The Crystal Ballroom - Song Discussion

[Niceman]

Some alternate versions, some acoustic versions and a couple of b-sides.

We can go around in circles, and I doubt we'll get anywhere. If you want to think of The Crystal Ballroom as a B-side, I can't imagine anything I could say that might change your mind, and vice versa.

I see disc two as the second disc of a double album and the 11 songs included there are all album songs.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

We can go around in circles, and I doubt we'll get anywhere. If you want to think of The Crystal Ballroom as a B-side, I can't imagine anything I could say that might change your mind, and vice versa.

I see disc two as the second disc of a double album and the 11 songs included there are all album songs.

And you're wrong, and it's not really debatable, as it's not an opinion.

You are factually incorrect.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Holy hell, imagine if U2 told us we were getting a double album and then gave us that.

 

[Nick66]

And you're wrong, and it's not really debatable, as it's not an opinion.

You are factually incorrect.

Yeah..it's not one of those "agree to disagree" things. It would be like if I say Bono is the lead singer of U2 and you insist it's Adele, and then say "well, we'll have to agree to disagree." No, one is a fact. The other is just delusion. We can disagree with how good these songs are, whether TCB will be a good single, and whether it will get played on tour. But whether SOI is a double album is not something that's open to debate.

A glance at the album listing on U2.com settles the whole thing...both whether this is a "double album" and whether Bono is, in fact, the lead singer of U2 (he is). And that's a fact. In my opinion.

 

[jeevey]

There's a semantic confusion here because the jacket reads 'double cd', which just means there are two discs inside. If it was conceived of as a single body of work spanning two discs, the jacket would say 'double album'.

 

[Nick66]

There's a semantic confusion here because the jacket reads 'double cd', which just means there are two discs inside. If it was conceived of as a single body of work spanning two discs, the jacket would say 'double album'.

Of course. But we're dealing with obtuseness here, not semantics.

 

[Niceman]

And you're wrong, and it's not really debatable, as it's not an opinion.

You are factually incorrect.

Jumping up and down and telling me that I'm wrong is not an argument. It doesn't sway me or anyone else in any direction. It's just an emotional outburst.

As I I've said, if there were a couple songs on disc two, I would agree they were just a couple of bonus tracks. But not 11. Invisible is not a B-side. The Crystal Ballroom is not a B-side. Disc 2 doesn't have to be all new material in a double CD release. I mentioned the example of the Cure before. Their first disc was a Best-Of CD and disc two was all acoustic, and that was considered a double album. Rattle & Hum was half new songs and half live, and that was arguably a double album. The best of 1980-1990 and 1990-2000 CDs had almost no new songs and yet they were considered double albums.

In my judgement, this is a double album. Disc one is all new songs. Disc two is a combination of new songs and new takes. All 23 songs (including the 12 inch Crystal Ballroom) were "on the album."

 

[CosmoKramer]

Fact: 90% of threads on this forum end up in arguments

Opinion: 75% of those arguments are ridiculous

Fact: Adel is not the lead singer of U2

Opinion: Bono, at times, has looked like Adel

Fact: Bob Saget loves him some Invisible

Opinion: Miami is such s bad song that if it were made into a single and I bought said physical single(cardboard packaging...you'll see why), and then I ran out of toilet paper......I would wipe my ass with the single (there may be some facts mixed into this one).




Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

 

[dan_smee]

This is absolutely not a b side. That's like calling The Ground Beneath Her Feet a b side. It's not; it should've been on the album, not just as a bonus track.


Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

TGBHF was also a single. This won't be.

 

[dan_smee]

Fact: 90% of threads on this forum end up in arguments

Opinion: 75% of those arguments are ridiculous

Fact: Adel is not the lead singer of U2

Opinion: Bono, at times, has looked like Adel

Fact: Bob Saget loves him some Invisible

Opinion: Miami is such s bad song that if it were made into a single and I bought said physical single(cardboard packaging...you'll see why), and then I ran out of toilet paper......I would wipe my ass with the single (there may be some facts mixed into this one).




Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

What does the packaging material matter if you're wiping your arse with the single? That shit's gotta hurt. It's either vinyl or CD, either way, the flat side wouldn't do the job of getting in between the cheeks, and the thin edge would most likely leave some sort of permanent damage. You're probably better off just not buying it, and using the few bucks to buy a few rolls of toilet paper.

 

[corianderstem]

As I I've said, if there were a couple songs on disc two, I would agree they were just a couple of bonus tracks.

And what is your response to U2.com calling the second disc out as "Bonus Tracks"? Is that just U2's opinion?

 

[Nick66]

And what is your response to U2.com calling the second disc out as "Bonus Tracks"? Is that just U2's opinion?

