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Old 06-05-2011, 07:15 AM   #381
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Bland round of AFL by the way (and not just because The Tiger had the BYE), few matches of interest or memorability, it has to be said. Hawthorn-Fremantle the match of the round, followed by Dees-Essendon, the rest were just routine season fixtures.
Every match-up this week was predictable on paper, and almost all of them went that way.
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Old 06-05-2011, 07:41 AM   #382
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Great call. I think I tend to forget that because I've got such an avid interest in the sport despite my love for the Cats.

I think it's sad though that there's no suburban-ness in AFL today, as inevitable as it was. And the VFL is a pretty sad league, in terms of fan support. You get more people to country football games than you do to the VFL. There'd be about 30 or so people in Werribee that passionately support the club I reckon, maybe less.
VFA was always gonna struggle once the VFL became national. Prahran, Oakleigh, Dandenong and Camberwell, proud clubs with esteemed histories, were all victims. Merging with the AFL reserves might have assisted in keeping some of these clubs (Preston, Coburg especially) playing in an elite state league. Adversely however, the competition is cheapened by the fact that players aren't playing for the club or their teammates, but for senior selection instead. It's a hard competition to take seriously, particularly with the AFL clubs flip flopping their partner clubs all the time.

With some foresight and smarter management in the 80's, the VFA could have fashioned itself into a sustainable and still popular niche league of sorts.
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Old 06-05-2011, 07:47 AM   #383
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I would kill for a state league here that is elite and well-supported. I think it's criminal that the VFA has effectively been wiped from everyone's memories. Everyone raves about Plugger, and Dunstall and Ablett and Coventry etc but no one ever mentions Fred Cook, who kicked like 1400 goals for I think Sandringham in the VFA, just a step below the VFL in those days. Many VFA stars never played VFL/AFL football because they were, as you say, playing for their club and teammates.

Seems like a helluva long time ago that playing for the Big V meant something - representative football used to be the pinnacle, and it died off because players eventually preferred to play for their clubs.
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Old 06-05-2011, 10:06 AM   #384
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I'm such a shitty fan. We lost our internet connection for about 7 hours yesterday, so I never could have watched the Carlton game anyway, but I did forget it was on.

Anyway, looked like a great game until we completely dominated when it counted and/or Port remembered their lot in life. Sydney's great game (or Brisbane's awful one) doesn't convince me they can hang with the top 4, which widened the gap further this week.
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Old 06-05-2011, 07:24 PM   #385
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Admittedly once USA was knocked out the interest dropped off a bit but it's certainly not an underground sport over there, at least not on that level.
I think this is true of any country really - look at how the Cricket World Cup just fell off the radar this year the moment Australia was knocked out. That said, cricket seems to be struggling in general to maintain interest right now. I honestly think it's partly because the Australian public is not used to their cricket team losing, and that so many people like a winner. But this is a discussion for the cricket thread.

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I think the reason our footy hasn't exploded anywhere else is that it's so exclusive; there is no incentive for an American to watch a full AFL game, really, other than the novelty factor.
But what incentive is there for us to watch the English Premier League, for instance? You need a level of basic interest first before you can establish a local league for people to get into. Plus some overseas teams (generally soccer teams) have done an amazingly good job of branding themselves in such a way that people in far-flung countries care deeply about them. I don't know how that's done, but if Manchester United can somehow generate a significant following all the way in Australia, why can't the AFL's most successful clubs make inroads into New Zealand at the very least?

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I'm frustrated free-to-air aren't showing the NBA finals. I've kept up-to-date with the playoffs but haven't seen five minutes of footage. That is a good game, though I think I'd struggle to watch an entire game if I wasn't doing something else. The scoring is so prolific it can get a little boring.
For me, the problem with basketball isn't so much the prolific scoring itself (AFL can get pretty nuts sometimes too), but the fact that it just seems so repetitive to me. On such a small court, there is so little diversity in what's happening relative to AFL. I enjoy netball more - it just seems like a more complex, skilled game; basketball with some diversity.

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Apparently if you understand the rules, it's a good game to watch
Not for me. I know the rules and I still think it's a dreadful game. Well, KNEW the rules 6-7 years ago when I was giving it chance after chance. I've probably forgotten them by now!

