BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
Of all the intelligent people I know, not one has ever had to put it in writing. Or even cared to for that matter.
New Album Discussion: Electric Lady Studios
- Thread starter FlyontheHorizon
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Of all the intelligent people I know, not one has ever had to put it in writing. Or even cared to for that matter.
BigMacPhisto
Rock n' Roll Doggie VIP PASS
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Elevation was at least the best since Zoo TV because the album they were touring was actually a classic. PopMart and 360 both suffered from having a lot of weak songs from the new album cluttering the set list (360 improved greatly towards the end when it was more hits focused).
Vertigo got lucky that some of those songs were pretty awesome in an arena setting ("Love and Peace or Else" is a song I never cared for on record, for example, but consider a live highlight). That said, it lacked the emotional intensity of the Elevation Tour. Pride, One, Until The End Of The World all sounded worse and Streets was kind of hacked in the balls by associating it with Africa too much (thereby making the audience focus on only one interpretation of the track).
Vertigo got lucky that some of those songs were pretty awesome in an arena setting ("Love and Peace or Else" is a song I never cared for on record, for example, but consider a live highlight). That said, it lacked the emotional intensity of the Elevation Tour. Pride, One, Until The End Of The World all sounded worse and Streets was kind of hacked in the balls by associating it with Africa too much (thereby making the audience focus on only one interpretation of the track).
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
This is not a rebel song...
corianderstem
Blue Crack Distributor
If Chris Martin ends up appearing on the album, I'm going to take a long break from this site to avoid all the inevitable nonstop bitching and moaning.
(Okay, not really. But I will freely bitch about the bitching.
)
(Okay, not really. But I will freely bitch about the bitching.
)
Nick66
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
I was actually quoting (well, partially quoting) Jack Nicholson in A Few Good Men. Most of the intelligent people I know have seen that movie.
Just trying to be ironical (that's another quote, BTW). Though predictably, someone will laugh as if you've mad a clever observation.
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
I was actually quoting (well, partially quoting) Jack Nicholson in A Few Good Men. Most of the intelligent people I know have seen that movie.
I saw once when it came out...
Danny Boy
Rock n' Roll Doggie FOB
subnet
New Yorker
If Chris Martin ends up appearing on the album, I'm going to take a long break from this site to avoid all the inevitable nonstop bitching and moaning.
(Okay, not really. But I will freely bitch about the bitching.
Chris? How about Rihanna?
namkcuR
ONE love, blood, life
People complain about the Elevation setlists, and they were short, but as far as the selection of songs, I'd just like to point out the following:
1. 11 O'Clock Tick Tock, a song which hadn't been played since Lovetown and hasn't been played since Elevation, was played on Elevation. In the same vein, Elevation also marked the return of Out Of Control, after having not been played since Lovetown(and only three Lovetown shows at that, after having been a regular on the JT tour).
2. It was the last tour on which Pop, one of the records people(myself included) complain about not having a live presence anymore, had a presence in the setlists(other than the two Discotheque performances on Vertigo). A shortened version of Discotheque was played on the first leg, Gone was a regular for the first two legs, Staring At The Sun was played a good number of times throughout the tour, Wake Up Dead Man was a regular on the second leg(and was played once on the first leg), and an acoustic version of Please was played on the third leg. Also, Zooropa was represented by Stay, which was a regular on the first two legs and played twice on the third leg.
3. Sweetest Thing was performed on the first leg, its only live performances ever.
I can see how some would say they weren't the most exciting setlists ever, but Popmart was far more static and yet generally people don't complain about those setlists.
I think it was easily their most emotionally intense tour, because of Bono's dad and 9/11 as stated before, but also, I think, especially on the first leg tour, the 'comeback' dynamic was at work. Now, Pop is their most polarizing record, and I know a lot of us think it's great, but a lot of people didn't, and for those people, ATYCLB and the Elevation tour marked the return of the 'old' U2, and I think that meant something to those people, and it showed at those shows. In addition to that dynamic in the crowd, the band also just seemed really grateful and humbled by the response they were getting after how Popmart started.
