Have U2's 21st century releases done irreparable damage to their legacy?

[womanfish]

Goddamn, this is an astute observation!

Working up interesting sounds and arrangements requires them to be locked up together, but focusing on "the craft" gives them an out. It lets them have more rounded lives. Or it lets them be lazier artists. Depends on how charitable you want to be.

Do they really think the songs on SOI/E are better written than Achtung or the Joshua Tree though? I think that their best songwriting occurred when they had the coolest sounds and most interesting arrangements.

I think they may be technically "better written" if you are going by whatever benchmark that Rick Ruben is talking about. But not to sound lame, U2 seems to have always been about capturing the magic. And that magic only happens when you have the band together to push, pull, inject new ideas and sounds, argue, hit a stride, go off on a 10 minute piece of some trash and some treasure, all in real time.
Not, one person sending a bass line to another, who says, yeah, maybe this guitar riff would work with it, and I've got some lyrics from last month that might fit... And then have several producers try and piece it together.

So when DeVaul said, that they are making good music now, but not as often great. I think that is what we are talking about. I mean, can God walk in the room when they are all in different rooms most of the time?

I would hope that now hitting 60ish, with kids grown, that maybe they might see "getting the band back together" as an adventure and new creative journey that takes them away from their day to day. We shall see.

 

[typhoon]

The Beatles and Imagine Dragons are the only rock bands in the top 70. Only 8 rock bands are in the top 100, and only 70 rock(ish) artists are in the top 500. The majority of those are in the bottom 200 (300-500) spots. I will say that some are surprisingly high, some surprisingly low and some surprisingly not charting at all

Oh my God, this post made me feel a million years old. I knew rock was dead, but wow. I died inside realizing that the only time a young person listens to Oasis is “Wonderwall” and ironically and that there’s a generation of kids who don’t even know the Who as the CSI theme song guys. If there’s a bustle in their hedgerow, are they gonna be alarmed now? There’s no way to be sure.

 

[LemonMelon]

In order to be a "well-written" song, good lyrics are required. I wish Bono would write some of those, but they are growingly infrequent.

Instead of sitting down at the piano and trying to write the next undeniable pop hook a la Beautiful Day, maybe they should just jam and see what happens. Mysterious Ways, arguably the catchiest song on Achtung Baby, was built from the bass line up.

 

[DeVaul]

Most (if not all) of us much prefer the developments out of Bongolese than the trite attempts at sloganeering.

Signed,
An intellectual tortoise that smells like the top of a little old refujesus

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Honestly sometimes it's just harder to be as inspired when you're old, fat and rich with happy home lives and all that.

There's no Troubles to write about. Bono's mom's been dead for 40 years. The Edge isn't getting divorced. They're not coming off a massively expensive tour that suffers through poor attendance. No drug problems. Nothing left to prove.

They've also reinvented themselves so often that it's hard to do anything that doesn't sound repetitive and/or pandering.

 

[LuckyNumber7]

Honestly sometimes it's just harder to be as inspired when you're old, fat and rich with happy home lives and all that.

There's no Troubles to write about. Bono's mom's been dead for 40 years. The Edge isn't getting divorced. They're not coming off a massively expensive tour that suffers through poor attendance. No drug problems. Nothing left to prove.

They've also reinvented themselves so often that it's hard to do anything that doesn't sound repetitive and/or pandering.

Amen. Which is why I’m cool with whatever they make, since they don’t really have to make anything anymore.

 

[womanfish]

Ok, someone here go seduce Edge's wife and see if we can't get some creativity flowing!

 

[DeVaul]

Honestly sometimes it's just harder to be as inspired when you're old, fat and rich with happy home lives and all that.

There's no Troubles to write about. Bono's mom's been dead for 40 years. The Edge isn't getting divorced. They're not coming off a massively expensive tour that suffers through poor attendance. No drug problems. Nothing left to prove.

