Building the show around the stage -- good, bad, or neither?

[badu2fan]

With ZooTV, they built the crazy stage out of the artistic/thematic ideas of information- and media-overload. It worked. With Vertigo stadium shows, there was no theme, so the stage design was built for appearance and sound. It worked. With the 360Tour, the stage design was started 3 years before the album came out, designed for experience, and a theme was loosely tacked on. I'm on the fence about whether it works or not. The superficial theme of the stage being a spaceship kind of works fine, but I feel like for many the deeper theme of the crowd traveling as one body; transported to some other place by the band; respect and awe for the Earth (?)----I'm not sure if that deeper theme really kicks in.

The shows are fantastic, nevertheless. Does this ad hoc application of a theme have an impact at all? Is it effective? Does it matter?

I felt this light show and screen shots are the most boring in recent tours. Not enough art and graphics just shots of band. There are a few great moments UF and CBL and Blue Room If lucky enought to have it played but not what you expect for a screen that large etc,

I enjoyed last tour with the 4 individual screens to watch each member and using the light strings for effect. Zoo Tv and Pop had much better visuals. Remember the screen shots during HMKMKM and the graphics of Zoo....
I feel they plan and develop for 4 years but since they dont have it in time to rehearse it is more a work in progress. Hopefully they will mix it up better next year.
I liked radioheads last tour with individual cameras on each member with the light poles creating an incredible visual that made show more moving.
Or Pink Floyds use in 70"s.. All graphics no band shots...
Could you imagine Bono not having his face on screen all night????

 

[BVS]

I felt this light show and screen shots are the most boring in recent tours. Not enough art and graphics just shots of band. There are a few great moments UF and CBL and Blue Room If lucky enought to have it played but not what you expect for a screen that large etc,

I enjoyed last tour with the 4 individual screens to watch each member and using the light strings for effect. Zoo Tv and Pop had much better visuals. Remember the screen shots during HMKMKM and the graphics of Zoo....
I feel they plan and develop for 4 years but since they dont have it in time to rehearse it is more a work in progress. Hopefully they will mix it up better next year.
I liked radioheads last tour with individual cameras on each member with the light poles creating an incredible visual that made show more moving.
Or Pink Floyds use in 70"s.. All graphics no band shots...
Could you imagine Bono not having his face on screen all night????

This just goes to show you how fans differ...

You have kohoutek who has been very vocal about how he doesn't want to see anything but the band, and then you have yourself that wants more than the band.

Personally, I think people just like to find reasons to complain

I think this tour is about the animations/ visuals for the seques but during the songs it's about the song and about overall lighting and mood. Both Edge and Bono have even mentioned the quick sequeways and how important they are to the theme. So I really don't think this had to do with "time to rehearse" that's silly(that was Pop) this was purposely done.

 

[kohoutek]

This just goes to show you how fans differ...

You have kohoutek who has been very vocal about how he doesn't want to see anything but the band, and then you have yourself that wants more than the band.

Personally, I think people just like to find reasons to complain

I think this tour is about the animations/ visuals for the seques but during the songs it's about the song and about overall lighting and mood. Both Edge and Bono have even mentioned the quick sequeways and how important they are to the theme. So I really don't think this had to do with "time to rehearse" that's silly(that was Pop) this was purposely done.

Yeah, but I want to see the band on stage, not on the screen. I won't rest easy until they're playing 1500 capacity clubs! Seriously I have been asking myself "why did I feel content to watch the Stones without looking at the screen when I wasn't what you could call very close, but not for U2?". I have concluded that my problem was that I was behind Adam and Bono and could only occassionally see the Edge; we were even behind Larry. The energy was defnitely not there from that perspective. Then, given that they didn't work their 360 degree stage, So we were forced to look at the screen from our premium seats if we wanted to see their faces. We probably should have gone back down to the soundboard.

I do think the visuals are less than exciting. My guess is that from the upper bleachers, the claw is pretty cool to watch. For 15 minutes or so.

