Aha, Seems maybe something WAS being done

[Miss MacPhisto]

Originally posted by U2Bama:
Give peace a chance, there is enough war in the world as it is.

This is not a personal thread; Arun_V never made personal references, he made a general comment; why are you making it personal?

~U2Alabama

[This message has been edited by U2Bama (edited 05-17-2002).]

He was referring to me.

[U2Bama]

I did not infer that he was talking about you; in fact, it never would have crossed my mind until you introduced the theory, and I STILL don't think he was talking about you. But I do not like it when people introduce discovery/text/statements from PRIVATE conversations/chats/whatever into a public forum, because private conversations should remain just that: private. Also, the rest of us (who may be friends with BOTH of you) do not have the advantage of knowing WHO is speaking the truth, and the alleged subjects of such scuttlebutt (in this case, z edge and DiamondBruno_9, who are also friends of mine) do not know WHO to believe and are put in an unfairly awkward situation.

~U2Alabama

[This message has been edited by U2Bama (edited 05-17-2002).]

[Miss MacPhisto]

Yes, but if someone is talking about me behind my back, all the while publicly pretending to be my friend, i would DEFINITELY want to know.
That is one of my biggest pet peeves. If you have something to say to me, tell me to my face. And dont pretend to be my friend just to make yourself look good. I need to know who my enemies are, i dont like being fooled into thinking i have a friend when i dont.
There is no way in hell arun was talking about anyone except me when he made those remarks. There is no doubt. NONE
Who else could it be? i was the only one disagreeing with him, the only one who suggested the government could be behind the whole thing.
He could have just replied "yes, there may have been a very vague threat,etc,etc..."and state his case again.

He didnt have to use sarcasm or refer to anyone as a fool or mention the previous thread. But he did,so i have to fight back, and so here we go again.

I should mention that i wasnt even going to look at this thread at all, and when i heard the news myself, i wasnt even thinking of posting about it at all.
Then an alert pal on my ICQ let me know what was going on, and i just cant let comments like that go...

[This message has been edited by Miss MacPhisto (edited 05-17-2002).]

[U2Bama]

Originally posted by Miss MacPhisto:
There is no way in hell arun was talking about anyone except me when he made those remarks. There is no doubt. NONE
Who else could it be? i was the only one disagreeing with him, the only one who suggested the government could be behind the whole thing.

There were 131 posts in kobayashi's "Prior Knowledge..." thread before it was close, and MANY of those posts were made by individuals who thought it possible that the government had some advance knowledge of the attacks. Yes, you may be the only one saying the government was "behind the whole thing" which is indeed a stretch. But in THIS thread Arun_V was referring to the simple debate of PRIOR KNOWLEDGE, NOT "involvement."

~U2Alabama

[Miss MacPhisto]

Go ask him. I am 100% certain he was referring to me. I am the only one he has a grudge against, and the only one he is out to get. I pissed him off in that thread, NONE of the others did.

[This message has been edited by Miss MacPhisto (edited 05-17-2002).]

[U2Bama]

Arun_V:

Were you talking about MissMacPh?

[V Nura]

Originally posted by U2Bama:
Arun_V:

Were you talking about MissMacPh?

I was referring to a nubmer of ppl

I had already spoken to miss mac about this issue. And was done with her.


I have to finish some New media work and go to bed...I'm done with this..if anyone wants to talk about the topic of this thread..I'd be mroe than happy to reply to it tomorrow

[Miss MacPhisto]

UM. You spoke to me about the issue at first. Then you closed all lines of communication, which only aggravated things.
You couldve been civil in this thread, but you had to go off and attck people.
You were referring to me as well, and you shouldnt go attacking anyone just because they hold a different view than yourself.
The you get upset when anyone fires back. Odd.

