Have U2's 21st century releases done irreparable damage to their legacy?

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Vertigo, Streets, and Beautiful Day. Not one person in my section complained or mentioned the iTunes thing.
 
lazarus said:
You're right; SOI could have been the fourth moment and a rebound from No Line's lack of popularity, but SOE was likely not going to make up for that debacle.

They'd sure be in a better place than they are now, though, had they not picked one-two garbage punch of Best Thing and Get Out.
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I don’t know if those sort of moments will happen now as the industry has changed so much and continues to change all the time. I think we have to realign exactly what counts as one of those “moments” which Beautiful Day clearly was.

The fact they’re still selling out concerts which are showcasing their latest material and are still getting decent reviews for those new albums is as good as its going to get and I think shows they’re not living on past glories or have become a pastiche of themselves.

I still think there’s a few songs on SOI & SOE which, with the right combination of events (or a remix catching-on), could have blown up in to a traditional BIG song with lots of airplay, but it just didn’t happen.

I’ll be honest though, I also don’t know if something like that did happen, how I’d even know about it these days.
 
ascender_RS said:
I still think there’s a few songs on SOI & SOE which, with the right combination of events (or a remix catching-on), could have blown up in to a traditional BIG song with lots of airplay, but it just didn’t happen.
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True but this just doesn’t happen anymore. Due to the fractured world of streaming, you just don’t get BIG songs any longer. Pity.
 
So since it's been a bit quiet here, and I was trying to do something to avoid working for a bit, I got to thinking about the Rolling Stone streaming chart. Yes, it's funny to poke fun at U2 for being there by Bon Jovi and Phil Collins, but I thought I would take a deeper dive to get a little perspective on the bands that are on and not on the list, and what it means in respect to U2's "legacy".

I started by just jotting down sort of classic bands and artists that I felt have a legacy, are just big ever present entities (ie. Stones, Queen, Bruce, Prince, etc...) Then I added some other bands and artists that had their time of big success and had some staying power (Police, Pumpkins, Alanis, etc...) And also included bands that you could sort of put in the same atmosphere as U2 (Green day, Peppers, Coldplay, REM, etc...)

Then I also looked at "rock" or at least rock adjacent artists and how they stacked up in general on the list.

I then noted if that artist or group had a new album, or are touring, which would definitely give some boost to their current numbers.

Here's what I found. I know there will be some notable ones I missed or didn't include. I only have so much time. LOL


The Beatles and Imagine Dragons are the only rock bands in the top 70. Only 8 rock bands are in the top 100, and only 70 rock(ish) artists are in the top 500. The majority of those are in the bottom 200 (300-500) spots. I will say that some are surprisingly high, some surprisingly low and some surprisingly not charting at all


Fleetwood – 71 –Tik Tok thing
Queen – 74
AC/DC – 85
Coldplay – 87 –- Newer album and touring
Rolling Stones – 98 –touring
Michael Jackson –102
Eagles – 105 –touring
Metallica 110 –touring
Peppers 128 – touring
Elton John – 132 –touring
Nirvana – 134
Green Day – 135 –touring
Zep – 136
Tom Petty – 140
Floyd – 158
Mariah – 203
GnR – 208 –- touring
Aerosmith – 262 – touring
Van Halen – 278
Foos – 287 – New album and touring
Garth Brooks – 297
Beach Boys – 316
Pearl Jam – 333 – touring
Whitney Houston – 358
Bon Jovi – 359
Alice in Chains – 370 - touring
Def Lep – 371– touring
Radiohead – 379
Bruce – 383
Bowie – 384
U2 – 386
Phil Collins – 389
Prince – 408
Madonna – 443
Bob Dylan – 453
Beastie – 454
Police – 458
Dave Matthews – 476 -touring
Doors – 479
Smashing Pumpkins – 480


REM – Not on chart
The Who – Not on chart
Cure – Not on chart
Depeche Mode – Not on chart
Ramones – Not on chart
Rush – Not on chart
Clash – Not on chart
Matchbox 20 – Not on chart
Stone temple – Not on chart
Soundgarden – Not on chart
The Pixies – Not on chart
Oasis – Not on chart
Counting Crows – Not on chart
Jimmy Hendrix – Not on chart
Eric Clapton – Not on chart
Tina Turner – Not on chart
Creed – Not on chart
Hootie – Not on chart
George Michael – Not on chart
Alanis Morrisette – Not on chart
Shania Twain – Not on chart

So in the end I found it sort of interesting. First U2 is over 3 years off a new album and over 2 years off of touring.

