LP15 - We're due for a break from the norm

[superchuk5]

Agree totally with these last few posts.

To summarize ... Edge needs to grow some balls and start making big sounds again. SOI and SOE are sonically sterile.

Contrast with a song like WILATW which is 100% Edge.

That reminds me: On the next album, I want a song with significant Edge vocal, If not a Van Diemen's Land, at least a Seconds

 

[An Cat Gav]

I'm seriously in saying that SOE had zero memorable songs

SoE would rank as my least favourite U2 album.

On my previous lowest ranking U2 album, HTDAAB, I could only name a couple of songs I couldn't stand, Miracle Drug and Yahweh, the rest I loved or could appreciate on some level.

On SoE I can only name a couple of songs I actually really like, Summer of Love, Red Flag Day and LIAWHL.

There are a few like Landlady and Little Things that I can enjoy listening to from time to time but unlike any other U2 album the majority are songs I never want to hear again. These include LIBTAIIW, Get Out of Your Own Way, American Soul, Best Thing and Blackout ( I cannot for the life of me understand why that song is so loved here).

I find SoE quite boring I'm afraid. SoI on the other hand does at least have some energy and does successfully take you to a different place and time. It does have a couple of poor songs, such as The Miracle, but it does have some really great ones, especially the last four. It's just a shame that Dangermouse wasn't fully trusted to produce on his own and that Invisible and TCB weren't included.

 

[dan_smee]

also doesn't make sense to call it a companion album when they tore it up and inserted a bunch of new stuff because someone objectively incompetent, abhorrent and disgusting got elected in a country half the band live in the majority of the time.



It will be interesting to see which of the Songs Of albums ages better... if they are able to age (and not simply be forgotten) at all...

Fixed it for you.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

3/4s... but who's counting.

 

[Hewson]

Ehh. I think Pop is better than all of those, both writing and production-wise.

I wouldn't argue that...I was just rebutting MattD saying Rubin had never produced a great album, that's pure horse shit.
Clearly not the guy to work with U2, but that doesn't negate everything else he's done.

 

[Hewson]

What’s the point in trying to claim cat shit tastes better than dog shit? Volcano is bad. American soul is bad. Move along.

Cat shit is generally smaller and therefore easier to choke down.

 

[LuckyNumber7]

But does it taste better

 

[Hewson]

But does it taste better

Do a blind taste test and get back to me.

 

[LuckyNumber7]

I’m fine with not having an opinion.

 

[Gonna Run 2 U]

Songs Of Innocence is the winner for me simply because of “Iris”.

 

[womanfish]

To get:

Every Breaking Wave
Raised By Wolves
This Is Where You Can Reach Me Now
Troubles
Crystal Ballroom
Lights of Home
Red Flag Day
Little Things
Land Lady
Love Is Bigger

this late in their career is pretty solid. These are songs I'll always revisit and remind me of both tours (which were great) . And my 3 year old loves Best Thing. That song will always remind me of him from age 2 to 3 for the rest of my life. Whats even more strange he was in my wife's stomach at the IE Tour (Phoenix)

Triple Like.
And i would Add:
Summer of Love
Love is All We Have Left
Book of Your Heart
Sleep Like a Baby Tonight
13
and sorta The Blackout

Both SOI and SOE are quality solid albums with some incredible material.
They land about evenly for me. I think SOE is a bit frustrating because I just don't listen to Get Out, American Soul or the Showman. But to have TEN songs on a U2 album in the 2000's that i either really like or love is pretty astounding. Add Book of Your Heart and that's 11!
I would say I listen to about 5 or 6 from each of the first 3 albums of the 2000's

SOI has fewer lows for me. Miracle and SFS are the only ones i don't listen to. And even Miracle isn't horrible. Would have been a so-so album cut, but the placement of it as lead off song and first single, just angers me.
So again, another 2000's album that I like or love NINE songs from. Add the masterpiece that is The Crystal Ballroom and it's even better.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

It's almost as if musical opinions is subjective.

Except for Boots being dog shit. That's a fact.

 

[LuckyNumber7]

Though props to bono for singing as an old man about something before it was cool.

 

[MattD]

playing devil's advocate here, we know Rick Rubin has an amazing discography up in his production sleeve but his production choices can be very questionable, favoring loudness and simplistic idea of "aggression" or whatever rather than creating something actually interesting. but again I'm not saying Rick is entirely trash, its just that he is kinda overrated in that regard. but move on.

This is exactly it. He’s good a good ear for a good act, but creatively, he does fuck all and all his albums are brickwalled to buggery. Absolutely no nuance to his techniques at all. The two U2 songs he’s done sound horrendous (don’t get me started on the sacriligoues Skids cover).

It beggars belief that he would ever be up there with an esteemed U2 producer like Eno for example.

 

[DaveC]

This is exactly it. He’s good a good ear for a good act, but creatively, he does fuck all and all his albums are brickwalled to buggery. Absolutely no nuance to his techniques at all. The two U2 songs he’s done sound horrendous (don’t get me started on the sacriligoues Skids cover).

It beggars belief that he would ever be up there with an esteemed U2 producer like Eno for example.

this is like listening to a buffalo bills fan insist over and over that tom brady is in reality a terrible quarterback who can't hold a candle to a real great like jim kelly.