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I think that regardless of the sport (or code), most people are born into following not the sport itself, but a club/team. This could be something inherited through family or simply made logical through geography. Awareness and media coverage is a factor as well.
Yeah, this is a good point. I'm pretty weird in my journey with AFL, in that I followed the sport for about a decade before I even really had a team to call "mine". I knew who I hated, and I knew who I enjoyed to watch, but I didn't have a #1 team - and it was only when I came to Melbourne when I thought that it was about time I chose a team. In Queensland I was just a guy who enjoyed watching whatever footy was on the telly.

And I was certainly born into following any given Wellington team and the All Blacks (and consequently hating any Auckland and Australian team). That said, with my favourite sports, it goes beyond that and I love the sport itself, like I can watch any rugby you throw at me, but if I have just a passing interest, I'll probably just gravitate towards Wellington/NZ teams. Like I don't care much for netball in general, but you better believe I was cheering on the Silver Ferns in last year's Commonwealth Games.
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Old 06-05-2011, 08:23 PM   #386
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But what incentive is there for us to watch the English Premier League, for instance? You need a level of basic interest first before you can establish a local league for people to get into. Plus some overseas teams (generally soccer teams) have done an amazingly good job of branding themselves in such a way that people in far-flung countries care deeply about them. I don't know how that's done, but if Manchester United can somehow generate a significant following all the way in Australia, why can't the AFL's most successful clubs make inroads into New Zealand at the very least?
Well I think you answered the question yourself, branding. The EPL and its clubs have done such a good job of branding themselves that there is an incentive to watch it here. The AFL doesn't seem interested in overseas.

Good point about basketball too. It is very repetitive.
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Old 06-05-2011, 08:38 PM   #387
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I suppose the thing that helps the EPL, and why it's so well-followed in Australia compared to any other European soccer league, is our British heritage. You've still got people who support teams based on their family heritage. And soccer also has the (inexplicable) advantage of being the "world game", which helps in any new market but especially in Australia due to our large migrant population from soccer countries. Teams from other overseas sports that are well-branded don't have anything beyond an underground following (see certain gridiron, baseball, and basketball teams), and I expect that's due to the lack of a colonial link and the relatively small migrant population from countries that predominantly play those sports.
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Old 06-06-2011, 07:27 AM   #388
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More goodness from Emmanuel Irra:



Should be number one for Port's draft priorities (and I don't doubt that he already is), not only will he get more people in through the door and potentially create interest in the African community here, but he has undeniable footy smarts.

Damn shame what happened with Daw, too, but unfortunately not totally unexpected. Great to see so much support given to him though, and hopefully the few bastards in the crowd won't put him off.

It's an incomparable story to Eddie getting pissed off at a Saints flog for saying some none-too-kind things towards Andy Krakeour, as from all accounts they were nothing to do with his race, and more to do with the fact that he's a convicted criminal who nearly killed a man. For Eddie to bring the race card in is absurd and offensive, and says more about himself than the St Kilda perp.
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Old 06-06-2011, 07:33 AM   #389
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Kid's a gun.
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Old 06-06-2011, 07:35 AM   #390
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I'd love to see him play for us, but I'm expecting him to stay here or head over to GWS.
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Old 06-06-2011, 07:59 PM   #391
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More goodness from Emmanuel Irra:
Damn, that's quality.

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It's an incomparable story to Eddie getting pissed off at a Saints flog for saying some none-too-kind things towards Andy Krakeour, as from all accounts they were nothing to do with his race, and more to do with the fact that he's a convicted criminal who nearly killed a man. For Eddie to bring the race card in is absurd and offensive, and says more about himself than the St Kilda perp.
Eddie needs to just shut up and go away, seriously.
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Ian McCulloch the U2 fan:
"Who buys U2 records anyway? It's just music for plumbers and bricklayers. Bono, what a slob. You'd think with all that climbing about he does, he'd look real fit and that. But he's real fat, y'know. Reminds me of a soddin' mountain goat."
"And as for Bono, he needs a colostomy bag for his mouth."

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Old 06-06-2011, 08:14 PM   #392
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Interesting last few pages. I too think that Australian Rules Football is the best game in the world. Cricket is the only other sport that comes close to matching it for me, but I never lose interest in the footy.
Over the last few years, probably last year in particularly (before you compain, I know we won the flag, that was great...I'm talking about the sport in general) I've lost a great deal of interest in the the AFL altogether. I can't tell if its the media, the people running the show, the fact that by next year we'll have two new teams? I'm all for expansion so that can't be it. I just dunno, can't say I love going to the footy anymore either.

