Religious discussion in this forum. please read.

[martha]

Actually, seven threads were selectively moved. I guess some points of expression will not be tolerated in here.

This is uncalled for.


I have retyped several lines of pissed off answers, but I deleted them all. All this bitching from the people who want so badly for this forum to be exclusively Christian.

This pisses me off.

 

[bonosloveslave]

We can all shape what we'd like it to become before it becomes a monster like FYM is.

One of those is definitely enough.

I'm sorry if I've been overly defensive or made anyone feel bad in any way.

 

[Elvis]

This is uncalled for.


I have retyped several lines of pissed off answers, but I deleted them all. All this bitching from the people who want so badly for this forum to be exclusively Christian.

This pisses me off.

I'm going to repeat this, in fewer words....

There will NOT be a forum exclusive to Christianity, or any other religion, cult, etc.

 

[Elvis]

Actually, seven threads were selectively moved. I guess some points of expression will not be tolerated in here.

Thank you for trying to point fingers, place blame, and just make absolutely false assumptions.

I just finished moving every other off-forum-topic from the first page.

I think for now, religious threads need to be placed in FYM, just as world events are.

 

[Liesje]

...and what Elvis wants, Elvis gets.

 

[FizzingWhizzbees]

This is one of those threads where my opinion has changed entirely in the course of the discussion.

Initially I thought that it seemed illogical to criticise this forum for its focus on Christianity since the reason for this focus was simply that the majority of posters are Christian. I naively assumed that all the Christian posters would be happy to have more debate and more posts from people of other religions.

Some of the posts in this thread have convinced me the opposite is true. Some posters do appear to want a forum which is exclusively Christian and in which they can "safely" discuss their religion without fear of criticism from people of other religions or even from those whose vision of Christianity differs from their own.

Some of the comments in the spin-off thread (is it okay to quote from a thread that's been closed?) have made me even more convinced of this. A forum to discuss "Church services, prayer, devotions, praise songs" isn't going to be about informed discussion, it's going to be about members of one religion - Christianity - talking exclusively about their religion. And as Elvis said at the start of this thread, Interference wasn't intended to be a place of worship.

As far as I'm concerned, putting all the religious threads in FYM is fine. If people feel unable to accept criticism and discussion of their religious beliefs, then perhaps they would do well to discuss religion elsewhere.

 

[martha]

...and what Elvis wants, Elvis gets.

Because it's HIS board! He owns it, whether you like that or not. You're posting here because you made that choice. You can choose not to, if you don't like the conditions here.

I think Joel has been beyond patient with this whole thing.

 

[BVS]

