LP13 Discussion - Rumor Has It: Sirens, iTunes Festival, etc.

[Nick66]

I don't even know what playing a "perfect" show is supposed to mean, especially for a band like U2.

In terms of a rock show, perfect sounds pretty boring to me.

 

[U2DMfan]

I saw several Elevation shows, and continue to think it was one of their best, and most underrated (by fans) tours. While Vertigo may have had better set lists, Elevation more than made up for that in the pure passion and commitment the band brought to that tour. They played like they meant it because they did.

If comparing those two, it's not even close. Personally, I'm not the biggest fan of ATYCLB but I believe the Elevation tour was surely one of the highlights of their entire career. The Vertigo tour was the exact opposite but I'm sure, at least as far as I'm concerned, that had a lot to do with the new music they were supporting. But there was a lot more to it than that - for both tours. Elevation had a certain feeling and Vertigo had the opposite.

I think the song Elevation and Stuck are utter crap and the live version of Walk On pretty damn stale but that didn't drag down the Elevation shows that I have seen. Even songs like New York that I am otherwise ambivalent about were energetic and just seemed to...work. Great show.

Vertigo seemed to be a little bit of the worst of everything. From the ruined Streets intro to the idiocy of playing Vertigo twice to the craptacularness of the new music (all of it save for Vertigo, to be honest) and a whole lot in between. I basically wish that period for U2 did not exist. But mostly it's about that album. An album I can't even force myself to enjoy. All that said, I enjoyed setlist gems like An Cat Dubh and Electric Co. and the like. The version of Wild Horses they played was pretty freaking cool too.

 

[corianderstem]

I'd love it if the tour really did start in Vancouver. I've seen a tour's final show, and I'd love to see an opening show, just for shits and giggles. It's driving distance for me, and as of right now, I'm not planning on doing any travel for the tour, outside of the west coast.

So yay. I like this rumor, so I'm going to choose to believe it. You know, for shits and giggles.

 

[U2DMfan]

The Vertigo version of Zoo Station always had something off about it anyway, even after Bono remembered the lyrics. It lacked the punch of ZooTV, mostly because Larry's drumming got really lazy. I also think they turned the bass down for some reason, which didn't help.

That's exactly right.

There is a whole lot wrong with both that version and The Fly on that tour.

I could get into a detailed musical dissertation about it but I don't see the point...the short of it is - it was gutted. No drive. It sounded like U2-lite, which is precisely what that whole tour was. Inoffensive and easily digestible. Even the Bullet the Blue sky thing, supposedly the 'controversial' part of the show...start with the abysmal reinvention of that song, the putrid theatrics...it slogged along. It was waste of time to even try and present those songs in a different form because they had coveted the poppy singles audience that just wanted to hear 'hits'. You saw this problem truly rear its head 4 years later with the reception to good new material like NLOTH (title track) or whatever. Or even the lukewarm reception to Zooropa when they broke that out. They've amassed a bunch of fans that don't want to hear that 'weird' shit, and this started on that horrible tour.

But also, fundamentally, the truth is, it was not the same kind of band performing those songs. U2 wrote Zoo Station as a creative piece. It doesn't have some definitive discernible hook. It's mostly based around a drone. It has a lot of atmosphere and it was never destined to be a 'single'. Today, they would barely write a song that couldn't at least be considered as a single. They are not the same band in that regard. Maybe that has changed and we shall certainly see. I'm not counting on anything different, personally.

 

[rennowba]

Sometimes when the band cock up it adds to the live experience i think

 

[ClaytonsKitten]

Yeah Vancouver's not an option for us, being more towards East Coast, but tour rumors are certainly a good sign. I'm kinda hoping they do a Toronto show at least once...after getting to see the tribute band Elevation (as well as hang out with them pre-show), I'd love to visit Toronto, and it would be even better if I could toss a U2 show into that mix!

It's not as if they're gonna play Ohio. Not unless they're doing arenas. Then we'll get them in Cleveland and probably Cincy and/or Columbus.

 

[prbiker15]

Sometimes when the band cock up it adds to the live experience i think

Yeah I agree.

 

[Blue Room]

I was at the second Popmart show in San Diego, and thought it was a mess, and not simply because the band was sloppy. Though I know they improved on that tour significantly.

I was also at the first Elevation show in Ft. Lauderdale, which IMO was amazing. There were probably a lot of mistakes but none of us really noticed, it was just great to have U2 back playing a scaled down show that sounded and looked just like four guys making music. I saw several Elevation shows, and continue to think it was one of their best, and most underrated (by fans) tours. While Vertigo may have had better set lists, Elevation more than made up for that in the pure passion and commitment the band brought to that tour. They played like they meant it because they did.