Not to mention U2.com calling SOI an "11 track" album. Like 5 times.

 

[Niceman]

Fact: 90% of threads on this forum end up in arguments

Opinion: 75% of those arguments are ridiculous

Fact: Adel is not the lead singer of U2

Opinion: Bono, at times, has looked like Adel

Fact: Bob Saget loves him some Invisible

Opinion: Miami is such s bad song that if it were made into a single and I bought said physical single(cardboard packaging...you'll see why), and then I ran out of toilet paper......I would wipe my ass with the single (there may be some facts mixed into this one).




Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

You raise some good points!

 

[Nick66]

And thus begins the strategic retreat...

 

[dan_smee]

Yeah..it's not one of those "agree to disagree" things. It would be like if I say Bono is the lead singer of U2 and you insist it's Adele, and then say "well, we'll have to agree to disagree." No, one is a fact. The other is just delusion. We can disagree with how good these songs are, whether TCB will be a good single, and whether it will get played on tour. But whether SOI is a double album is not something that's open to debate.

A glance at the album listing on U2.com settles the whole thing...both whether this is a "double album" and whether Bono is, in fact, the lead singer of U2 (he is). And that's a fact. In my opinion.

Yep.

Of all the left-field theories I've read on this site, calling this a double album is right up there.

Considering that half of the bonus disc is an aocustic session of songs on the first disc, two are alternate versions, we really only have 14 unique songs (if you include the hidden track.) For it to be a double album, all songs would have to be on all versions, and I imagine it is cheating to have 7 of the 14 unique songs effectively on there twice.

To give a recent example:

RHCP released a genuine double album (Stadium Arcadium), of which all versions contained all tracks, and there were 28 unique tracks. No alternate versions, or acoustic sessions of the same songs.

Foo Fighters released In Your Honor (sic) and Dashboard Confessional released Alter the Ending with two discs - album versions and acoustic versions of each song. Not only were they the same songs, but they weren't on all versions of the album. Just because there are two discs on some releases, these are NOT double albums.

 

[Niceman]

And what is your response to U2.com calling the second disc out as "Bonus Tracks"? Is that just U2's opinion?

I think "bonus track" is a nice diplomatic way of saying neither "B-side" nor "double album."

They are bonus tracks, all 11 of them. They were not included with the free album. But that doesn't make them B-sides. It doesn't mean they're not on the album.

Anyone read the lyric sheet? Apart from the acoustic tracks and Invisible (which is meant to be a surprise) ALL the songs on disc two get their lyrics in the liner notes. That would be unusual for U2 B-sides, wouldn't it?

U2 is doing something new. They wanted to get the album heard by everybody, and so they gave it away for free. But at the same time, they wanted to have a product afterwards which would be worth buying, so they came up with a whole second album worth of new songs and alternate takes. That doesn't make disc 2 a disc of B-sides. It make disc two the product.

 

[Mrs. Garrison]

I like Crystal Ballroom

i bought a bicycle horn and a picture frame to go along with the album

girl at the cash register asked me if i was a going to be a clown for halloween

i just looked at her and said nothing. Too many people around.

& cameras.

 

[mikal]

I would also be on the "Bonus Track" side of things. I don't think B-Side is a correct term because I always thought B-Sides were on the flip side of CD Singles.

I don't know why this is even important anyway. U2 could just say, "Hey, let's release Crystal Ballroom as a single", and boom, done. Does it mean it will happen? Probably not. But it's not like whether it's a B-Side or Bonus Track has any bearing on whether the band could release it as a single.

 

[Niceman]

I would also be on the "Bonus Track" side of things. I don't think B-Side is a correct term because I always thought B-Sides were on the flip side of CD Singles.

I don't know why this is even important anyway. U2 could just say, "Hey, let's release Crystal Ballroom as a single", and boom, done. Does it mean it will happen? Probably not. But it's not like whether it's a B-Side or Bonus Track has any bearing on whether the band could release it as a single.

Very true.

 

[dan_smee]

I think "bonus track" is a nice diplomatic way of saying neither "B-side" nor "double album."

They are bonus tracks, all 11 of them. They were not included with the free album. But that doesn't make them B-sides. It doesn't mean they're not on the album.

Anyone read the lyric sheet? Apart from the acoustic tracks and Invisible (which is meant to be a surprise) ALL the songs on disc two get their lyrics in the liner notes. That would be unusual for U2 B-sides, wouldn't it?

U2 is doing something new. They wanted to get the album heard by everybody, and so they gave it away for free. But at the same time, they wanted to have a product afterwards which would be worth buying, so they came up with a whole second album worth of new songs and alternate takes. That doesn't make disc 2 a disc of B-sides. It make disc two the product.