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I can watch both codes of rugby. I think Union is probably the better game. Don't ask me why, I don't watch much of either, but I remember watching the 03 World Cup and getting right into it. But perhaps I say that because Union is truly a world game in the sense that there is a lot of passion for the Wallabies (or there was, until about three or so years ago) and virtually none for the Kangaroos. I love watching State of Origin and I can definitely appreciate a good game of league.
I used to like Union a lot. I was into the end of the '99 cup, the '03 cup when we had guys like George Gregan (I know I've spelt his last name worng, right? whom I admired. But sometime in 2004, I totally lost interest in the game and have never really picked back up with it.

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Soccer (I don't care what anyone says, I will never call it football) is indeed fun to play, but I hate watching it for the most part. My main problem is that yes, not much happens. Inte says that a game that ends 0-0 can be fucking brilliant, but I just don't agree. That bores me to tears and it's one of the few sports that I just could not sit and watch for the entire time. World Cup is a slight exemption, as everyone gets into it and there are some damn good skills on display. And I was actually in the States when the world cup was on last year, and let me tell you from my experience, it was pretty huge. Admittedly once USA was knocked out the interest dropped off a bit but it's certainly not an underground sport over there, at least not on that level.
I call it "real" football. Not that AFL isn't football, but soccer, that thing you can only use your feet for, it is Football. Indoor soccer is the funnest game ever to play I go in and out of intrest in this sport all the time, usually because of the lousy timeslot, and the fact that Liverpool seem to play all their games on a sunday night at like 3am.

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I think the reason our footy hasn't exploded anywhere else is that it's so exclusive; there is no incentive for an American to watch a full AFL game, really, other than the novelty factor. I would support a NZ team but that is at least decades away. As Ax rightly pointed out a lot needs to happen before that's even considered.
I'm right into Ice Hockey at the moment, I love it. The most intense sport I've ever watched, its soccer on ice on steroids. I just really love the game as a whole.

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I'm frustrated free-to-air aren't showing the NBA finals. I've kept up-to-date with the playoffs but haven't seen five minutes of footage. That is a good game, though I think I'd struggle to watch an entire game if I wasn't doing something else. The scoring is so prolific it can get a little boring.
HA. Yeah ONE were at least showing the finals on a 1 day delay last year, I don' think they even have the rights to them this year? Seriously free to air needs to have a good hard look at itself. I know the time zones make things hard and all American sports are pretty much Prime Time for the US, while it might be 10am on Wednesday morning for us, they've gotta understand that they aren't gonna attract massive ratings. At least put a replay of the game on at 7:30 that night, no?

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Gridiron I don't like. Apparently if you understand the rules, it's a good game to watch (I know Bonnie is a fan) but every time I've caught it on ONE it seems like there is 30-60 seconds of play, then the ball will go over the boundary line, the swathes of people on the sidelines erupt in either disgust or delight, and then there is a two-minute break in which the last 15 seconds is discussed. I watched the entirety of the superbowl, and enjoyed it, but the game should not take that long.
I can't get into this. Too much stopping and starting. Lets bring out our whole defensive team out, and shit we are attacking now, stop the game for 15 minutes while we change tactics and bring out our offensive team. WTF!!? One game I will never call football.

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I feel bad knocking baseball given that I am such a huge fan of cricket, so I feel a bit hypocritical, but it is a boring sport. I saw the Giants take on the Red Sox in San Fran, and aside from the bitter cold weather, it was ordinary to watch. The game lasted three and a half hours, and I was more than ready to go home after two. Even the atmosphere was not as good as I had been told. There was a game last week between the Cincinnati Reds and someone else, which went for 19 innings. From I think the eight inning to the 18th, there was not a single run scored. I'm not sure if that's considered a good game or not, but how anyone could subject themselves to that, with all the downtime of timeouts, breaks, foul balls, etc, is just beyond me.
I wish I could get into baseball, and I usually do come playoff time. But the season is what 172 games long or something? No thanks.


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It's an incomparable story to Eddie getting pissed off at a Saints flog for saying some none-too-kind things towards Andy Krakeour, as from all accounts they were nothing to do with his race, and more to do with the fact that he's a convicted criminal who nearly killed a man. For Eddie to bring the race card in is absurd and offensive, and says more about himself than the St Kilda perp.
Heaven forbid. WE GET IT. Eddie obviously can never do anything right. So why keep yabbering on about him?
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Old 06-06-2011, 09:20 PM   #393
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I used to like Union a lot. I was into the end of the '99 cup, the '03 cup when we had guys like George Gregan (I know I've spelt his last name worng, right? whom I admired. But sometime in 2004, I totally lost interest in the game and have never really picked back up with it.
Nah, you got Gregan's name right - though I must say that he's one of my most disliked players in recent years. I love how the Aussie and English media harps on about Richie McCaw as an allegedly dirty player; he doesn't pull half the shit that Gregan pulled.

