They talked about WAS as a song to play...but what everyone is saying that SUC is one of the songs from the album that seems to fit the stadium aesthetic. One could also argue Fez is as well but Cedars and WAS are not crying out to be played live.
Project Zero One / Songs of Ascent / New Album Discussion
- Thread starter dan_smee
- Start date
The friendliest place on the web for anyone that follows U2.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
- Status
They talked about WAS as a song to play...but what everyone is saying that SUC is one of the songs from the album that seems to fit the stadium aesthetic. One could also argue Fez is as well but Cedars and WAS are not crying out to be played live.
fez-being born seemed like a logical opening song, and/or opening of encore song.
PhilsFan
Blue Crack Addict
I think you could make the argument that they had trouble figuring out how to play them live. There are some songs that they just seem to think they can't pull off. Fez/Being Born absolutely sounds like something they falsely think is too challenging to arrange in a live setting.
God Part III
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
I agree, a lot more interesting lyrics. I really think it would suit the Cape Town concert. I would also want this on a future "Unreleased, alternate and/or rare" release. Like the beach clip version of Magnificent, or early Unknown Caller.
zoopop
Rock n' Roll Doggie
WAS could have worked, just like many of the songs on NLOTH live at the 360 show I find the presentation of them just kind of bland. Maybe after ISHFWILF drench the stage in darkness with WAS intro, then have a snowstorm type effect, lights go off brightly when the horns come in.
Sure U2 performed Achtung Baby songs on ZOO TV and Pop songs on Popmart in the stadium setting with great reception, but most of the songs played had unique presentations/eye candy when played live.
And what NLOTH song did every fan at the 360 show go CRAZY for when played live...."Crazy Tonight". Sure it rocked, but the stage presentation was A+++.
Sure U2 performed Achtung Baby songs on ZOO TV and Pop songs on Popmart in the stadium setting with great reception, but most of the songs played had unique presentations/eye candy when played live.
And what NLOTH song did every fan at the 360 show go CRAZY for when played live...."Crazy Tonight". Sure it rocked, but the stage presentation was A+++.
Earnie Shavers
Rock n' Roll Doggie VIP PASS
I really don’t think Cedars of Lebanon screams “Stadium!” White as Snow would have been nice, even if only for a brief Blue Room style stint, but really, I'm sure no-one is surprised by its non appearance. And we all think Fez-BB would be awesome, especially as an opener, but it's still not a clear, obvious U2-choice for a setlist spot ahead of, or in place of, any or all of Boots, Magnificent, Crazy (either version), Breathe, No Line or... Stand Up Comedy. And as mentioned above, it was probably put into the 'too difficult' basket.
Stand Up Comedy is a big, simple, brassy rock song, and surely not technically difficult to put on. Certainly no more than, say, Boots. I think it is a pretty good guess that the reason why it hasn’t been played is that they did realise it was a bit of a steaming turd. Hopefully Bono did have a second glance at those lyrics and realise that he would be making himself look like a complete and utter fool if he got up there every night and emplored all ye soul rockin’ people to sit down and stand up for their love.
Or if you don’t buy that, just reverse it – if they really liked it, why else wouldn’t they? It actually sounds like it was purpose built, one of those songs they held the album off for. Shit, stadiums. Need more big, dumb, stadium rock. But then they don't touch it.
Earnie Shavers
Rock n' Roll Doggie VIP PASS
What do you think is different about the Magnificent and UC beach clips? From memory, the only one where I could really hear anything major seemed to be Breathe.
If they didn't like it/didn't think it was good enough, Stand up comedy would not be on the album. Thus, it can't be the reason why SUC doesn't get played live.
They even had a T-shirt in tour merchandise with the "stand up to rock stars" line.
They even had a T-shirt in tour merchandise with the "stand up to rock stars" line.