As for Bono's voice...yes, you can hear it on bootlegs, and it adds a resonance to that line from Elevation - "I can't sing but I've got soul" - but I think people who were at the shows may not have noticed it as much, people at show are too busy having fun and enjoying the moment.
1. 11 O'Clock Tick Tock, a song which hadn't been played since Lovetown and hasn't been played since Elevation, was played on Elevation. In the same vein, Elevation also marked the return of Out Of Control, after having not been played since Lovetown(and only three Lovetown shows at that, after having been a regular on the JT tour).
2. It was the last tour on which Pop, one of the records people(myself included) complain about not having a live presence anymore, had a presence in the setlists(other than the two Discotheque performances on Vertigo). A shortened version of Discotheque was played on the first leg, Gone was a regular for the first two legs, Staring At The Sun was played a good number of times throughout the tour, Wake Up Dead Man was a regular on the second leg(and was played once on the first leg), and an acoustic version of Please was played on the third leg. Also, Zooropa was represented by Stay, which was a regular on the first two legs and played twice on the third leg.
3. Sweetest Thing was performed on the first leg, its only live performances ever.
I can see how some would say they weren't the most exciting setlists ever, but Popmart was far more static and yet generally people don't complain about those setlists.
I think it was easily their most emotionally intense tour, because of Bono's dad and 9/11 as stated before, but also, I think, especially on the first leg tour, the 'comeback' dynamic was at work. Now, Pop is their most polarizing record, and I know a lot of us think it's great, but a lot of people didn't, and for those people, ATYCLB and the Elevation tour marked the return of the 'old' U2, and I think that meant something to those people, and it showed at those shows. In addition to that dynamic in the crowd, the band also just seemed really grateful and humbled by the response they were getting after how Popmart started.
As for Bono's voice...yes, you can hear it on bootlegs, and it adds a resonance to that line from Elevation - "I can't sing but I've got soul" - but I think people who were at the shows may not have noticed it as much, people at show are too busy having fun and enjoying the moment.
Nick66
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
Great post, I agree with every word of this. I've always thought the band really played like they meant it because they wanted to win people back post-Popmart (whatever you may personally think about that album and tour), and were genuinely grateful and moved by the reaction of the crowd. This was exactly the impression I got on the shows I went to, along with the comments the band made at the time. You just can't overstate how important that record, and tour, was to U2. And that was reflected in those shows.
And that version of Out of Control from Slane kicks ass, the best version of the song I've ever heard. I'm also quite fond of the acoustic SATS (though I love the original also).
I personally think the reason a lot of people don't like ATYCLB and the Elevation tour is because they both pretty much displayed a complete lack of irony (as opposed to the 90's records and tours), and marked in many ways a return to the "earnest" version of U2. Not saying one is superior to the other, I loved the ZOOTV tour...but Elevation was something completely different.
And that version of Out of Control from Slane kicks ass, the best version of the song I've ever heard. I'm also quite fond of the acoustic SATS (though I love the original also).
I personally think the reason a lot of people don't like ATYCLB and the Elevation tour is because they both pretty much displayed a complete lack of irony (as opposed to the 90's records and tours), and marked in many ways a return to the "earnest" version of U2. Not saying one is superior to the other, I loved the ZOOTV tour...but Elevation was something completely different.
lazarus
Blue Crack Supplier
I loved the shows I went to as well, and never implied that these were subpar. With a band as great in the live format as U2 is, "weakest" is still damned good.
But yes, I think it's these external (read: unrelated to the band and their performances) forces which gave it extra resonance for people, especially in the U.S.
I'm only speaking from memory, but it was my recollection during Vertigo that people seemed to notice improvement--not only with something as obvious as Bono's voice, but in the song section. namkcuR can trot out Elevation highlights (of which there were some for sure), but on Vertigo people were getting The Electric Company, Gloria, The Ocean, The First Time, and Miss Sarajevo. And unlike the previous three tours, songs from every U2 album plus Passengers were played.
corianderstem
Blue Crack Distributor
Let's not get totally crazy here.
gvox
Ghost of Love
Bono's voice definitely improved on Vertigo. Streets in album tuning, case in point #1.