 

[BVS]

Maybe you have a crush on Bono but not Mick

 

[kohoutek]

Maybe you have a crush on Bono but not Mick

After watching Bono's bum for a couple hours, I think you might be right! I think I do recall my wife flashing me a jealous "are you looking at Bono's ass?" look.

 

[elevated_u2_fan]

Have you been to PLEBA yet?

 

[BVS]

After watching Bono's bum for a couple hours, I think you might be right! I think I do recall my wife flashing me a jealous "are you looking at Bono's ass?" look.

Have you been to PLEBA yet?

Kohoutek, you should go, it's lovely this time of year...

 

[dstalksalot]

My husband and I were just talking about the strong theme in this show. So I think opinions differ.
The space travel/rocket ship theme was obvious that was the surface theme, but I think that also ties in with the theme of the journey of life and the final destination. A lot of U2 songs have great lyrical imagery of these things.
Walk on…..for instance:
And love is not the easy thing
The only baggage that you can bring...
And love is not the easy thing...
The only baggage you can bring
Is all that you can't leave behind

City of Blinding lights:
…..And I miss you when you're not around
I'm getting ready to leave the ground

In a little while:
Slow down my beating heart
A man dreams one day to fly
A man takes a rocket ship into the skies
He lives on a star that's dying in the night
And follows in the trail, the scatter of light
Turn it on, turn it on, you turn me on

Any way, I am sure I could go on, but my whole point is that I saw a very specific theme especially for a rock show…I don’t think I have seen this since Zoo TV and I thought it was genious!

 

[badu2fan]

My husband and I were just talking about the strong theme in this show. So I think opinions differ.
The space travel/rocket ship theme was obvious that was the surface theme, but I think that also ties in with the theme of the journey of life and the final destination.

Any way, I am sure I could go on, but my whole point is that I saw a very specific theme especially for a rock show…I don’t think I have seen this since Zoo TV and I thought it was genious!

Yea I understand as I notice Beautiful Day Magnificant and City of Blinding Lights all speak of "how beautiful you and the world and city are, etc..
The space theme might have worked when they included all the video from Blue Room and the space lab but not every show got to see that as they seem to tweak
the light show as the tour went on.
The light show graphics were more between songs then during as mentioned above.
I enjoyed when the crowd left a u2 concert still singing the last song as they filed out of building.

 

[BVS]

I enjoyed when the crowd left a u2 concert still singing the last song as they filed out of building.

So you want to see 40 close every U2 show?

 

[dstalksalot]

The space theme might have worked when they included all the video from Blue Room and the space lab but not every show got to see that as they seem to tweak
the light show as the tour went on.

I saw the rose bowl show, so the graphics I think were fairly nailed down by then.....
I wonder what type of change will be made for the second leg.

 

[badu2fan]

So you want to see 40 close every U2 show?

No there was more of a connection to the crowd with music. It was just a special time. No special effects etc.

 

[BVS]

So you just want it to be 1987? I see.

 

[badu2fan]

So you just want it to be 1987? I see.

no just pointing out you dont need all the baggage to make a great show......
Pink FLoyd The Wall was another show that was awesome with effects etc. But they didn't use a screen to show them playing etc. They enjoyed letting the light show and brick wall be the buzz not them as musicians. Most Pink FLoyd shows never had lights on members.

It is just how industry has change along with personal preference in how music is presented a la Music videos.

 

[dstalksalot]

If it was not for the cameras and the jumbo TV, I would have not been able to see the boys, so I am all for it.

 

[BVS]

See? Some people get it, some don't...

 

[LemonMelon]

Space and time!

I still find this proposed theme laughably broad. I don't believe it even qualifies as one, as it has no specific influence on the band or their performance. It just rears its head a few times a gig in the visuals. 360 = Vertigo 2.0.

So you just want it to be 1987? I see.

If that means superior performances, stronger connection with the crowd, and more creative setlists, I honestly wish Edge would put his time machine to use.