You dont think, it just may be the topic, and not the actual point of view? I guess it is easy to feel as you do rather than think this is going to happen slowly and more importantly once this particular thread has run it's course and everyone has had their say. But I dont know, I don't know your mind.

~~~

Honestly I'm struggling to find out where all the bitterness and simmering anger is coming from in here. Elvis wished to simply move all religion into one place as this was no longer serving the original purpose. Other issues have arisen from this thread which have been interesting in the least. I cant see how it isn't considered a bad thing when some people have admitted they feel awkward in here, or for whatever reasons are uncomfortable. If this did become a general religion forum, this wouldn't be acceptable. It certainly isn't as it is right now. We can bring up all the comparisons we like, of how some feel this way about FYM for example but we aren't talking about FYM and FYM can't be changed to be less aggressive. It has become defined by the minds of the people who post there and that is something no moderator or admin on the face of this earth can overcome. Religion now, as a topic has now the potential to become a forum everyone can be comfortable in. We can all shape what we'd like it to become before it becomes a monster like FYM is. As for this straying from it's original purpose, again we can bring up other examples of where this has been ok in the past like IO. But this isn't IO.
None of us here wish to censor anyone's views. Either everyone is silenced on it, or we get a bigger shoe which fits everyone. The former will not happen in a million years, and besides no one wishes this. So the latter is our option. How we go about making it happen is where people can offer constructive ideas so we have everyone happy.

Thank you.

No offense, I don't think it's the point of view, I personally didn't find the topics worth posting in.

 

[BVS]

key phrase = "as this [place] was no longer serving the original purpose". Maybe it's the purpose, not the place, that's the issue. I still don't get why it would be so wrong or difficult to change the forum description. Is anyone opposed?

We can't just go around and start redefining every forum because it doesn't suit certain people's needs.

...and what Elvis wants, Elvis gets.

This is uncalled for.

Fizzing, I'm with you. I've grown very dissappointed with the attitude in this forum. I can't believe the finger pointing and the selfishness in here. And there are some that wonder why anyone would feel uncomfortable?!

 

[Elvis]

Originally, when the idea for TGIS came up, and I had discussed it with Sula, I was worried that it would head in this direction.... my worry has been justified.

My decision was purely based on lack of respect, selfishess, ethocentric opinions, ignorance, and discomfort which I've seen throughout this thread.

For those wishing to surround themselves with a purely Chrisitan forum environment, I would suggest visiting http://dir.yahoo.com/Society_and_Cu...nity/Computers_and_Internet/Chats_and_Forums/ which offers plenty of selections.

 

[nbcrusader]

I'm going to repeat this, in fewer words....

There will NOT be a forum exclusive to Christianity, or any other religion, cult, etc.

No one wants it to be exclusively Christian or any other religion, cult, etc. I don't recall anyone making this suggestion.

Unless I am missing some theads, I do not recall any harassment or attacking of non-Christian beliefs.

Elvis - I did not mean to point fingers at anyone - it just seemed odd that for one week, only seven threads were moved. If we caught you in the middle of the process, I apologize.

You have set up a number of forums for non-U2 discussion. Religion seemed to be a natural, if popular, topic for its own forum.

Peace

 

[Elvis]

No one wants it to be exclusively Christian or any other religion, cult, etc. I don't recall anyone making this suggestion.

Unless I am missing some theads, I do not recall any harassment or attacking of non-Christian beliefs.

Elvis - I did not mean to point fingers at anyone - it just seemed odd that for one week, only seven threads were moved. If we caught you in the middle of the process, I apologize.

You have set up a number of forums for non-U2 discussion. Religion seemed to be a natural, if popular, topic for its own forum.

Peace

I appreciate your apology, however religion has a home, and it's not a new one. For now, religion posts/threads will be confined to FYM.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

No one wants it to be exclusively Christian or any other religion, cult, etc. I don't recall anyone making this suggestion.
Unless I am missing some theads, I do not recall any harassment or attacking of non-Christian beliefs.

My feelings exactly. You know what honestly pisses me off-that people want to hold on to their assumptions in spite of what anyone says. And accuse people of things in spite of what those people may say. That's where any "bitterness and simmering anger" that I may be accused of having is coming from. I'm sorry Angela, I don't mean in any way to assume that you were referring to me in those words you said. Honestly, I have no bitterness or anger about this..what I feel about it I'll just keep to myself.

I have decided not to talk about religion in any way, shape, or form on this board. I wish I never had. And as usual, I will simply say nothing when I read a blanket statement, generalization, or any other thing that I feel insults my religious beliefs and/or affiliation.