I also agree on song selection. While the attempt at 11 o'clock on (early) Elevation was admirable, it fell abysmally short of any of its previous live incarnations and was mercifully short lived, compared to the Vertigo equivalent Electric Co. which generally kicked ass and actually breathed new life into the the tune. Other examples are there but song for song performance by performance, Vertigo was probably a better quality show
Holy shit. The Fly. Vertigo The Fly all the way!
Having said all that..the Elevation tour had some huge and I mean monumental moments. That, arguably, did not happen on Vertigo. But those moments are largely connected to events that we wouldn't want happening again.
gvox
Ghost of Love
Does she sing the saucy stuff too?
Globo14
Refugee
This is probably a point that we should all remember. By default, some of their tours have to be weaker than others. Laz just meant in his original point that Elevation was among the "worst" tours of a superb live history.
I really hope the next tour is stripped down more. Even if they do outdoor shows, use a somewhat simpler stage. We don't need a claw or ginormous video screen. In my eyes, when an act puts on that much of a spectacle for a stage show, it implies that they have less confidence in the music, and a band can only shine the brightest if they're confident.
PhilsFan
Blue Crack Addict
Considering how bad Bono's voice was and how short the setlists were, Elevation is sort of the weakest by default.
As Laz said, that still means it's good, don't get me wrong.
As Laz said, that still means it's good, don't get me wrong.
namkcuR
ONE love, blood, life
Well, yeah, I just got done agreeing that it was the emotional components of Elevation that made it so memorable.
I also agree that from a 'holy shit we never thought we'd here these songs again' perspective, Vertigo is probably king. I still remember the tremendous excitement on the first nights of Vertigo when we first recognized that The Electric Co., An Cat Dubh/Into The Heart, Gloria, The Ocean, Running To Stand Still, and Zoo Station were back after long absences, and then later on when Miss Sarajevo got its first live performances ever outside of Popmart Sarajevo, with Bono singing everything. It was a big deal.
I just prefer Elevation is all. There's a spirit in those shows. Yes, Bono has his issues, but I find that some of those Elevation gigs are some of the most satisfying to listen to for me.
Full disclosure though, there's also the fact that it was the first tour I went to, and that ATYCLB was the first new album that was released when I was a fan. I first got into U2 right after Popmart ended, before the Best Of 1980-1990 came out, so I first fell in love with the entire back catalog up through Pop, and then ATYCLB came out.
Nick66
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
Well, what he said was that it was "common knowledge" and that there was "consensus" it was among the worst. A point which the vast majority of the subsequent comments praising Elevation and hoping for a similar stripped-down tour would seem to undermine.
I agree 100% with this.
namkcuR
ONE love, blood, life
Just out of curiosity, outside of Bono's voice, did you feel that the rest of the band's performances of 11OTT on Elevation fell short as well? Or is it mainly Bono?
This I can I agree with. Perhaps the definitive version. Although every live version of that song - from the ZooTV original to the Elevation version with the intro and Bono singing the whole chorus to this blistering Vertigo version, there's something special about all of them(still haven't heard a 360 version). What a song.
You need to change that. It's basically a perfected version of Vertigo's The Fly.
gvox
Ghost of Love
haha can`t believe I missed this the first time
We seriously need a Sicy Photoshop Mad Skillz intervention..maybe U2`s Street Mission look with the EC logo
lol
gvox
Ghost of Love
This might be a chicken before the egg thing; the whole thing sounds like a funeral march. Tempo wise, it`s way too slow. So who dictated that speed...I dunno...maybe in rehearsals, Larry. But Edge fires up the song with the riff, so..but anyways Im sure Edge just did it at the speed Larry told him to
Whoa. 360 has some seriously great The Flys, as mentioned, just upping the ante from Vertigo.
I like to call it The Fly: Fulfillment.
Nick66
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
I think all the live versions of The Fly have been great. The song holds up well and has been remarkably resilient (though didn't one of them say they thought the song was dated?)
The Vertigo Zoo Station though...awful. It's one of the few live versions of a U2 song that I cringe at, which is a pity b/c it's one of my favourites and I was psyched to hear they were playing it...until I heard it.
namkcuR
ONE love, blood, life
I think it was Edge, when the Best Of 1990-2000 came out, as an explanation for why The Fly wasn't on it.