 

[BVS]

I still find this proposed theme laughably broad. I don't believe it even qualifies as one, as it has no specific influence on the band or their performance. It just rears its head a few times a gig in the visuals. 360 = Vertigo 2.0.

What other tour had a stronger theme? Popmart had a stronger theme visually maybe but often the songs didn't reflect the theme. ZooTV probably had the strongest theme of any tour, but even it got lost a few times.

If that means superior performances, stronger connection with the crowd, and more creative setlists, I honestly wish Edge would put his time machine to use.

Were you even alive then? How do YOU measure "stronger connection"? More creative setlists? What does that even mean?

 

[Utoo]

I still find this proposed theme laughably broad. I don't believe it even qualifies as one, as it has no specific influence on the band or their performance. It just rears its head a few times a gig in the visuals.

Yeah, I'm getting more sold on the idea of space & time as the theme, but I still don't really see why they're bothering with it at all. As you say, it pops up now and then in the show....but what's the point? I dunno, I feel like with ZooTV and PopMart, the messages were there as commentary. With Elevation, the heart & stripped down stage and promo-touring in clubs reflected the return of bare-chested heart-on-sleeve U2.

With the notion of space and/or space and time, even if I buy into the presence of that theme, what's the point? Simply to tie into the title "No Line on the Horizon?" That's pretty flimsy to me. I still stand by what I said in the very first post: This theme was tacked onto the predetermined stage, which could only look like a spaceship or some otherworldly creation. The theme evolved as a result of the stage, rather than the set design evolving around the theme....and it's not quite as strong or purposeful, IMO.

 

[LemonMelon]

What other tour had a stronger theme?

Are you serious?

Were you even alive then? How do YOU measure "stronger connection"? More creative setlists? What does that even mean?

I can only measure connection by what I've heard, honestly. And, having been around for Vertigo and having followed the Elevation tour through the media, if not the fanbase itself, I've never seen such a mixed reaction to a U2 tour. That's a very strong barometer for crowd connection IMO. The setlist argument has been rehashed to death, and I realize most don't really give a damn to begin with, but the band just keeps getting lazier with them. Did they use the previous 10-15 shows as a rehearsal for the Rose Bowl gig or something?

 

[BVS]

Are you serious?

Yes.

I can only measure connection by what I've heard, honestly. And, having been around for Vertigo and having followed the Elevation tour through the media, if not the fanbase itself, I've never seen such a mixed reaction to a U2 tour. That's a very strong barometer for crowd connection IMO.

I think since the dawn of the internet you'll find the tours have been met with huge mixed reaction at the time of the tours and then looked at fondly after the fact. Vertigo being a perfect example of that... I've seen certain posters in here that keep saying "why can't they be more like the Vertigo tour" but back then were bashing it.

 

[BVS]

Are you serious?

Well since you aren't going to answer let me just say that at the time of both ZooTV and PopMart they were definately many folks scratching their heads wondering what the hell U2 were trying to say with these tours. I think with ZooTV that was part of the point, but with PopMart it got lost. Sure it's easy for YOU to look back given the articles, interviews, and nicely packaged DVDs and say this was the theme, but I guarantee you it wasn't back then. Hell I would even venture out and say if you opened a thread and said what was the theme of _____ tour you would get a lot of variation.

 

[popacrobat]

Yes.




I think since the dawn of the internet you'll find the tours have been met with huge mixed reaction at the time of the tours and then looked at fondly after the fact. Vertigo being a perfect example of that... I've seen certain posters in here that keep saying "why can't they be more like the Vertigo tour" but back then were bashing it.

I remember the Vertigo tour taking a fair beating around here during the time of it. Elevation part 2, setlists suck,they've lost their creativity etc.

Also I will add I've been basically away from interference from the middle of the first leg till now, and from what I can tell all of the reactions I have seen to the tour have been pretty positive overall. A lot of glowing reviews and testimony from various papers and casual fans that I know of. I went to four shows - the two in Foxboro and the two in NY- and the crowds were excellent, completely into it, and I only heard of people marveling at the stage and performances. Of course I'm only looking at small sample sizes too, but hey.