They've also reinvented themselves so often that it's hard to do anything that doesn't sound repetitive and/or pandering.

Music for music’s sake, as opposed to a huge statement/ last stab at relevance/ reinventing themselves, would be a welcome change as they ease into the final era of their career.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Music for music’s sake, as opposed to a huge statement/ last stab at relevance/ reinventing themselves, would be a welcome change as they ease into the final era of their career.

absolutely and i think we all want that.

but even with that - there's no saying that the music they want to do matches with what the fans want, because some fans came up with the white flag waiving post punk band, some with the earnest atmospheric band, some came with the industrial/experimental band, and some came up with the back to basics early 2000s.

so they'll never please everyone.

 

[DeVaul]

absolutely and i think we all want that.



but even with that - there's no saying that the music they want to do matches with what the fans want, because some fans came up with the white flag waiving post punk band, some with the earnest atmospheric band, some came with the industrial/experimental band, and some came up with the back to basics early 2000s.



so they'll never please everyone.

I’ll go for whatever will come off the least embarrassing and most compelling, which likely negates at least two of those options.

 

[LemonMelon]

Honestly sometimes it's just harder to be as inspired when you're old, fat and rich with happy home lives and all that.

There's no Troubles to write about. Bono's mom's been dead for 40 years. The Edge isn't getting divorced. They're not coming off a massively expensive tour that suffers through poor attendance. No drug problems. Nothing left to prove.

They've also reinvented themselves so often that it's hard to do anything that doesn't sound repetitive and/or pandering.

 

[ferball415]

Someone else should sit them down and say "yea but the great sounds and arrangements is what made you great you big dummies"

I do think there's a chance, if they allowed themselves the chance, that the focus on songwriting could lead themselves back to another classic album if they were to go back to the right producer who steers them back towards what made them great. Maybe it's Eno again, maybe it's someone new. It sure ain't Ryan Tedder.

But the band needs to be open to it and not, ya know, chasing hits.

Yes. And Rick Rubin would have done well to take a look at the tracklist of Best of 1980-1990 alone before saying something so preposterously imbecilic.

 

[womanfish]

Yes. And Rick Rubin would have done well to take a look at the tracklist of Best of 1980-1990 alone before saying something so preposterously imbecilic.

I do think it's very odd. First, I don't think U2 has a TON of songs that are that waaay out of the normal songwriting structure. And if you look at other groups he's worked with, it's not like many of those groups don't have songs that are a bit out of the ordinary. Chili Peppers, Rage, System of A Down, Mars Volta, NIN, Beastie Boys, and lots of rap.

So I don't really get why someone with this wide background of artists would level a comment like that at them. Does he think that Pink Floyd, Zeppelin and Queen don't have "songs" Just baffles me.

 

[ferball415]

As though any of those bands are known for their downright McCartney-esque output.

 

[ferball415]

Utilizing a golden era-Simpsons GIF is poignant here actually.

 

[cobl04]

Honestly sometimes it's just harder to be as inspired when you're old, fat and rich with happy home lives and all that.

There's no Troubles to write about. Bono's mom's been dead for 40 years. The Edge isn't getting divorced. They're not coming off a massively expensive tour that suffers through poor attendance. No drug problems. Nothing left to prove.

They've also reinvented themselves so often that it's hard to do anything that doesn't sound repetitive and/or pandering.

I think it's this, combined with their stubborn desire to remain relevant, and the likelihood that they surround themselves with yes men, that means we're only getting crap now.

I actually think some of the philosophy behind what they have tried to write of late is great - think about if you're dead, write vignettes - but the execution from Bono is sorely lacking and the rest of the band seems to have stopped caring.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

I think it's this, combined with their stubborn desire to remain relevant, and the likelihood that they surround themselves with yes men, that means we're only getting crap now.