 

[MattD]

this is like listening to a buffalo bills fan insist over and over that tom brady is in reality a terrible quarterback who can't hold a candle to a real great like jim kelly.

Look, I don’t like his production and I don’t like his style. I get that he might be marmite - some think he’s a genius, others think he’s an overrated hack. I just think there’s nothing revolutionary about him.

Dare I say it, if we got a U2 album from him, it would be full of dad rawk crap like All Because Of You, The Miracle and American Soul. That would be his level with U2. He’d basically be the anti-Brian Eno.

 

[DaveC]

i don't really care about your opinion of the music he helped make, although if you really genuinely think everything he ever worked on is crap aside from licensed to ill then your taste in music fucking sucks.

but saying something like this:

I just think there’s nothing revolutionary about him.

is absurd and on the level of saying that michael jordan wasn't a good basketball player, or that neil armstrong was a shitty astronaut. it's just flat-out objectively false.

 

[Iggy Fizz]

Fixed it for you.

you and I might agree on that. but it still makes the point about calling SOE a companion album to SOI exactly what it is: ridiculous.

also, I was not aware that half (3/4 ?) of U2 live in the US most of the time. maybe I dont stalk them as much as most here, but that's news to me. in any event - it's irrelevant.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Don't fuck with Thurman Thomas

 

[MattD]

i don't really care about your opinion of the music he helped make, although if you really genuinely think everything he ever worked on is crap aside from licensed to ill then your taste in music fucking sucks.

but saying something like this:



is absurd and on the level of saying that michael jordan wasn't a good basketball player, or that neil armstrong was a shitty astronaut. it's just flat-out objectively false.

Never said it sucked but that it was overrated and any average producer could do what he does.

He’s no Brian Eno that’s for sure.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Obviously everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but I find it incredibly unlikely that Rubin became one of the most prolific and most sought after producers in music history because "any average producer can do what he does"

That's just a ridiculous statement.

 

[super fly guy]

Apart from GOYOW American Soul and LandLady,SOE is a great album. Love is all we have left and 13 are fantastic openers and closers. Love this album.

 

[Iggy Fizz]

so it's the kind of trouble that you enjoy? OK.

 

[LuckyNumber7]

I’m beating a dead horse but what the heck is so wrong with GOOYOW?

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

I’m beating a dead horse but what the heck is so wrong with GOOYOW?

Other than that it shouldn't have been a single, I find nothing offensive about the song.

It's fairly derivative of Beautiful Day, and isn't exactly their most inspiring creative work - which I guess is what the issue for most is. But in and of itself it's harmless.

 

[kabigon]

And it's bookended by Best Thing and American Soul, conjuring recollections of NLOTH's ill-fated trilogy.

 

[HansaTonImbiss]

So on the Rubin argument- everyone is entitled to their opinion but calling him talentless or overrated is a bit crazy. The guy basically reinvented rap production for a pop audience and also modernized the recording style for hard rock from "echo chamber tap chords with effects and pedals" to a more range - oriented structure focused on vocals and simplicity. His work with the Peppers in the 90s and System of a Down later speaks to this, as does his work with Cash. License to Ill was revolutionary for its era and people who overlook that probably forget what other contemporary artists sounded like in that genre.

What is also true is that rumors of how direct (or indirect) a hand Rubin plays with his artists in the studio, particularly in more recent years, have only increased. He has had a series of trusted engineers he works with and the rep is that they routinely do 75% of the work while he occasionally Skypes in to add thoughts before taking lead in mastering and sequencing. He also lets the artists bang the songs and shapes out before he adds his touch at the later period. For a band like Green Day or the Peppers, who have a well developed style of songwriting/instrumentation and bring song ideas to the studio, that makes sense. For a band like U2, who prefer to improvise and change course often during their early sketches for an album, it sounds like a completely incompatible match. Rubin is about as far away as you can get from Eno and Lanois, who at many phases of U2's recording life were the 5th and 6th members of the band, at least in the studio.

I have gripes with all U2 producers (mostly Lillywhite) but it's clear that at least personality-wise, Eno and Lanois were their best match. The body of work shows that, and same would be true of Rubin and many of his artists. Scott Litt was a perfect fit for REM. Hugh Padgham could tolerate 3 colossal egos with the Police and made classics. Managing personalities is perhaps more of a mark of many effective producers than some realize. My hope is they find someone, like Barlow, who can channel their creativity again as well.

 

[LuckyNumber7]

Other than that it shouldn't have been a single, I find nothing offensive about the song.

It's fairly derivative of Beautiful Day, and isn't exactly their most inspiring creative work - which I guess is what the issue for most is. But in and of itself it's harmless.

Sure, fine, fair to all of that. The Miracle wasn’t exactly a great single either but it’s not a turdable song. Arguably one of the more forgettable ones from SOI. But it’s not necessarily bad or Boots.

But yeah, GOOYOW is benign and otherwise should’ve been more of a segue into something more interesting. Its music video had bigger balls than it, sure. I’ll say that. But none of these criticisms make it a bad song. They just highlight how U2 makes bad track-listing and release decisions.

Like, wasn’t the track listing order on TJT decided by a vote or something?

 

[DaveC]

can we please all just agree to call the song get out instead of that ridiculous acronym

 

[LemonMelon]

can we please all just agree to call the song get out instead of that ridiculous acronym

I've been calling it GOO Your Own Way for a while now.