 

[U2girl]

Yeah, I'm getting more sold on the idea of space & time as the theme, but I still don't really see why they're bothering with it at all. As you say, it pops up now and then in the show....but what's the point? I dunno, I feel like with ZooTV and PopMart, the messages were there as commentary. With Elevation, the heart & stripped down stage and promo-touring in clubs reflected the return of bare-chested heart-on-sleeve U2.

With the notion of space and/or space and time, even if I buy into the presence of that theme, what's the point? Simply to tie into the title "No Line on the Horizon?" That's pretty flimsy to me. I still stand by what I said in the very first post: This theme was tacked onto the predetermined stage, which could only look like a spaceship or some otherworldly creation. The theme evolved as a result of the stage, rather than the set design evolving around the theme....and it's not quite as strong or purposeful, IMO.

Would you know the theme of Zoo TV and Popmart based on not reading the band/set designer interviews ? It can just as easily be dismissed as "band having cool shit around" that 360 get so quickly accused of, even with several references to its theme throughout the show.

Emposing the theme on the stage sounds a lot like the other two mega stadiums tours they've done. I doubt the idea on media overload/satire on TV came before the "let's have loads of TVs on stage" idea. Or that the consumer culture irony came before the "biggest screen to date" idea.

I also think the *theme influences the graphics/visuals they use rather than what they choose to play.



The setlist debate is hopeless ever since Vertigo of all tours got critisized in that department. Almost as priceless as the bashing of 360....by people not actually seeing the show.

 

[digitize]

My husband and I were just talking about the strong theme in this show. So I think opinions differ.
The space travel/rocket ship theme was obvious that was the surface theme, but I think that also ties in with the theme of the journey of life and the final destination. A lot of U2 songs have great lyrical imagery of these things.
Walk on…..for instance:
And love is not the easy thing
The only baggage that you can bring...
And love is not the easy thing...
The only baggage you can bring
Is all that you can't leave behind

City of Blinding lights:
…..And I miss you when you're not around
I'm getting ready to leave the ground

In a little while:
Slow down my beating heart
A man dreams one day to fly
A man takes a rocket ship into the skies
He lives on a star that's dying in the night
And follows in the trail, the scatter of light
Turn it on, turn it on, you turn me on

Any way, I am sure I could go on, but my whole point is that I saw a very specific theme especially for a rock show…I don’t think I have seen this since Zoo TV and I thought it was genious!

YES! Thank you for this post. It's not just literal spacetime, but metaphorical spacetime... hence MajorTomZooAstroBaby being lost in space leading into Ultraviolet->WOWY->MOS, the Crazy Tonight remix creating the disorientation of hedonism before SBS->MLK->Walk On, et cetera. Also, this lends itself perfectly to the theme and title of SOA.

 

[dstalksalot]

Did they use the previous 10-15 shows as a rehearsal for the Rose Bowl gig or something?

The show I attended was the Rose Bowl so perhaps I had the benefit of seeing a finely tuned show.

Isn't it common to tweak a tour through out its run? Sure the theme and performances will be more defined towards the end.....

 

[kohoutek]

Would you know the theme of Zoo TV and Popmart based on not reading the band/set designer interviews ? It can just as easily be dismissed as "band having cool shit around" that 360 get so quickly accused of, even with several references to its theme throughout the show.

Emposing the theme on the stage sounds a lot like the other two mega stadiums tours they've done. I doubt the idea on media overload/satire on TV came before the "let's have loads of TVs on stage" idea. Or that the consumer culture irony came before the "biggest screen to date" idea.

I also think the *theme influences the graphics/visuals they use rather than what they choose to play.



The setlist debate is hopeless ever since Vertigo of all tours got critisized in that department. Almost as priceless as the bashing of 360....by people not actually seeing the show.

The theme for Pop Mart (consumer culture, as you say) was DEFINITELY thought out prior to the show. That's why the tour was announced from a K-Mart.