-90 Steel Wheels / Urban Jungle Tour…$170 million

‘94-’95 Voodoo Lounge Tour…$319 million

‘97-’99 Bridges To Babylon / No Security Tour…$339 million

‘02-’03 Licks Tour…$300 million (grossed slightly less than their previous tour because less shows were played in comparison)

‘05-'07 A Bigger Bang Tour…$558 million


U2:

‘92-’93 ZOO TV Tour…$167 million

‘97-’98 PopMart Tour…$172 million

‘01 Elevation Tour…$143 million

‘05-’06 Vertigo Tour…$389 million



G’night!
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Old 07-18-2009, 04:52 PM   #98
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It is important to remember that U2 is touring in the middle of a global financial crisis, so the results of U2360 are even more impressive.
Nope. Because if you have studied the concert business, you'd see that for the vast majority of MAJOR artists, concert demand is virtually recession proof. However, that's unless, for example, an individual market's jobless rate is extremely high, like Detroit's. This is why U2 aren't playing Detroit this year...


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Old 07-18-2009, 05:16 PM   #99
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Moggio no offence but if you guys are arguing about the same thing on another board why are you doing it here too?
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Old 07-18-2009, 05:27 PM   #100
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Moggio no offence but if you guys are arguing about the same thing on another board why are you doing it here too?
That's a question you should ask Maloil because all I'm doing is responding to his nonsense. You see, if his nonsense stopped, then my responses would too.
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Old 07-18-2009, 06:21 PM   #101
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The Rolling Stones DID NOT utilize the same strategy on the North American legs of their A Bigger Bang tour that U2 is now utilizing in order to enhance concert demand WORLDWIDE.
So now your trying to claim that Michael Cohl and Live Nation did a diservice to the Rolling Stones by not "strategically scheduling shows in the North American market so as to maximize the amount of money to be made on tour?

While what they did in North America may not be the same, they did space their shows out in North America with multiple legs, and did rather odd things, like high priced arena shows in Philly and DC, and then stadium shows in Charlotesville and Hershey where they had never played before.

More importantly, the Rolling Stones used a mix of arena's and Stadiums and even some theaters, unlike U2 which using stadiums exclusively.

Quote:
EVERYONE here who’s read Maloil / STING 2’s posts over the course of the past four or five years KNOWS that he said that the ENTIRE Vertigo tour was heavily underbooked. But of course, judging by the strategically scheduled 360 tour, this only shows to be true in the case of A HANDFUL OF MARKETS.
Hey, if it was said, you should be able to post a quote, but so far you have not.


Quote:
ANYONE who thinks U2 will gross more than $600 million on their 360 tour (based on 90-100 shows AND ONLY because of strategic scheduling), is completely out to lunch.
Everyone should remember this quote. We can now mark MOGGIO down as predicting the maximum possible gross for U2 360 is $600 million dollars.

Yet, after just 6 shows, U2 have grossed about 10% of that figure. Average gross of the 6 shows reported is over $9,300,000. Average attendance is over 87,000.

While there will likely be several shows in North America that will gross less than $6 million, they will represent a minority on the tour and will be easily balanced out by shows in places like Paris that are grossing $10.5 million per night. The Dublin shows could be as high as $12 million per night, although the 3rd date had lower prices on the upper level.

I suspect will be able to put this prediction of a gross of no more than $600 million in the same group as predicting that there are only going to be 28,000 people at the show in Dallas Texas.
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Old 07-18-2009, 08:20 PM   #102
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The Rolling Stones:

’89’-90 Steel Wheels / Urban Jungle Tour…$170 million

‘94-’95 Voodoo Lounge Tour…$319 million

‘97-’99 Bridges To Babylon / No Security Tour…$339 million

‘02-’03 Licks Tour…$300 million (grossed slightly less than their previous tour because less shows were played in comparison)

‘05-'07 A Bigger Bang Tour…$558 million


U2:

‘92-’93 ZOO TV Tour…$167 million

‘97-’98 PopMart Tour…$172 million

‘01 Elevation Tour…$143 million

‘05-’06 Vertigo Tour…$389 million

G’night!
For comparison purposes, do you have Bruce Springsteen and Madonna's concert grosses during the same time span? I know they both must have grossed boat loads but I am curious, especially since they were in the recent boxscore with huge numbers.
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Old 07-19-2009, 12:29 AM   #103
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My source on the Rolling Stones possible 2010-2012 tour is nothing more than message board rumors on The Rolling Stones Fan Club - It's Only Rock'n Roll. A Stones fan site similar to this, only the forums are not nearly as sophisticated. Though the rumors seem to be strong rumors, they are still rumors. I really hope the Stones do tour once more. I saw them in 1999 and it was great. I missed them on the Licks tour and the Bigger Bang tour because I didn't want to fork out the $ and have regretted it both times.
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Old 07-19-2009, 08:35 PM   #104
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I'd honestly like to know why you think gross is the be all end all measurement of demand for a live act. The Vertigo Tour may be the 2nd highest grossing tour to Bigger Bang, but that tour more shows, had many unsold tickets and had all of 10 shows that weren't in North America or Europe. Vertigo sold every single ticket, had U2 charged the kind of astronomical prices the Stones did, and done a couple more shows that record would likely be theirs. And it very likely will be theirs after next year, without those prices.

And with gross being your definition of the biggest tours, U2 is far ahead of AC/DC so I don't see why this is such an argument.


This thread is about U2 360, not about the Stones or any other band.
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Old 07-20-2009, 11:12 AM   #105
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When speaking of grosses, shouldn't it be mentioned that in the 90s U2 did everything in their power to keep prices down? I was under the impression that they more or less broke even that decade, at least for Popmart. Despite accusations to the contrary, U2 is pretty careful not to whore themselves out (much more so than the RS).
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