Really? It's probably not as good as the ZooTV versions, but I thought it was still good.
PhilsFan
Blue Crack Addict
I agree, and it's pretty much entirely Larry's fault.
LemonMelon
More 5G Than Man
I got to see it live and thought Vertigo Zoo Station was extremely tolerable. Not anywhere near ZooTV but still pretty good.
To whoever said earlier that setlists are overrated, it really depends on the person, but I will say that many of the all-time great live acts do/did a terrific job mixing up their sets. The Grateful Dead, Phish, Bruce Springsteen and Pearl Jam never had static sets and they've made their reputation on their live performances. But again, it depends. Fans notice, but many won't.
To whoever said earlier that setlists are overrated, it really depends on the person, but I will say that many of the all-time great live acts do/did a terrific job mixing up their sets. The Grateful Dead, Phish, Bruce Springsteen and Pearl Jam never had static sets and they've made their reputation on their live performances. But again, it depends. Fans notice, but many won't.
Nick66
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
Just didn't think it had any balls, if you'll excuse the term. Kind of weak with no punch to it all. I mean, it's still Zoo Station, which I think is probably their best 90's era song, so there's that, but compared to the ZOOTV version I don't think there's much there.
I totally agree with this (though it's not Adam's best performance either). Anyway Larry was having an off night when they recorded it in Chicago, some back stage stuff going on I can't talk about.
Good ole' Larry.
PS. I see what you did there.
gvox
Ghost of Love
I think we continue to see (and, `need`) a big video screen.
Elevation was cool with the screens that would rise and fall.
U2 aint stupid: the people who want the up close and personal intimate experience are up front anyways, and lets face it for the people up front the screens since Popmart have been largely not a factor. You don`t see much. The bigger the screens, the more intimate the other 13,000 people in the arena get to feel with the band, and that helps the show.
The big screens stay. To be honest Im eager to see what new tech they roll out..Vertigo arena shows with the curtain were interesting, it seemed they didnt want anyone to the back of the stage to miss out. Do they aim for that again, or do they just section off a piece and put proper screens up and say to hell with selling those seats....or...do they use a cylindrical screen like 360 and play in the middle of the arena...
Elevation was cool with the screens that would rise and fall.
U2 aint stupid: the people who want the up close and personal intimate experience are up front anyways, and lets face it for the people up front the screens since Popmart have been largely not a factor. You don`t see much. The bigger the screens, the more intimate the other 13,000 people in the arena get to feel with the band, and that helps the show.
The big screens stay. To be honest Im eager to see what new tech they roll out..Vertigo arena shows with the curtain were interesting, it seemed they didnt want anyone to the back of the stage to miss out. Do they aim for that again, or do they just section off a piece and put proper screens up and say to hell with selling those seats....or...do they use a cylindrical screen like 360 and play in the middle of the arena...
gvox
Ghost of Love
Good grief. Here we go again.
namkcuR
ONE love, blood, life
I think we continue to see (and, `need`) a big video screen.
Elevation was cool with the screens that would rise and fall.
U2 aint stupid: the people who want the up close and personal intimate experience are up front anyways, and lets face it for the people up front the screens since Popmart have been largely not a factor. You don`t see much. The bigger the screens, the more intimate the other 13,000 people in the arena get to feel with the band, and that helps the show.
The big screens stay. To be honest Im eager to see what new tech they roll out..Vertigo arena shows with the curtain were interesting, it seemed they didnt want anyone to the back of the stage to miss out. Do they aim for that again, or do they just section off a piece and put proper screens up and say to hell with selling those seats....or...do they use a cylindrical screen like 360 and play in the middle of the arena...
You know, you mention the behind-the-stage thing, at the 360 show I went to, I had a first-tier seat(i.e. the tier closest to the stage) behind the stage, and I really thought it was one of the best seats in the house in some ways, because if you have a first-tier seat in front of the stage, you're further away because all of the GA people on the floor are between you and the stage, but when you're behind the stage, when Bono/Edge/Adam make their laps around back, they're right there. Other than GA, it's about the closet you can get. I hope they do play in the round again.
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