Honestly, both tours were excellent to me. They both had different "vibes" but I do not get the "U2 playing live = bad/negative thing" perspective. I saw a lot of shows on BOTH tours and there were some shows on each that were outstanding and some that were mediocre. It more of each show for me, not necessarily each tour. I thought NLOTH was a terrible album, but the 360 tour was a good one.

 

[ClaytonsKitten]

Having seen 360 on BOTH the NA legs, I can say without a doubt that the 2nd NA leg (with more AB/older material as opposed to the NLOTH songs) was infinitely better. It was truly ZooTV 2.0 and that was what made me love it even more than the first set of 360 shows.

 

[digitize]

That's exactly right.



There is a whole lot wrong with both that version and The Fly on that tour.



I could get into a detailed musical dissertation about it but I don't see the point...the short of it is - it was gutted. No drive. It sounded like U2-lite, which is precisely what that whole tour was. Inoffensive and easily digestible. Even the Bullet the Blue sky thing, supposedly the 'controversial' part of the show...start with the abysmal reinvention of that song, the putrid theatrics...it slogged along. It was waste of time to even try and present those songs in a different form because they had coveted the poppy singles audience that just wanted to hear 'hits'. You saw this problem truly rear its head 4 years later with the reception to good new material like NLOTH (title track) or whatever. Or even the lukewarm reception to Zooropa when they broke that out. They've amassed a bunch of fans that don't want to hear that 'weird' shit, and this started on that horrible tour.



But also, fundamentally, the truth is, it was not the same kind of band performing those songs. U2 wrote Zoo Station as a creative piece. It doesn't have some definitive discernible hook. It's mostly based around a drone. It has a lot of atmosphere and it was never destined to be a 'single'. Today, they would barely write a song that couldn't at least be considered as a single. They are not the same band in that regard. Maybe that has changed and we shall certainly see. I'm not counting on anything different, personally.

I very strongly disagree with your assessment of the Vertigo Tour. I find many Bomb songs to be great live, and all were improvements over their album versions. The great deal of rare material that was played was played consistently well. But some of the classics (Streets, Pride, One, WOWY, BTBS, and SBS are all guilty) weren't too good.


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[Nick66]

There is a whole lot wrong with both that version and The Fly on that tour.

I could get into a detailed musical dissertation about it but I don't see the point...the short of it is - it was gutted. No drive. It sounded like U2-lite, which is precisely what that whole tour was. Inoffensive and easily digestible. Even the Bullet the Blue sky thing, supposedly the 'controversial' part of the show...start with the abysmal reinvention of that song, the putrid theatrics...it slogged along. It was waste of time to even try and present those songs in a different form because they had coveted the poppy singles audience that just wanted to hear 'hits'. You saw this problem truly rear its head 4 years later with the reception to good new material like NLOTH (title track) or whatever. Or even the lukewarm reception to Zooropa when they broke that out. They've amassed a bunch of fans that don't want to hear that 'weird' shit, and this started on that horrible tour.

But also, fundamentally, the truth is, it was not the same kind of band performing those songs. U2 wrote Zoo Station as a creative piece. It doesn't have some definitive discernible hook. It's mostly based around a drone. It has a lot of atmosphere and it was never destined to be a 'single'. Today, they would barely write a song that couldn't at least be considered as a single. They are not the same band in that regard. Maybe that has changed and we shall certainly see. I'm not counting on anything different, personally.

Agree completely...both with your general comments about the Vertigo tour and Zoo Station particularly. IMO it's arguably their best song of the 90's (and in one way their first). I was so looking forward to hearing it again live, and...what a disappointment. This noisy, industrial, beautiful sonic brick of a song was turned into something hollow, flat and lifeless. I can't even stomach to listen to it.

They also turned Streets into a fiasco, though absent the flags I believe it's largely a similar arrangement as Elevation, but without that versions incredible acceleration and purpose (Streets Boston is probably my favourite version of that song).

Mostly my problem with the Vertigo tour is the same as my problem with the record...they sound like they're bored and on cruise control. It's still live U2, and average live U2 is still pretty damn good (better than most anyone else), but hardly the transcendent concert experience their capable of. That said, I'm sure many people have had great experiences of the Vertigo tour, and I think to a large extent how we remember these shows is a lot like travelling...it's more about how we felt during the experience, where we were in our lives, etc., than the quality of the show itself.