[rafmed]

Its a shame that all the right wing pigs, defend themselves against one of the few voices here that has some free thinking, I mean that is not attached to a doctrine, I I wonder how u don't even see the obvious Bama, can't you even see that Arun is quoting Miss?, what else one need to refer to someone in person.
I once told in chat to some of you that I wouldn't be surpriced if Bush admon. knew about the attacks, and let it happen to have an excuse to go to war, it has happened before , it will happen again, and if you believe that what they are admiting now its all they knew, then someone is really NOT LEARNING.
Its scary how this place that should have a wide range opinions has alienated the liberal thinking, where is Holy Joe? for instance, this is not FREE YOUR MIND, its Uncle Sam Backyard, it was sick when someone called Jesus a republican, even as a joke, is the most stupid thing I has ever read, someone should teach you, that he said that all men are equal,that sound more like Marx you know, (that is an equal dumb comment, only to see how dumb it was) I know u will blast me, and things will not change, and I also don't hope you FREE YOUR MIND, narrow minds are not free, also I don't think I will reply to anyone after this in thi thread, its just that its sick the level of intolerance displayed in this place.

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Please...don't make me say please, champagne and ice cream, it's not what I want, it's what I need.

[ABEL]

Originally posted by rafmed:
its just that its sick the level of intolerance displayed in this place.

agreed raffie.

can't we all just get along?


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Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.
-Albert Einstein

[V Nura]

Originally posted by rafmed:
Its a shame that all the right wing pigs, defend themselves against one of the few voices here that has some free thinking, I mean that is not attached to a doctrine, I I wonder how u don't even see the obvious Bama, can't you even see that Arun is quoting Miss?, what else one need to refer to someone in person.
I once told in chat to some of you that I wouldn't be surpriced if Bush admon. knew about the attacks, and let it happen to have an excuse to go to war, it has happened before , it will happen again, and if you believe that what they are admiting now its all they knew, then someone is really NOT LEARNING.
Its scary how this place that should have a wide range opinions has alienated the liberal thinking, where is Holy Joe? for instance, this is not FREE YOUR MIND, its Uncle Sam Backyard, it was sick when someone called Jesus a republican, even as a joke, is the most stupid thing I has ever read, someone should teach you, that he said that all men are equal,that sound more like Marx you know, (that is an equal dumb comment, only to see how dumb it was) I know u will blast me, and things will not change, and I also don't hope you FREE YOUR MIND, narrow minds are not free, also I don't think I will reply to anyone after this in thi thread, its just that its sick the level of intolerance displayed in this place.

THe only time I ever quoted miss was when remarks became personal in nature which happened in both threads. Responding to someone and attacking them are too different things.


If you wanna handle the issue that's fine but everytime it seems to turn into some warped personal issue. I discussed the issue in both threads and both threads got dragged into something personal


talk about odd

I urge everyone to look at both this and the prior knowledge of 9/11 thread and look at who did what. at no point do I make personal attacks BOTH times it gets personal without warrant.


THERE WERE A NUMBER OF PPL WHO THOUGHT THAT THE GOVERNMENT HAD GAINED FROM 9/11 I was reffering to the lot of them.


Honestly...I dont' think I would take the time or energy to reply to any single persons post in that thread.

I dont' get upset when ppl fire back...but I do when it's personal and has nothing to do with the thread at hand.

and don't lecture me about civility

[80sU2isBest]

Originally posted by rafmed:
Its a shame that all the right wing pigs, defend themselves against one of the few voices here that has some free thinking, I mean that is not attached to a doctrine, I I wonder how u don't even see the obvious Bama, can't you even see that Arun is quoting Miss?,

It wasn't obvious to me...seemed to me Arun was talking about a group of people, not specifically Miss Mac. Miss Mac was on Arun's back for that entire thread; if you don't believe me, go read it. Now, when Arun makes a statement about a group of people, she flies of the handle, and interprets it to be about only her.
By the way, Aun is hardly a "right wing pig". You could say that about me (coming from certain people, I regard that as a high compliment), but not about Arun.

[80sU2isBest]

Originally posted by z edge:
80'S
Therefore, it makes perfect sense that the Bush administration was developing plans to wipe Al Queda off the earth. Considering the USS Cole and everything prior to it and the imminent threats, they were coming in to do their duty. The actual events of 9/11 happened first.

Exactly!
I was speaking to my friend about this, and she said "yeah, but you know there'll be peope out there who say that if he had gone ahead and implemented the plan on the 9th, it would've prevented events of the 11th". I tell you, I wouldn't be surpised to hear that, would you? Last week, when the news broke about Bush having received the vague warning, she said "Oh I can see it now. People will say Bush let it happen to further his career". Imagine her reaction when I said "It's already happening - on the U2 board!" Of course it didn't really surprise her - she's heard about and read some of the wacky things on this forum.