It seems that there are sort of "tiers" of groups. You have the top 100 type. The very solidified classics like Fleetwood, Stones, Beatles, Queen, AC/DC (which surprised me a bit)

Then you have the mid 100's where you have bands that have been around a long time, and have retained their "cool factor" with few missteps. (Green Day, Peppers, Metallica) Along with stalwarts like Zep, Petty and Nirvana (actually thought Nirvana and Zeppelin would be a bit higher)


Then you have a batch in the high 200's. Sort of that straight rock that people can come back to again and again (GnR, Aerosmith, Van Halen, Foos) almost all of them are currently touring as well.

Then you hit the 300's. Lots of big names here. Yes Bon Jovi, But also Pearl Jam, Radiohead, Bruce and Bowie - Oh, and U2 :).

In the 400's you have Prince (pretty damn low from what I expected),Madonna, Bob Dylan,
Beastie Boys, The Police, etc...

Then some that didn't chart at all

REM, Clapton, The Who, Oasis, Hendrix...

So its really hard to say here what it all means. Obviously U2 is charting right along side or above some of the biggest names in rock history. They are also charting below some of their current rock "contemporaries".

One thing I have always said is that a big strike against U2 in general is that fact that they have never fit into a specific genre.

Green Day, Peppers, Nirvana, Pear Jam, Radiohead... They are solidly alternative.

Stones, Beatles, Fleetwood, Queen, AC/DC, Aerosmith, VanHalen, GnR. Solidly Classic Rock

U2, has a dash of classic rock, a dash of alternative, a dash of pop, a dash of experimental type stuff (Not to mention offroads into blues, country, dance and singing with Pavorati)

obviously the majority of the chart being Pop, rap, R&B, and country. U2 has their base of fans, and another layer of more general public semi-fans. But not neatly fitting into a set genre I do think makes their standing over time falter.

Anyway, it was fun to look at.

Thoughts?
 
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:love:
mikal said:
I like Twitter and primarily use it to troll Jim Jordan, ...
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you troll Jum Jordan?!
Baaahahahahaaaaaaa! :hyper: :lol::lol: :applaud::applaud:
omg! Does his office respond to you?

Hollow Island said:
There are plenty of big songs. It's just that none of them are even remotely "rock"
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This is true.

I love NLOTH. I like SOI (w a few great songs).
I love SOE.
So glad I got to see the tours, plus JT redux.

(and :yikes: that bike accident! [being a NYC'r, ant that it happened in CP made it even more sharp for me]
LOFH definitely talked about that.)
I'll have to think on The Blackout.
(certainly had some Anti-drumph stuff in it.
Actually did Bono say 'the dinosaur' refered to the band?)
 
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On Twitter, Nasir the 2nd, who says that "if you got a man, please don't follow me. Ima block you" mentioned U2's album on his phone today.

This one is big.
 
mikal said:
On Twitter, Nasir the 2nd, who says that "if you got a man, please don't follow me. Ima block you" mentioned U2's album on his phone today.

This one is big.
Click to expand...



This legit made me LOL in my office!!!!!
 
I think the Apple SOI mess hurt their image, but so did the South Park episode and their association with the Spiderman musical. Both of those no real fault of their own but they were trending towards punchline status for a bit before leaning into it unfortunately. And any chance of them digging their way out was derailed by the bike accident. I remember watching them perform Every Breaking Wave at the Europe VMA's and thinking they could change the narrative and get back on track with a few more media appearances like this. But I guess we will never know.
 
marvelocity said:
I think the Apple SOI mess hurt their image, but so did the South Park episode and their association with the Spiderman musical. Both of those no real fault of their own but they were trending towards punchline status for a bit before leaning into it unfortunately. And any chance of them digging their way out was derailed by the bike accident. I remember watching them perform Every Breaking Wave at the Europe VMA's and thinking they could change the narrative and get back on track with a few more media appearances like this. But I guess we will never know.
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Yeah, I don't know about the South Park thing, but just watch that EMA performance, and then realize that the accident happened a week later. Just such a kick in the crotch.
That accident truly changed the trajectory of the band. I mean, the iphone thing sent it off course and then the accident made it so it couldn't correct.

Would be interesting to think of what might have been if a piano version of Every Breaking Wave was the first single, and it had a vocal performance from Bono like the one from the EMA's. (The acoustic version from the deluxe SOI has pretty shaky vocals and is nowhere near this performance)
They would have had their week long stint on The Tonight Show, and probably other promotional gigs before the tour started.
And in the long run, I think it would have made a difference in Bono's overall condition moving forward.