 

[prbiker15]

I very strongly disagree with your assessment of the Vertigo Tour. I find many Bomb songs to be great live, and all were improvements over their album versions. The great deal of rare material that was played was played consistently well. But some of the classics (Streets, Pride, One, WOWY, BTBS, and SBS are all guilty) weren't too good.


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Yeah, I found the classics to be lackluster for the Vertigo Tour. Everything else, as you mentioned, was fine. Every tour has it's highs and lows.

 

[Hawkmoon269]

Wasn't during the vertigo tour that Edge's daughter was very sick?

 

[The_acrobat]

It's not as if they're gonna play Ohio. Not unless they're doing arenas. Then we'll get them in Cleveland and probably Cincy and/or Columbus.

I still think it's bullshit that Ohio didn't get a 360 show but places like Oklahoma and Charlottesville did. Geographically Cincinnati would've made the most sense, since it's central to many other fairly big cities they didn't play on 360 (Louisville, Lexington, Columbus, Dayton and Indianapolis are all within 2-3 hours away). Columbus has the Ohio State football stadium, which at 100,000+ capacity was WAY too big. Cleveland would've been a good idea too, but maybe they felt it was too close to Pittsburgh and Detroit. They could've easily drawn 50,000+ to any of those 3 cities. Oh well!

I remember in 2001 they did Cleveland, Columbus, Lexington, Pittsburgh and Indianapolis all in the same week. I was in heaven, having plenty of choices (I ended up going to Columbus and Indy). However, Lexington, Columbus and Indianapolis all were among the slow sellers, only selling out because they went to a 270 degree configuration. They didn't return to these 3 cities on Vertigo. Now I think U2 could come into any arena anywhere in the US and sell it out that very day.

I'm hoping we at least get a show in Cleveland, although I'm much closer to Columbus and Cincy.

 

[The_acrobat]

Wasn't during the vertigo tour that Edge's daughter was very sick?

Yes she was. The tour was originally supposed to launch March 1st in Miami, but due to her treatments, they pushed it back to the end of March and had to do a bunch of rerouting.

Then a year later the Australia/New Zealand/Japan/Hawaii shows had to be moved from March-April to Nov-Dec, because of further complications. So sad for a young child to go through that. I assume she's okay now, since we haven't heard anything on the subject since 2006, so that's a good thing!

 

[prbiker15]

Wasn't during the vertigo tour that Edge's daughter was very sick?

Yes. I believe they had to alter the first North American leg before announcing the tour, and then postponed the Oceania/Japan/Hawaii leg.

 

[ClaytonsKitten]

Seeing as how I'm from the Youngstown area, and have family in Cleveland, I can tell you flat out that the Claw would have been problematic in Browns Stadium. One end of the stadium is actually higher than the other, due to it literally being on the lakefront (Lake Erie). They would have had visual problems and not been able to sell entire SECTIONS due to lack of visibility. I've been to a few games there, and it's a great football stadium (shame the team sucks), but it wouldn't have logistically worked for the sheer monster of a stage and setup that the Claw was.

 

[Mrs. Garrison]

Having seen 360 on BOTH the NA legs, I can say without a doubt that the 2nd NA leg (with more AB/older material as opposed to the NLOTH songs) was infinitely better. It was truly ZooTV 2.0 and that was what made me love it even more than the first set of 360 shows.

Agreed. The two shows i saw in 2011 were miles better than the two shows i saw in 2009. Not that any of them were bad shows, its just that the material was much better (AB) and i guess Bono felt better, therefore the band was probably more energetic.

Nashville, July 2011, was the best show of 10 u2 concerts that ive seen. Even better than Dallas in Nov 2001, which is likely my second favorite. Just pure magic without anything on the side to enhance it like other previous shows, stone cold sober this show could not have been any better.

 

[ClaytonsKitten]

Same. Tampa was an amazing show in 2009, but something about E Lansing and then Pittsburgh in 2011.... The material seemed fresh despite the songs nearing 20 yrs in the catalog. The AB material seemed like it was done with more gusto than the NLOTH material, which is sad, in a sense. I love AB and it's always been my favorite, but it's sad that the band didnt have the same gusto or feelings towards the NLOTH songs.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

QUESTION : iTunes Festival London in September ;

If U2 was really set to play at the festival, wouldn't they appear at the TOP as the main attracting Act on the Festival "Poster" already instead of Pharell ? I guess they can still modify it along the way and add it later...

Less than half of the lineup has thus far been named.


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[trevgreg]

Yes she was. The tour was originally supposed to launch March 1st in Miami, but due to her treatments, they pushed it back to the end of March and had to do a bunch of rerouting.