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I'm right into Ice Hockey at the moment, I love it. The most intense sport I've ever watched, its soccer on ice on steroids. I just really love the game as a whole.
I think I've posted before that I'd love to get into ice hockey since it seems really exciting ... I've never really had a problem with my poor vision and sport, until I tried to watch ice hockey. I just cannot see the puck, even on most telly coverage. The sport's a hell of a lot less interesting when it appears to be guys just randomly skating around for no apparent reason.

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Heaven forbid. WE GET IT. Eddie obviously can never do anything right. So why keep yabbering on about him?
Honestly though, for me, ragging on Eddie has nothing to do with the fact he's associated with Collingwood (for the record, I disliked him originally for being a crap TV show host when I lived in QLD and nobody really made much of his Collingwood connection). It's just he's a twat and I'd rag on him no matter which team he were affiliated with.
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"And as for Bono, he needs a colostomy bag for his mouth."

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Old 06-06-2011, 09:49 PM   #394
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I wish I could get into baseball, and I usually do come playoff time. But the season is what 172 games long or something? No thanks.
That's the amazing thing about baseball. Imagine that, every second day, your team plays, 80-odd home games a season. And I swear that when I was in Boston, the city breathed the Red Sox on match days. There was some real passion for the team in the city, in spite of what seems like saturation to AFL fans especially, with our 22-26 matches per season. Phenomenal. It really is a full time job to be a player.

While I might not be at all into Gridiron or Basketball or Ice Hockey, it's hard not to be awestruck by the uniqueness of America's sporting culture, from the college level to the elite level.

I reckon I could get into baseball. I'm done with cricket. It's an individual sport to me anyway ( aside from the State side, which no one else cares about anyway)

Majak Daw has almost got more fans on Facey than Dustin Martin. Disgraceful.
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Old 06-06-2011, 10:04 PM   #395
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Cricket is fucking miles better than baseball.

Majak doesn't look like a thug, Dustin does
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Old 06-06-2011, 10:15 PM   #396
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I think I've posted before that I'd love to get into ice hockey since it seems really exciting ... I've never really had a problem with my poor vision and sport, until I tried to watch ice hockey. I just cannot see the puck, even on most telly coverage. The sport's a hell of a lot less interesting when it appears to be guys just randomly skating around for no apparent reason.

Honestly though, for me, ragging on Eddie has nothing to do with the fact he's associated with Collingwood (for the record, I disliked him originally for being a crap TV show host when I lived in QLD and nobody really made much of his Collingwood connection). It's just he's a twat and I'd rag on him no matter which team he were affiliated with.

Even I can't keep up with the puck at times, I sometimes wonder why a team is celebrating (especially the away teams who have no goal horn or cheering from the crowd) Only to notice the puck has been tucked away in the back of the net. Then watching the replay its like "how did I miss that?"

The ragging on Eddie comes from absolutely everyone. I know people who don't even watch AFL yet still hate Collingwood because of Eddie. In about five minutes time I won't even care, but I guess it just gets to me every know and then.
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Old 06-06-2011, 10:20 PM   #397
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Love Eddie. Always have, always will. Can be a bit hypocritical, can say some odd things at times, but we're very lucky to have him.
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Old 06-06-2011, 10:22 PM   #398
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Oh yeah, no doubt I cringe at him sometimes. But he's done a lot of the some of the other clubs in Victoria as well.
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Old 06-07-2011, 01:45 AM   #399
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Majak doesn't look like a thug, Dustin does
Didn't Martin drop out of school when he was 14/15? I remembering hearing that somewhere in the past week. He looks menacing.
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Old 06-07-2011, 03:01 AM   #400
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Heaven forbid. WE GET IT. Eddie obviously can never do anything right. So why keep yabbering on about him?
Sorry about that, just felt Eddie really dug himself into a corner with that one. I mean no offense to the club itself and know that most Collingwood supporters aren't like the select few that tarnish the image, and Eddie's a damn fine businessman. But I'm still allowed to be disgusted by him.
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