lazarus said:
The recording of the album started before all that stuff was big enough for them to be bandwagoners. There's nothing wrong with being aware with what's going on and taking a hint or two.
No one said they didn't do promotion before, they were just a little more creative about it. The videos from Achtung weren't low budget, but they were also good, something I'd have a hard time saying about all but 1 or 2 of post-2000 U2.
Your lone exception of Wild Horses aside, those Pop remakes were at that point the beginning of damage control. Last Night on Earth wasn't until, what, summer 1997, when they were already panicking. So I don't know what your point here is. This is likely something that McGuinne$$ pushed for himself.
Also, what's wrong with being elastic with the music? Perhaps we have different ideas of what "calculated" and "opportunistic" mean, but I don't think dance remixes of U2 songs are made to get club kids or ravers to buy rock albums. Just because you might like dancing a Perfecto remix doesn't mean you're going to sign up for an album's worth of stuff that sounds NOTHING like it. I think it's an opportunity to let other artists work with the material, and perhaps an exchange of ideas take place. Who's the cynical one here?
We're talking about the band that cleared little money from the ZooTV tour, right? Just making sure. I highly doubt that plan was to PMcG's preferences. Again, no one is saying they aren't interested in living a comfortable life. Stop concocting strawman arguments that you can easily knock down. You always do this, and look like a fool each time.
I said earlier that it was the band's success that gave them the leverage to go against what were likely objections from PMcG. He didn't "let" them do anything. But when Pop and Popmart blew up in their faces (the way they saw it, at least), they probably looked at him to clean up the mess, and were more likely to follow his suggestions at that point.
Christ, what is it that you DO like? You rant against the people who long for the 90's aesthetic and daring, and then go off on their 00's ethos as well. You prefer to turn the clock way back and have the pompous, righteous freedom fighters from the 80's?
As for them "betraying" themselves with Achtung and ZooTV, that's so ridiculous I don't know what to start. It's as if you haven't read a single book or interview, and have no clue as to the corner they had painted themselves into by the end of 1989. Exploring a different side of yourself (or the world around you) isn't a betrayal, it's looking for the whole truth.
All I can say is, thank god you're not in charge.
How was looking at the surge of pop music in the 00's is that different to looking at what was going on in the 90's ? If U2 was all about money when they made ATYCLB, why not make the same assumption on their 90's albums ? They looked at the hot music at the time just as much.
I never said no one said they didn't do promotion before, it's just tiring to see the "sell out! media whores!" crying when NOTHING changed - this is U2 we're talking about. In fact I'd say the 40+ year old bunch of whiteys in a rock band needs promotion more than ever in the US (AB was selling by the truckloads, videos or not. In comparison, I think the success of Beautiful day and Vertigo did play a part in the last two albums's sales). And I consider an Ipod lots more creative than any video (read Flanagan's book on them offering their music and cutting the middle man). Most of U2's albums are released in the Fall, it's not some evil McMoney schemed plot, that is so far fetched it's not even funny.
Um, my point was the re-recording of songs and single remixes didn't start in the much viled 00's. And I dubt McGuiness said "right guys, let's re-record the singles". You know the history of Pop better than that to be spouting stuff like this.
Interesting, I think the remixes are a lot about getting the kids into your music, yes. You think the kids in the early 90's didn't hear the remix of, say, MW and think "I like this song. Who's this?" and then gone out and bought the album ?
Um, we're also talking about a band that was guaranteed millions of dollars - 100 million bucks no matter how much the shows earned if I remember right - by their promoter for Popmart (you know, the band didn't start earning money on tours with the last two tours). I was replying to your weak "McGuiness is evil" argument and unbiased assumptions about him, which don't hold water. Again, I don't think many managers - or labels, even - would let a major rock band get away with AB, and especially Zooropa, Passengers and Pop (I wonder what role Interscope, their label since 2000 in the US had with the marketing though). But keep telling yourself "McCash hated it and bossed the band around after Pop" if you like. You're the one that keeps saying the same cheap shots they needed - and had - his approval and guidance for the marketing post Pop, and fail to bring up evidence.
His role was, first and foremost, as interviews will tell you, get the record deal. Second, he got them the complete freedom to album making (choice of producer, cover... everything) and more importantly, complete back catalog rights. Does he want them making money ? Show me a manager that doesn't. Does he dictate their promotion ? No (this is not to say he doesn't give his input on any given deal). We know they make the big decisions together as a band.
Yes, a lot of it was betraying. How many times did we hear the "but they didn't care about the critics in the 90's" line yet the biggest change in their career happened BECAUSE they listened to critisism. Sure they may have been tired of making that kind of music, but I doubt the whole stage personas thing and the new relaxed, "cool" (trying hard with the cliche definition of cool isn't cool) image would be done as radically if it wasn't for the "preachy" JT era U2.
We're having fun, dancing with female fans and spraying champagne huh ? I'd say Bono having a glass of wine with Ali on stage or Dalton Brothers proved the band can loosen up already (and it wasn't an each night, scripted - I mean spontaneous - thing).
Thanks to the whole "let's not be an 80s band anymore" they also skipped 3 albums worth of material on tour which started a trend of not playing much of their early material for the whole decade. But we got the B I G tours for it. Speaking of tours, can you see post 1991 U2 actually saying "we got burned by the US so we won't go touring there?" ?
And we have that era to thank for the oceans of remixes since.
And I think the band, especially Bono, still hasn't got out of their "Fly" stage (the leather, the shades, the lengthy album making, the smirking, the poses on photos, the need to be accepted by a young audience). I guess it doesn't help things if you have the pink shades firmly on when it comes to the 90's though.