Earnie Shavers
Rock n' Roll Doggie VIP PASS
Bollocks. I bet there are plenty of songs that given a bit of time, even a very short period of time - just enough to be removed from being caught up in the creation - that they look back on with more than a bit of 
They'll never, ever say it, but you can bet they think it.
They'll never, ever say it, but you can bet they think it.
God Part III
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
The solo section and the build-up to the solo is different. It also sounds less disco-ish. Remember that interview where Brian Eno describes "Magnificent" as some beautiful woman, and the struggled to find the right dress for her but eventually decided on an upbeat disco dress? That's probably the best description. Imagine Magnificent without the disco dress. The lyrics sound the same, but the production is quite different actually.
Unknown Caller I think is identical in the beach clips, what I wanna hear is a very, very early version of that. Like the one from the "Fez" video that was on iTunes if you pre-ordered No Line On The Horizon I think it was. It's on Youtube now, that video shot in 4:3 that starts with a 2 minute early version of Magnificent?
EDIT:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Ns45lVwjfQ
... there we go
Finally, how I would love to hear that solo from the U2.com "Dublin, New York, London" clip in its entirety!
This, without the annoying speaker: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DG6Yw83ECY8
Bollocks. I bet there are plenty of songs that given a bit of time, even a very short period of time - just enough to be removed from being caught up in the creation - that they look back on with more than a bit of
Sure...doesn't change the fact that those songs were deemed strong enough to make the cut at the time.
And there could be plenty of reasons why SUC isn't being played live ... that don't include the alleged party line. It's a portion of the internet fans that hates SUC, not U2 themselves.
JamietheEdgefan
Refugee
The solo section and the build-up to the solo is different. It also sounds less disco-ish. Remember that interview where Brian Eno describes "Magnificent" as some beautiful woman, and the struggled to find the right dress for her but eventually decided on an upbeat disco dress? That's probably the best description. Imagine Magnificent without the disco dress. The lyrics sound the same, but the production is quite different actually.
Unknown Caller I think is identical in the beach clips, what I wanna hear is a very, very early version of that. Like the one from the "Fez" video that was on iTunes if you pre-ordered No Line On The Horizon I think it was. It's on Youtube now, that video shot in 4:3 that starts with a 2 minute early version of Magnificent?
EDIT:
YouTube - U2 FEZ video bonus NLOTH HQ
... there we go
Finally, how I would love to hear that solo from the U2.com "Dublin, New York, London" clip in its entirety!
This, without the annoying speaker: YouTube - U2 - No Line On The Horizon - Dublin, New York and London - U2MIRACLE.COM
Interesting how in that second video, they say that "In the last 24 hours, we mixed 5 songs, re-wrote 3, and ditched 2."
Just looking at NLOTH, this is intriguing... i wonder what songs he was referring to? I'd guess one of the re-written ones was SUC, and the ditched two were Every Breaking wave and winter.
But more importantly, i think he's referring to the last few days before the album was finished - it's cool to see how much work got done that close to the deadline. Perhaps, keeping that in mind, it's not so worrying if Edge actually meant it when he said he was working on demos?
(although, i doubt he actually meant it).
BoMac
Self-righteous bullshitter
So no band ever, least of all U2, has ever put a song on an album that in retrospect they did not like or think was good enough.
Gotcha.
Earnie Shavers
Rock n' Roll Doggie VIP PASS
Ah, good lord! I haven't ever seen that first video.
What they’ve got there with Magnificent is great. Imagine it starting out a bit like that, tighter and cleaner obviously, and then slowly building and evolving until its become the synth-disco thing we have now at the end. East into West or some shit. That would have been something really good, and pretty unique, and possibly the missing thing or spirit that song desperately needs. Along with better lyrics.
And with UC, right in that video they’ve pretty much captured the moment where that song went south. That first burst of it is really nice. Really nice. Then it cuts, and they’re playing the song at the speed (and in the more boring way) we know it now.