I actually think some of the philosophy behind what they have tried to write of late is great - think about if you're dead, write vignettes - but the execution from Bono is sorely lacking and the rest of the band seems to have stopped caring.

i have less issues with Bono and his lyrics than i do with the Edge completely giving up.

yes, there have been some Bono clunkers - but Edge has gone missing since Songs of Innocence. Most of the interesting guitar parts on Experience were written by someone else, and even though i have a more favorable opinion of this most recent track than most around here, there's zero doubt that The Edge is MIA on the track.

We've heard a lot about how Edge doesn't want to repeat himself, and how they almost through the Beautiful Day riff out because it was repetitive, and blah blah blah. But someone needs to speak with this man.

 

[Hewson]

Yeah Edge's guitar belongs on a milk carton at this point.

 

[ferball415]

"Alex Descends into Hell for a Carton of Milk with Edge's Guitar on It"

 

[womanfish]

i have less issues with Bono and his lyrics than i do with the Edge completely giving up.

yes, there have been some Bono clunkers - but Edge has gone missing since Songs of Innocence. Most of the interesting guitar parts on Experience were written by someone else, and even though i have a more favorable opinion of this most recent track than most around here, there's zero doubt that The Edge is MIA on the track.

We've heard a lot about how Edge doesn't want to repeat himself, and how they almost through the Beautiful Day riff out because it was repetitive, and blah blah blah. But someone needs to speak with this man.

Yes sir. This really seems to be a big part of the issue. Edge doing some more unique and interesting things, along with just being more prominent overall changes the whole dynamic and can make up for a multitude of Bono's sins. I'm kinda baffled that this whole time off and covid time, wouldn't just be a jackpot of cool new Edge sounds and ideas. I guess we'll find out, but I'm not holding my breath.

Frustrating.

 

[mikal]

Yes sir. This really seems to be a big part of the issue. Edge doing some more unique and interesting things, along with just being more prominent overall changes the whole dynamic and can make up for a multitude of Bono's sins. I'm kinda baffled that this whole time off and covid time, wouldn't just be a jackpot of cool new Edge sounds and ideas. I guess we'll find out, but I'm not holding my breath.

Frustrating.

What's crazy about it is that when you really dig in, SOI is one of Edge's best albums in the last 20 years. Lots of new techniques and territories, and then he went away.

 

[ferball415]

mikal, very random question: do you remember the night you watched about 7 concert videos in a row?

 

[ferball415]

Because I searched "dortmund" last night, and you saying you had was a result.

 

[mikal]

Haha I have zero recollection of this.

 

[lazarus]

Yeah Edge's guitar belongs on a milk carton at this point.

"Alex Descends into Hell for a Carton of Milk with Edge's Guitar on It"

Disappearance of the Stingray Guitar

 

[ferball415]

 

[ferball415]

Haha I have zero recollection of this.

Oh, it happened alright...

Must've been for Bono's 45th.

 

[womanfish]

What's crazy about it is that when you really dig in, SOI is one of Edge's best albums in the last 20 years. Lots of new techniques and territories, and then he went away.

yeah, I agree that Edge has some great moments on SOI.
Sleep like a Baby in particular is very cool.
Volcano, Iris, RBW, Cedarwood, Miracle, Reach...

It's strange - I think the difference is that he's there a LOT more than you might realize, because he isn't really showcased in any song. I think U2 albums have so often had Edge solo's, that when he doesn't do them, it makes it seem as though he disappeared, but he is very much there all throughout SOI in a good way.

Adam truly does seem to be the hero of SOI though. Damn, some really great showcases of him.

 

[mikal]

Edge's guitar solo on Lights Of Home could have been really good, but for some reason the percussion doesn't pick up with the solo if that makes sense. Total missed opportunity on that song to add some dynamics, but instead the guitar solo drags and almost feels like it slows the song down. Hard to explain.

 

[lazarus]

Ehh, I've heard enough Edge slide solos to last a lifetime. That one doesn't even seem close to adding anything new.