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View Poll Results: What causes HATE/ANGER for our fellowmen?men?men?
ENVY/JEALOSY 11 45.83%
POVERTY 13 54.17%
Voters: 24. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-20-2002, 03:41 PM   #41
The Fly
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: CA
Posts: 100
Local Time: 02:17 PM
Originally posted by Vorsprung
Funny, calling the Netherlands a land of communists and socialists. Since our country has always been a country of trade since it hardly has any natural resources. Thatís what weíre known for. Also the worldís 2nd or 3rd largest company (Royal Dutch/Shell) is a mostly Dutch corporation. This all wouldnít really happen if we were living in a tiny communist country. True, The Netherlands just as the rest of Europe is more left wing than the USA. The policy of your democrats would be considered right-wing over here. Even I donít consider myself really left-wing over here, for American Iím left-wing yes, for Dutch not. So Iím sensing some kind of communistóphobia or maybe even xenophobia in your reply. Also, it seems like you feel that Iíve started a personal attack on America. Well I havenít. Iíve just stated some things which do apply to the USA, since it is the superpower of today, but not solely to them but also to (relative) superpowers of the past and also to Europe. I also did not state that this (general) superpower is doing something wrong. I havenít said whoís right and whoís wrong, so my post was never meant to bash the USA or anything like that, dontí be so paranoid and feel offended so soon. I have other reasons for not liking American policy, something this post wasnít about, it actually wasnít about a policy at all.
About the fall our government: well I havenít voted for either of those parties, but I think tís a good thing theyív fallen apart, since the LPF is a very unstabile party with their members being egocentric and much to eager for (personal) power.

But back to the original topic. To call envy the reason is very easy, because this simply implies they're the bad guys and we can't help it that they hate us. In fact then they are the cause for the hatred themselves, because they are stupid envious people. Stating that the huge influence of the (culture of the) rich on the (culture of the) poor is a main cause for hatred may to some imply that the rich are wrong or bad or deliberately opresssing the poor. They aren't, but it just happens to be this way (sometimes they are and then the rich and powerful are acting in a wrong way, but this doesn't necesarely have to be this way)
Why not just envy? Well, that is personal in a way yes, but I wouldn't hate anyone just because they are more powerful or rich. So be it, I don't need to be wealthy, though I want to be independent. But if they are more powerful and rich, well I don't think anyone would have a problem with that as long as this power doen't influence your way of life.

I wasn't claiming that you were outright socialists or communists. I'm talking about the policies of your government and the political climate of the country being VERY leftist, which is something you've already admitted to.

Communist phobia? I don't think a flawed political system is anything to be afraid of anymore. The cold war is over and there isn't a communist country in the world that's prospering.
Xenophobia? Ummm...I'm disagreeing with your politics, not the fact that you're a foreigner. Yes, I do think free-market capitalism (not completely without regulation) is superior to socialism and communism. Sorry to spoil the mulicultural\idealogical lovefest!
I didn't think your arguement was aimed against America. I think it was aimed against capitalist ideology.

I've got to admit that your post was VERY confusing. I can't really tell what you're trying to say. First, you claim that the rich are oppressing the poor, but not necessarily on purpose. Then you claim that you wouldn't hate the rich yourself.
Still, you haven't explained why the "potential" influence of the rich on the poor is more important than the "potential" influence of the poor envying the rich except to say that you yourself don't envy the rich (are you poor?). If anything, I think it's the left that tries to aggrandize and manipulate the plight of the poor to benefit their politics, which only serves to enhance the hatred and envy of the poor.
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