Why U2, WHY?!?!?
mama cass
Rock n' Roll Doggie VIP PASS
- Joined
- Aug 16, 2004
- Messages
- 6,293
oh my god... why, why do they DESTROY their songs?!
those videos are lovely! thanks so much for posting them!
those videos are lovely! thanks so much for posting them!
I just don't see the obsession with judging the quality of material on how "weird" or "out there" it is.
All I care is that it's good.
I love U2's sound, all aspects of it, and don't think they need to become another band entirely to be good.
Most bands have one sound throughout their entire career. U2 has had at least 3 drastic and distinct changes in direction(1984, 1991 and 2001) and all have been EXTREMELY SUCCESSFUL if you ask me, along with most fans and most critics.
So they already have the most diverse sound of almost any band in history as a baseline and so many of their hardcore fan base here still insists they need a complete overhaul in order for them to truly make another great album. Give me a break!
I also don't get the false leap being made from "U2 has reexamined the left field side of NLOTH and blames it for the tepid commercial response" to "fuck all of us, they're now going back to HTDAAB and singing about intellectual tortoises and tops of newborns heads."
War was on the radio and good.UF was on the radio and good. Same for AB. Same for JT. Same for R&H. Same for some songs on ATYCLB and HTDAAB.
The only real left field songs, in terms of challenging to play, hard to digest, etc on NLOTH would be Fez/BB(an average song at best, I think), Unknown Caller and Moment of Surrender. Of the 3, they've done 2 extensively live. Moment of Surrender they seem to absolutely love.
The title track and Magnificent seem to kind of walk the line between the U2 we are used to and left field, and both tracks seem to be very well liked by U2 and were received extremely well. I'd be surprised if they were looking at tracks 1-3 of NLOTH as any part of the problem whatsoever.
I would bet any amount of money they're thinking of UC(was just awkward in every way), Fez-BB(see UC) and maybe Cedars as the culprits. I would disagree with them on Cedars.
White As Snow (even Cedars too)isn't that far out there for people familiar with TUF and the B-side material on the Joshua Tree. Nor is it a particularly out there, left field arrangement. It's just a softer, country tinged ballad, more in the vein of the Eagles and Springsteen than U2, but still very mainstream sounding.
Magnificent and Breathe are, in my opinion, the best songs on the album after the title track and MOS.
Crazy Tonight is good if a bit cheesy for my taste, and I think with GOYB and SUC, it becomes very clear after a few listens that these songs fall well short of U2 standards.
Who knows, ultimately, what they are thinking, but the remix version of Crazy(with the distracting stage effects) and the suspicious lack of any acknowledgement of SUC(as BVS points out) indicates they're just as likely to be thinking of these songs as they are some of the more ambient stuff.
All I care is that it's good.
I love U2's sound, all aspects of it, and don't think they need to become another band entirely to be good.
Most bands have one sound throughout their entire career. U2 has had at least 3 drastic and distinct changes in direction(1984, 1991 and 2001) and all have been EXTREMELY SUCCESSFUL if you ask me, along with most fans and most critics.
So they already have the most diverse sound of almost any band in history as a baseline and so many of their hardcore fan base here still insists they need a complete overhaul in order for them to truly make another great album. Give me a break!
I also don't get the false leap being made from "U2 has reexamined the left field side of NLOTH and blames it for the tepid commercial response" to "fuck all of us, they're now going back to HTDAAB and singing about intellectual tortoises and tops of newborns heads."
War was on the radio and good.UF was on the radio and good. Same for AB. Same for JT. Same for R&H. Same for some songs on ATYCLB and HTDAAB.
The only real left field songs, in terms of challenging to play, hard to digest, etc on NLOTH would be Fez/BB(an average song at best, I think), Unknown Caller and Moment of Surrender. Of the 3, they've done 2 extensively live. Moment of Surrender they seem to absolutely love.