Huh... I actually thought it was supposed to be Boston for the original opening date on the Vertigo tour. I swear I remember Bono or someone else hyping about them opening in an 'Irish' city for the first time, which was also coming on top of their baseball team's World Series win.

 

[CMIS]

I've seen Springsteen and Pearl Jam fuck up songs before and start over or restart.

I've just seen U2 do it more often

Not saying this applies to you in particular, but arent most of us as U2 fans supposed to see them fuck up more than other bands because we see a lot more u2 shows?

Sometimes when the band cock up it adds to the live experience i think

True. They cocked up in the Twickenham 2005 Vertigo show I went to during WGRYWH, or was it Yahweh? I think it was Yahweh, but Bono just stopped it and said 'thats okay, we are all friends here' or something like that, then restarted.

Agree completely...both with your general comments about the Vertigo tour and Zoo Station particularly. IMO it's arguably their best song of the 90's (and in one way their first). I was so looking forward to hearing it again live, and...what a disappointment. This noisy, industrial, beautiful sonic brick of a song was turned into something hollow, flat and lifeless. I can't even stomach to listen to it.

They also turned Streets into a fiasco, though absent the flags I believe it's largely a similar arrangement as Elevation, but without that versions incredible acceleration and purpose (Streets Boston is probably my favourite version of that song).

Mostly my problem with the Vertigo tour is the same as my problem with the record...they sound like they're bored and on cruise control. It's still live U2, and average live U2 is still pretty damn good (better than most anyone else), but hardly the transcendent concert experience their capable of. That said, I'm sure many people have had great experiences of the Vertigo tour, and I think to a large extent how we remember these shows is a lot like travelling...it's more about how we felt during the experience, where we were in our lives, etc., than the quality of the show itself.

Truly agree about the phase of life thing. I also think that once you get a little older you get less excited about things, so the volume of songs that moves or 'blows your mind' decline significantly.

A friend of mine, another long time U2 fan is quite disappointed with U2's last output. But we started listening to u2 in our teens (mid to late 90s) and were so blown away by their back catalogue and current output.

While I agree U2's first two decades are a lot stronger than their third, its not bad. I just feel that I am less impressed by things as I get older.



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[kingofsorrow]

The Tampa Pop Mart show sucked, but not because of the band. it was the sorry ass attendance.
I remember being in the same stadium for Zootv and the place was packed you had no room to stretch your arms out sideways or forwards.
During the pop Mart show I had an entire section to myself.


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[bobsaget77]

The Tampa Pop Mart show sucked, but not because of the band. it was the sorry ass attendance.
I remember being in the same stadium for Zootv and the place was packed you had no room to stretch your arms out sideways or forwards.
During the pop Mart show I had an entire section to myself.


Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

Funny. I just watched part of that concert on youtube the other day. Best version of discotheque I've seen. They put on a heckuva show. But when they zoomed out on the arena, it was empty and everyone was just standing around while U2 were rocking their balls off. I think stuff like that is why the last 15 years have been safe. They stopped taking risks when it got to the point of being humiliated.

 

[ndmaxfield]

I was at both too. The attendance was definitely sucky. Edge even said, "Feel free to spread out." But it was still amazing. ZooTV Tampa had a completely different intimacy. My best show ever, however, was June 2001 at MSG. Unbelievable energy.

 

[The_acrobat]

It's pretty shocking, looking back, that U2's popularity dropped that dramatically in the time between 1993 and 1997, especially in the USA. To go from sold out stadiums to half full (or less) in the same stadiums in just a few short years is amazing. I was a teenager in the mid 90s, and I felt like U2 had a pretty decent profile in the years following Zooropa. HMTMKMKM was pretty popular (it was track 1 on the Batman soundtrack, and as a result had some residual exposure from people who bought it for "Kiss from a Rose"), and everyone was talking about the Mission Impossible Theme that "U2" remixed.

Was the public's reaction to Discotheque and it's music video that bad? I know the first leg of the Popmart tour went on sale before the album was even released, so most people hadn't heard the rest of the album, they just hated Discotheque. I know there was a price increase, most people never dreamed of paying $50+ for concert tickets at that time. Now that sounds wonderful!

I've always been fascinated by Popmart's lack of success. Why were they playing places like Clemson or Jacksonville anyway? Also, why were many of the European shows played in flat fields as opposed to stadiums?

 

[The_acrobat]

Huh... I actually thought it was supposed to be Boston for the original opening date on the Vertigo tour. I swear I remember Bono or someone else hyping about them opening in an 'Irish' city for the first time, which was also coming on top of their baseball team's World Series win.

This is copied from another thread from early 2005.

