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Old 04-27-2008, 09:18 AM   #401
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Originally posted by A_Wanderer
Because partners in a civil union are not married, it is a separate but equal solution that exists to protect some peoples religiously based concept of marriage; but in the laws of a secular state that religious concept isn't enforced upon everybody.
Wrong.

That's not what I'm proposing or much of progressive conservative movement.

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Old 04-27-2008, 09:25 AM   #402
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What are you proposing?
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Old 04-27-2008, 09:58 AM   #403
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i suggest you reread the thread.

(it really comes down to nothing more than a discussion about semantics).



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Old 04-27-2008, 10:13 AM   #404
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I want clarification, do you support or oppose gays and lesbians being allowed to enter into marriage contracts. It is more than just semantics.
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Old 04-27-2008, 01:57 PM   #405
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There are no legitimate non-religious reasons



but there is plenty of this stuff:

Quote:
Protestors Picket Local Church

POSTED: 11:22 pm EDT April 24, 2008

REDFORD, Mich. -- Some Redford community members are planning to protest outside of the Covenant Community Church Sunday because of controversial message written on a sign outside the church.

"God can save homosexuals from their sin," the sign reads for all to see as people drive down Beech Daly Road, near 5 Mile Road.

A Redford woman said she was offended by the message because the church is openly placing judgment on the people.

"If they want to preach whatever they want to preach behind the doors of the church-- that's fine with me, but to bring it out and put it in public like that for everyone to see – it's unfair to the rest of the community," said Courtney Antuna with her girlfriend by her side.

The pastor of the church, Rev. Cole Westwood told Local 4 that the sign represents that it's always best to have a loving mother and father.

Westwood said the message comes from "Scripture, 1Corinthians 6:9-11, and it's a message of hope."

Protesters said they will rally in front of the church every Sunday until the sign comes down. However, Sunday may be the first and last day of protest because Westwood said they often change the sign and they plan to change the message Monday.
1 Corinthians 6:9-11 (King James Version)



9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.


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Old 04-27-2008, 03:10 PM   #406
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Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
I want clarification, do you support or oppose gays and lesbians being allowed to enter into marriage contracts. It is more than just semantics.
every legal benefit afforded hetros who enter into a marriage contract should be afforded to same sex cpls who want to enter into the same type of matrimonial or civil contract.

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Old 04-27-2008, 03:33 PM   #407
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond
I can have so much fun in this thread, but I realize the volaitilty of the subject so I won't.
First off, thanks for sparing us.

Quote:
because marriage by it's definition involves people of opposite genders, period. Accept that truth and the gay community can move forward more quickly reaping the benefits of the hetrosexual community.
I don't get this argument about the definition being such and such and therefore it can never change. Voting used to be exclusively for white males. An African American used to be considered only 3/5ths of a person. It used to be illegal for African Americans to go to the same schools as white Americans. All these terms and rights used to be defined in a certain way, and yet what happened? The definitions changed.

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Old 04-27-2008, 04:13 PM   #408
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond


every legal benefit afforded hetros who enter into a marriage contract should be afforded to same sex cpls who want to enter into the same type of matrimonial or civil contract.
Fine, then. We'll call it equal, but separate.
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Old 04-27-2008, 04:16 PM   #409
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Originally posted by nathan1977
as those in the 70s who said that legalizing abortion would not lead to euthanasia. Yet here we are.
First, can you cite some examples of this line of thinking form the 70s?

And second, where indeed are we? Where is it legal? How fast are we sliding down this particular slippery slope? (I looked it up, but I'd like you to go on record.)
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Old 04-27-2008, 08:38 PM   #410
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Quote:
Originally posted by Diemen


First off, thanks for sparing us.



I don't get this argument about the definition being such and such and therefore it can never change. Voting used to be exclusively for white males. An African American used to be considered only 3/5ths of a person. It used to be illegal for African Americans to go to the same schools as white Americans. All these terms and rights used to be defined in a certain way, and yet what happened? The definitions changed.


I'm sorry you don't get it.
It's not that difficult.

I like order and clarity in the defintion of words and not segues into topics unrelated.

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Old 04-28-2008, 12:05 AM   #411
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond


every legal benefit afforded hetros who enter into a marriage contract should be afforded to same sex cpls who want to enter into the same type of matrimonial or civil contract.

<>


it amazes me that you seem to think that this is really very big of you.

anyway, here: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/27/ma...50f&ei=5087%0A

it's a good read. everyone should take a crack at it.
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Old 04-28-2008, 10:33 AM   #412
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond



I'm sorry you don't get it.
It's not that difficult.
I agree, it's not that difficult to modify the definitions of words when a desire for equality and social justice demands it. It's just difficult to change the stubborn minds of those who don't like the idea of it despite the fact that it wouldn't affect them in any way.
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