The title track and Magnificent seem to kind of walk the line between the U2 we are used to and left field, and both tracks seem to be very well liked by U2 and were received extremely well. I'd be surprised if they were looking at tracks 1-3 of NLOTH as any part of the problem whatsoever.
I would bet any amount of money they're thinking of UC(was just awkward in every way), Fez-BB(see UC) and maybe Cedars as the culprits. I would disagree with them on Cedars.
White As Snow (even Cedars too)isn't that far out there for people familiar with TUF and the B-side material on the Joshua Tree. Nor is it a particularly out there, left field arrangement. It's just a softer, country tinged ballad, more in the vein of the Eagles and Springsteen than U2, but still very mainstream sounding.
Magnificent and Breathe are, in my opinion, the best songs on the album after the title track and MOS.
Crazy Tonight is good if a bit cheesy for my taste, and I think with GOYB and SUC, it becomes very clear after a few listens that these songs fall well short of U2 standards.
Who knows, ultimately, what they are thinking, but the remix version of Crazy(with the distracting stage effects) and the suspicious lack of any acknowledgement of SUC(as BVS points out) indicates they're just as likely to be thinking of these songs as they are some of the more ambient stuff.
Bollocks. I bet there are plenty of songs that given a bit of time, even a very short period of time - just enough to be removed from being caught up in the creation - that they look back on with more than a bit of
The band has talked about that feeling with "is that all"....Red Light is probably another example that I think they mentioned.
Last edited:
bonocomet
Blue Crack Distributor
Ah, good lord! I haven't ever seen that first video.
What they’ve got there with Magnificent is great. Imagine it starting out a bit like that, tighter and cleaner obviously, and then slowly building and evolving until its become the synth-disco thing we have now at the end. East into West or some shit. That would have been something really good, and pretty unique, and possibly the missing thing or spirit that song desperately needs. Along with better lyrics.
And with UC, right in that video they’ve pretty much captured the moment where that song went south. That first burst of it is really nice. Really nice. Then it cuts, and they’re playing the song at the speed (and in the more boring way) we know it now.
Why U2, WHY?!?!?
I think that first clip is an example of what Brian Eno was talking about in that interview where he talks about them recording in Fez with other musicians. He says it was a fantastic experience, BUT he felt it sounded too exotic, a "different musical language" and "self consciously worldy".
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
Really? You think it's that clear cut? U2's never second guessed themselves after releasing an album?
Please...
bonocomet
Blue Crack Distributor
This isn't the interview I was talking about, but the beginning of it has a piece I hadn't heard before with Bono's vocals.
YouTube - U2 - Leftovers On The Horizon
YouTube - U2 - Leftovers On The Horizon
Inner El Guapo
War Child
- Joined
- Sep 22, 2004
- Messages
- 609
I don't mean to be the 4th person to object (piling on) but it must be said...
Have you ever done anything creative like paint a picture, write a poem, make a short film, write a song or write a short story, etc.?
If you have, then you absolutely would know the feeling of seeing something that you yourself did, perhaps minutes, hours, days, weeks, months, years later and said "my God that is shitty!"
When you are creating, you are caught up in the feeling of creating.
You are too clouded to be objective about the creation.
This PRECISELY why long studio session will doom most any album.
This was the same argument made around 2004 about song selection (Native Son vs Vertigo, Xanax vs Fast Cars, ABOY alt vs ABOY htdaab, etc.).
If U2 put it on there, then it 'must' have been better...uh, no.
However, with all that said - it must be said, that at the time they delivered that album to the label (I would say around the first of Dec, end of Nov in 2008) that they did think it was good enough.
Just like they were comfortable with all those Chris Thomas versions for about a year before dumping them and rebooting. SUC< I would guess (can't recall) was one of the late comers in the 'delay', along with Crazy Tonight. It was called For Your Love, that much I do remember. and my gut feeling is, a better lyrical take would save that song a lot of the grief it receives.
P.S.