But here we are.
 
womanfish said:
Yeah, I don't know about the South Park thing, but just watch that EMA performance, and then realize that the accident happened a week later. Just such a kick in the crotch.
That accident truly changed the trajectory of the band. I mean, the iphone thing sent it off course and then the accident made it so it couldn't correct.

Would be interesting to think of what might have been if a piano version of Every Breaking Wave was the first single, and it had a vocal performance from Bono like the one from the EMA's. (The acoustic version from the deluxe SOI has pretty shaky vocals and is nowhere near this performance)
They would have had their week long stint on The Tonight Show, and probably other promotional gigs before the tour started.
And in the long run, I think it would have made a difference in Bono's overall condition moving forward.

But here we are.
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i've heard the south park thing before - and i don't discount it, but also don't necessarily agree. south park made/makes fun of absolutely everything and everyone.

spiderman? yeaaa i can see that more than the south park thing. they took a bit of a beating there, and deservedly so.

the itunes thing was different, though - it was less about U2 being lame or people not liking their music. people were/are genuinely annoyed at the invasion of privacy element of the entire thing.

what i do fully agree with is this idea that the bike accident derailed any chance of digging out of the mess right there in the moment. i have zero doubt that it would have been addressed, and i'm sure they would have been able to poke some fun at themselves over it, apologize a bit and lessen the blow. it would have also allowed them to show the music in a different light - u2 are always better live.

i think i shared this here once before - but there was a skit planned involving U2, Fallon's team and Unforgettable Fire that was supposed to be filmed that Tuesday at a club in Times Square. I was working for UF at the time and had gotten the news that Friday. i had already taken the day off and was getting pretty pumped about the possibility of seeing and interacting with the band in an up-close and imitate setting.

and then, welp, bono went and smashed his face into the ground and everything was called off.

i have no idea what the sketch was going to be - never got to that point. it was set to take place upstairs in the Klub 45 space at Connolly's Pub on 45th Street.

obviously as a fan we were all super concerned for bono's health - but after it was clear that he was going to be okay it turned into being super bummed about the missed opportunity (and having to keep that opportunity to myself for a while).

obviously UF (and myself) would go on to have an rather up-close and intimate moment with Adam and Edge when they showed up for the @U2 25th Anniversary show unexpectedly a few months later - which, i mean, obviously made up for the missed opportunity the first time around.
 
People still remember Bono is a giant turd but they hardly know who Bono is enough to care.

SOI was way more damaging to “U2”. The South Park stuff has faded. There’s a whole generation (people my age, particularly) tainted by SOI.
 
mikal said:
This tweet proves that U2 were simply ahead of their time, realizing that these snotty kids who were all pissed off will become moms and dads 7 years later and suddenly freaking love U2!

https://twitter.com/sheluvsreezy/status/1435552364161863680?s=20
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Strange, I was actually going to post about this same sentiment a week ago. Someone posted about they wouldn't even realize if new music was released.

This was U2's point at the time. The music landscape had become so crowded and scattered at the same time, that new stuff that isn't from very current names just kind of slips by. And yes it was in a way ahead of their time, as now, "getting a free album" doesn't even exist anymore. Go ahead and put an album on by a band on Apple Music and then what happens? That album ends and you start getting random music played that Apple deems "similar artists".

Apple doesn't just have everything there for you to stream at any time for 10 bucks a month, but they also have your library in their cloud. Talk about privacy. Yes, I know, consent and all that. I mean, we are nothing if not sticklers for reading pages and pages of fine print before consenting. :huh:

This isn't a defense of how U2 and Apple went about it, it was obviously a mistake which could have been easily avoided while still getting nearly the same result. But now looking at it again with streaming being the way to consume music, it seems all the more silly.

And this is nothing against LuckyNumber7, But, IMO, the insane overreaction to SOI/Apple says much more about the people of that age group, in that time, than it does about a band partnering with a media giant to disperse their music.


And also, please pay no attention to this post as I think rehashing the Apple thing yet again, isn't fun for anyone. LOL
 
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mikal said:
This tweet proves that U2 were simply ahead of their time, realizing that these snotty kids who were all pissed off will become moms and dads 7 years later and suddenly freaking love U2!

https://twitter.com/sheluvsreezy/status/1435552364161863680?s=20
Click to expand...



Imagine if it wasn’t U2 who uploaded a new album straight to our phones, but someone like Coldplay, Kanye or Justin Bieber. Someone whose music you’re not a fan of and find the singer mildly insufferable, and tracks from that album kept popping up on shuffle for years afterwards.

Would that be one of your lasting impressions of that artist or would you still judge them on their prior output that you didn’t particularly care for?
 
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