[U2Bama]

Originally posted by rafmed:
Its a shame that all the right wing pigs, defend themselves against one of the few voices here that has some free thinking, I mean that is not attached to a doctrine, I I wonder how u don't even see the obvious Bama, can't you even see that Arun is quoting Miss?, what else one need to refer to someone in person.

If you are referring to Arun_V as a "right wing pig," I must say that is as outrageous as referring to DiamondBruno_9 as "the Mother Teresa of all U2 fans."

Regardless of who I agree with on the political debate at hand (Arun_V), I pointed out my view that he was not solely referring to MissMacPh. I consider myself friends with both of them, and I consider myself friends with you as well, rafmed, but I am disappointed to see you use the term "right wing pigs" when referring to others in this community, whether it is Arun_V, 80sU2IsBest, myself, or whomever. I expected more from you.

~U2Alabama

[V Nura]

number one...I'm not right wing


number two...I used a plural...if ppl cant' tell the difference between plural and singular.......( I would complete this..but I dont' want to make a personal ATTACK or anything)

[V Nura]

also I'd like ppl to note there is no underscore in my name


Arun V not Arun_V

[U2Bama]

Yes, but back in the old days, you put the underscore in your name in chat; I know I have seen it somewhere. And once it is there, I don't go back.

~U2Alabama

[Lemonite]

Originally posted by rafmed:
I once told in chat to some of you that I wouldn't be surpriced if Bush admon. knew about the attacks, and let it happen to have an excuse to go to war, it has happened before , it will happen again, and if you believe that what they are admiting now its all they knew, then someone is really NOT LEARNING.

Sick?... Grotesque?.. That is absolutely one of the sickest explanations I have ever heard, almost topping, the 'War on Terrorism is only there just so Bush can get his Agenda through'.. Geezus Christ... I can't quite even see how you could write such things, but then again, You opened your statement with 'Right Wing Pigs'... So I'm not sure what I couldn't expect from ya.

L.Unplugged

[speedracer]

Originally posted by rafmed:
I once told in chat to some of you that I wouldn't be surpriced if Bush admon. knew about the attacks, and let it happen to have an excuse to go to war, it has happened before , it will happen again, and if you believe that what they are admiting now its all they knew, then someone is really NOT LEARNING.

But if Bush had credible info that al-Qaeda were planning to fly airplanes into the WTC and government buildings, surely it would have occurred to him that the White House might have been a target, and I doubt any President would have allowed such attacks if the White House were a target. (Remember, the Pentagon was hit by one of the planes, and the plane that crashed in PA was headed for Washington.)

[melon]

Originally posted by diamond:
Please define "agitprop"

A reference to the Soviet ministry (were they "ministries"?) of Agitation and Propaganda. Its sole purpose was to make up news stories, implant the seed somewhere around the world, and allow the tabloid nature of the media to foster the fake news story as "real."

This is exactly the specter the Defense Department evoked last fall, when they wanted to create something similar (to their credit, they later recanted on these plans...supposedly).

This news story is just too damn convenient to be true. Why would Bush want a virtually unprovoked war on Al-Qaeda? It is certainly true that they had made attacks in the past, but they were old news by September. It certainly would have garnished no public support nor international support had it been done prior to the September 11th attacks. Heck, even Bush didn't see them as a threat back in April 2001, when he gave $40 million to the Taliban for their effort on the "war on drugs" (I don't doubt that this money was used to beef up the Afghani terrorist camps).

All in all, I see no vast conspiracy, nor any valiant, heroic efforts on the Bush Administration. Al-Qaeda simply outsmarted us on September 11th, but I certainly think we've progressed a lot on the security front since then.

Melon

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"Still, I never understood the elevation of greed as a political credo. Why would anyone want to base a political programme on bottomless dissatisfaction and the impossibility of happiness? Perhaps that was its appeal: the promise of luxury that in fact promoted endless work." - Hanif Kureishi, Intimacy