The reason it wasn't played live - IMO - was because they knew they made a mistake a few months (if not earlier) after they handed that album over to the label. By then, it was too late.
Zooropa man
Refugee
Ah, good lord! I haven't ever seen that first video.
What they’ve got there with Magnificent is great. Imagine it starting out a bit like that, tighter and cleaner obviously, and then slowly building and evolving until its become the synth-disco thing we have now at the end. East into West or some shit. That would have been something really good, and pretty unique, and possibly the missing thing or spirit that song desperately needs. Along with better lyrics.
And with UC, right in that video they’ve pretty much captured the moment where that song went south. That first burst of it is really nice. Really nice. Then it cuts, and they’re playing the song at the speed (and in the more boring way) we know it now.
Why U2, WHY?!?!?
Although I think that UC is one of the best songs on NLOH (lyrics... mmm, could be better?)... I think this clips captures it in its raw state. I like what they were doing there. It could have gone another notch. But again, they mess with things too much and there you have it... the version that is on the album.
bonocomet
Blue Crack Distributor
Except that in the case of HTDAAB they did make the right choices. 
I am SO glad they didn't choose Native Son. That song is so mundane compared to Vertigo.
I am SO glad they didn't choose Native Son. That song is so mundane compared to Vertigo.
Zooropa man
Refugee
I hadn't heard/seen this one in a while. Here is another good example I think, of the rawness of those sessions. They where good! I love that riff, very dark and I could see it going somewhere... Oh well.
arzcrack
The Fly
Earnie Shavers said:Ah, good lord! I haven't ever seen that first video.
What they’ve got there with Magnificent is great. Imagine it starting out a bit like that, tighter and cleaner obviously, and then slowly building and evolving until its become the synth-disco thing we have now at the end. East into West or some shit. That would have been something really good, and pretty unique, and possibly the missing thing or spirit that song desperately needs. Along with better lyrics.
And with UC, right in that video they’ve pretty much captured the moment where that song went south. That first burst of it is really nice. Really nice. Then it cuts, and they’re playing the song at the speed (and in the more boring way) we know it now.
Why U2, WHY?!?!?
Maybe I've just fallen out of love with the album and it's songs, but those early versions on the video have a great sound. Magnificent with the extra percussion sounds awesome, and dare I say, Moroccan (remember that was an influence we were meant to hear on the album). I agree with Earnie that unknown caller initially had a raw energetic feel that seems superior to the finished product. Interesting also hearing the boys sing the different lyrics to unknown caller, they seem more personal.
It would seem from these clips that the band gave themselves too much rope to hang themselves ie lots of time, additional production, over-thinking the lyrics etc. It's interesting that these songs also seem better without lyrics, too. The lyrics were all too clever, and ultimately were disjointed and meaningless and therefore difficult to identify with. 'stop helping god across the road, like a little old lady... I was running down the road like loose electricity... That's someone's stuff they're blowing up, we're into growing up...' could go on all day with crap lyrics.
With a bit of luck, the new album that may or may not exist, will be different, hopefully rawer (ie guitar, bass drums, vocals, percussion; not unlike the video clips) with lyrics that aren't too clever.
bonocomet
Blue Crack Distributor
Well like I was saying before, Brian Eno flat out said they decided they did not want to sound like those Moroccan influences. He felt (and he says they all agreed) that it sounded as if that sound was sort of tacked on to U2's sound.
Also I think the "running down the road like loose electricity" lyric is fantastic!
arzcrack
The Fly
bonocomet said:
While the band in my head plays a striptease?!?
Breathe is not the worst offender, I can definitely agree on that.
chrissybaby
Refugee
That video upsets me...
bonocomet
Blue Crack Distributor
Well you hadn't quoted that line before, but yeah even that is fine!
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
Latest posts
-
-
-
-
-
-
Ongoing Mass Shooting Thread #3... that's right, a third thread. Because 'Murica.- Latest: MrsSpringsteen
-
-