March
1, 3: Miami - American Airlines Arena
5: Tampa - St Pete Times Arena
7, 8: Atlanta - Philips Arena
10: Hartford - Civic Center
12: Buffalo - HSBC Arena
14 NYC - Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Dinner
16: Philadelphia - Wachovia Center
17, 19, 20: NYC - MSG
23, 24: Montreal - Bell Centre
26, 27: Toronto - Air Canada Centre
29, 31: Boston - Fleet Center

April
1: Boston - Fleet Center
4, 5: East Rutherford - Continental Arena
7, 8, 12, 13: Chicago - United Center
16,17: Denver - Pepsi Center
20, 21: Phoenix - America West
24, 25: Seattle - Key Arena
28, 29: Vancouver - GM Place

May:
2, 3: Oakland - Oakland Arena
6,7: San Diego - Sports Arena
10, 11, 14,15: L.A. - Staples Center
16-31: break

June:
1, 4, 5: Amsterdam - Amsterdam Arena
8: Zurich - Letzigrund Stadium
10: Gelsenkirchen - Schalke Stadium
12: Brussels - Roi Boudoin
14: Manchester - Stadium of Light
18,19: London - Twickenham
21: Glasgow - Hampden Park
25, 26: Dublin - Croke Park
29: Cardiff - Millenium Stadium

July
2: Vienna - Ernest Happel Stadium
5: Budapest - NEP Stadium
7: Berlin - Olympic Stadium
9: Paris - Stade de France
10-18: break
19, 21: Milan San Siro or Florence Stadium
23: Rome - Olympic Stadium
27: Oslo - Vallehovin
29: Gothenburg -Ullevi
31: Copenhagen - Parken

August:
3: Munich - Olympic Stadium
5: Nice - Parc de Sports Charles Ehrman
7: Barcelona - Olympic or FC Barc
9: San Sebastian - Anoeta Stadium
11: Madrid - Calderon
14: Lisbon - Alvalade
15-31: break

September
1-12: break
13: break, load in Toronto
14: break, load in Toronto
15: break, load in Toronto
16, 17: Toronto - Air Canada Centre
20, 21: Chicago - United Center
23: Minneapolis - Xcel or Target
25: Milwaukee - Bradley Center
27: Cleveland - Gund Arena
30: Boston - Fleet Center

October
1, 3, 4 Boston - Fleet Center
7, 8, 10,11: New York - MSG
14: New York MSG / Albany-Pepsi
15: off / New York - MSG
16,17: Philadelphia - Wachovia
19, 20: Washington - MCI Center
21: off pre rig Pittsburgh
22: Pittsburgh - Mellon Arena
25: Detroit - Palace of Auburn Hills
28: Houston - Toyota Center
29: Dallas - American Airlines

November
1,2: Anaheim - Pond
4: off/ Las Vegas MGM
5: Las Vegas MGM
6: Las Vegas MGM - off
7: Off - Sacramento - Arco / LA Staples
9,10: San Jose
18,19, 22, 23: Tokyo - Budokan or Yokohama

December:
2, 3: Brisbane - Entertainment Center
6, 7, 9,10: Melbourne - Rod Laver
13,14,17,18: Sydney - Superdome

 

[BVS]

It's pretty shocking, looking back, that U2's popularity dropped that dramatically in the time between 1993 and 1997, especially in the USA. To go from sold out stadiums to half full (or less) in the same stadiums in just a few short years is amazing. I was a teenager in the mid 90s, and I felt like U2 had a pretty decent profile in the years following Zooropa. HMTMKMKM was pretty popular (it was track 1 on the Batman soundtrack, and as a result had some residual exposure from people who bought it for "Kiss from a Rose"), and everyone was talking about the Mission Impossible Theme that "U2" remixed.



Was the public's reaction to Discotheque and it's music video that bad? I know the first leg of the Popmart tour went on sale before the album was even released, so most people hadn't heard the rest of the album, they just hated Discotheque. I know there was a price increase, most people never dreamed of paying $50+ for concert tickets at that time. Now that sounds wonderful!



I've always been fascinated by Popmart's lack of success. Why were they playing places like Clemson or Jacksonville anyway? Also, why were many of the European shows played in flat fields as opposed to stadiums?

While U2 were having fun and being tongue n cheek during ZooTV, they were still sincere about the art.

But then they came out dressed as the village people, announced their tour at a KMart, and then came out on stage as caricatures of themselves. It was too much for North America.



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[prbiker15]

This is copied from another thread from early 2005.

Redoing that schedule must have been a pain in the ass!

 

[BoyOnTheHorizon]

Bored, bored, bored, couldn't be more bored.