If you could ONLY buy it like that, you MAY have a point. But the fact is there is the standard edition that only has the 11 songs. The second disc, and the size of it is only symptomatic of the fact that U2 felt they needed to incentivise people to purchase it.

And the point re b-sides, if we are going to argue symantics, b-sides only exist on vinyl then. Have you ever turned over a cd to play the BONUS TRACKS? The term b-side now essentially means 'bonus tracks'.

 

[dan_smee]

I don't know why this is even important anyway. U2 could just say, "Hey, let's release Crystal Ballroom as a single", and boom, done. Does it mean it will happen? Probably not. But it's not like whether it's a B-Side or Bonus Track has any bearing on whether the band could release it as a single.

Yep - Everlasting Love was released to radio as a single in Australia because for some reason it just took off here. It still gets a good workout on radio.

 

[Niceman]

If you could ONLY buy it like that, you MAY have a point. But the fact is there is the standard edition that only has the 11 songs. The second disc, and the size of it is only symptomatic of the fact that U2 felt they needed to incentivise people to purchase it.

And the point re b-sides, if we are going to argue symantics, b-sides only exist on vinyl then. Have you ever turned over a cd to play the BONUS TRACKS? The term b-side now essentially means 'bonus tracks'.

I don't see how the existence of the one disc version of the album makes disc two of the album, in the full version, a collection of 11 B-sides. That doesn't follow.

The album arrived today. It had 22 songs (plus one extra track on the vinyl.) That's that.

 

[Niceman]

Yep - Everlasting Love was released to radio as a single in Australia because for some reason it just took off here. It still gets a good workout on radio.

I didn't know that, or if I used to I forgot.

 

[bobsaget77]

I hope you all get ass cancer from your tightly clenched buttcheeks over a pointless debate.
#justwantedtousethatline
#notreally
#dontpermaban


Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

 

[gvox]

And the point re b-sides, if we are going to argue symantics, b-sides only exist on vinyl then. Have you ever turned over a cd to play the BONUS TRACKS? The term b-side now essentially means 'bonus tracks'.

Hmm not sure if I agree with this, as cd singles have historically included on the same physical disc same side, 1 or 2 other songs that we call b-sides, the accompanying songs to a single.

And therein lies the rub: the singles haven't been released yet! We don't know what the b-sides will be..for all we know they could be album tracks. Or not. Wasn't Bullet a b-side to In Gods? I forget, something like that. And look what it became.

For now, all we know is that these are 11 bonus tracks of varying quality. The end. How this is even an argument is mind boggling.


Sent from my ass crack

 

[Nick66]

If you could ONLY buy it like that, you MAY have a point. But the fact is there is the standard edition that only has the 11 songs. The second disc, and the size of it is only symptomatic of the fact that U2 felt they needed to incentivise people to purchase it.

And the point re b-sides, if we are going to argue symantics, b-sides only exist on vinyl then. Have you ever turned over a cd to play the BONUS TRACKS? The term b-side now essentially means 'bonus tracks'.

Indeed. Hey, did you buy ATYCLB? That was a "2 CD" release also, and thus, I guess, a double album apparently. I'm looking at it right now...and there's a beautiful song called Summer Rain on the second disc.

As for repeatedly trying to explain this to the permanently obtuse...

City Slickers VCR scene - YouTube

 

[dan_smee]

Hmm not sure if I agree with this, as cd singles have historically included on the same physical disc same side, 1 or 2 other songs that we call b-sides, the accompanying songs to a single.

And therein lies the rub: the singles haven't been released yet! We don't know what the b-sides will be..for all we know they could be album tracks. Or not. Wasn't Bullet a b-side to In Gods? I forget, something like that. And look what it became.

For now, all we know is that these are 11 bonus tracks of varying quality. The end. How this is even an argument is mind boggling.


Sent from my ass crack

Sorry, I wasn't particularly clear. I 100% agree with you Gabe, but I was saying that if people wanted to argue symantics, you couldn't call what we conventionally know as cd b-sides anything other than bonus tracks, because they aren't actually on the b-side of the disc. That is the literal, symantic interpretation of the term. Of course, language is an organism that grows, changes, mutates and adapts to environments and words alter their meaning over time, and as such, the term 'b-side' is a legitimate name for the bonus songs on a cd single. The term has just been extrapolated over time to cover all songs that are in addition to the actual album that are released as bonus tracks throughout the album cycle. And to deny that last point, but not deny that cd b-sides aren't really b-sides would be being obtusely selective and ignorant to further an argument.

 

[corianderstem]

 

[Nick66]

 

[mikal]

I'm a big fan of C-Sections in albums.


The owls are not what they seem.