I wasn't even going to bother, but I'd just like to say that I don't feel that there was any "lack of respect" or "ignorance" in this thread. If anyone feels that there was on my part... oh well, I'm sorry about that, but I expressed myself in the best way that I am able. This is a rather personal topic, and I for one feel that, for the most part, it was discussed in a thoughtful and respectful manner. I say w/ all possible humility that I don't feel I'm ignorant, and honestly it's hurtful to read something like that whether it's directed at a particular person or not.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

I just wanted to ask a question-is using the "rolleyes" smilie when someone expresses a viewpoint based upon his or her religious belief considered acceptable? I have seen people do that. And when does it reach the point that it crosses the line from discussion/debate into being classified as rudeness and/or harassment, which I would think would not be tolerated. I guess that's judged on a case by case basis, but I am honestly just asking a question.

 

[bonosloveslave]

I have decided not to talk about religion in any way, shape, or form on this board. I wish I never had. And as usual, I will simply say nothing when I read a blanket statement, generalization, or any other thing that I feel insults my religious beliefs and/or affiliation.

This really saddens me that you feel the need for self-censorship in this regard. It shouldn't be like this, but I know how you feel.

I guess keeping eveything in FYM is the best way to limit religious discussion, rather than encourage it.

 

[Elvis]

I just wanted to ask a question-is using the "rolleyes" smilie when someone expresses a viewpoint based upon his or her religious belief considered acceptable? I have seen people do that. And when does it reach the point that it crosses the line from discussion/debate into being classified as rudeness and/or harassment, which I would think would not be tolerated. I guess that's judged on a case by case basis, but I am honestly just asking a question.

Harass
1 a : EXHAUST, FATIGUE b : to annoy persistently
2 : to worry and impede by repeated raids <harassed the enemy>

If you feel that someone is harassing you, contact a mod... or if you choose, the person directly.

 

[BVS]

I guess keeping eveything in FYM is the best way to limit religious discussion, rather than encourage it.

Yes I'm sure this is the reasoning.

I'm not sure why some are so scared of moving these discussions to the proper forum.

 

[hiphop]

I think that?s a BAD idea Joel.

I?d think twice of writing something spiritual - like done before, check my threads in this forum - in FYM. This forum was always peaceful - or at least it seemed so to me, you may have read more than me. Anyway, FYM is not peaceful.

It?s your board and you can do anything you like. I also think that the Christianprayers threads kind of.. left little place.. for many many views, but often I found good stuff here.

Spirituality and religion: you can reason about it and I like this environment.

To say the truth, nearly anything that has to do with spirituality or religion can be linked to U2. Anyway, I think the original intent of this forum - to discuss those themes related to U2 - could get a little, how you call it, boring? Sorry... we can create 753 threads about what Bono means by singing I still haven?t found what I?m looking for... great

Why all this fuss? If you think of Interference like your "mini-mundus", are you sure you allow enough place for it to develop without your corrections?

I know, I know, I am harsh. Excuse me. Just wanna make you think.

 

[nbcrusader]

I'm not sure why some are so scared of moving these discussions to the proper forum.

Or why some were so scared to leave GIS as it evolved.

BVS - earlier you complained that when you questioned another forum member's statements, they hid behind the "no debate" language describing this forum. Any chance you have a link to that comment? I only ask because I couldn't find such a statement using the word debate.

In fact, this whole topic came up over two years ago here.

I like what Martha had to say then:

As a non-Christian who lurks here now and again, I find this forum very supportive and open. The other forums for debate are just that, where this one is for discussion and insight.

What changed?

 

[hiphop]

btw, there?s a thread in everything you know is wrong that definitely deserves to be moved here. it?s called spiritual U2 songs or sth like that. hahahahahaha. there, i always do my homework...

 

[martha]

Or why some were so scared to leave GIS as it evolved.

And the paranoia continues.


It wasn't fear; it was exclusion. Which you all have been told before.

 

[BVS]

And the paranoia continues.


It wasn't fear; it was exclusion. Which you all have been told before.

 

[nbcrusader]

It wasn't fear; it was exclusion. Which you all have been told before.

You keep repeating it, but I've not seen one example of how people were shut out.

You have been an active non-Christian in this forum and I personally always enjoyed your questions.

 

[bonosloveslave]

You keep repeating it, but I've not seen one example of how people were shut out.

I wondered about this too.

You have been an active non-Christian in this forum and I personally always enjoyed your questions.

Absolutely

*thanks for your feedback hiphop

 

[Elvis]

...and what Elvis wants, Elvis gets.

Actually... I created THIS forum because people wanted it.

The real problem some people have here, is that they don't like the place on this forum already specified for discussion of religion.... not that there isn't a place to disucss it at all.

With that in mind, I really do not appreciate comments like yours.

 

[bonosloveslave]

I'm curious, why *was* this forum created in the first place? Why the need to have this seperated from EYKIW? I wasn't around when this section was developed.

 

[Elvis]

This thread is being closed... as this forum is not the place for debate on where religion should or should not be discussed, and my original goals of this thread have been met... it no longer serves any purpose.