Our last piece of freedom of speech.... - Page 2 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 05-31-2007, 03:12 PM   #21
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
Caroni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Under Angel´s falls in Venezuela
Posts: 3,603
Local Time: 07:25 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by ramblin rose
I work with a lot of people in Venezuela because we have a large affiliate there. Many of the professionals have already gotten their papers ready to move to Canada, where apparently there is already a very large exile community.

One thing they told me, which I'm not sure is true, but I'm really curious about; is it true that if you are under 18 you can no longer get a passport to leave the country? Is this true?





Of course you can get a passport if you are under 18, but is your parents who have to make the papers, you alone can´t do it, anyway, get any paper here is a real nigthmare
__________________

Caroni is offline  
Old 05-31-2007, 03:22 PM   #22
Forum Moderator
 
ramblin rose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 12,865
Local Time: 06:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Caroni
Of course you can get a passport if you are under 18, but is your parents who have to make the papers, you alone can´t do it, anyway, get any paper here is a real nigthmare

I realize that it would be the parents, it's just that a couple of the people whose children didn't have passports tried to go and get them and they were told at the passport office that it wasn't possible to get passports for their children until further notice.

Maybe it was just an administrative issue?
__________________

__________________
ramblinrose[at]interference.com
ramblin rose is offline  
Old 05-31-2007, 03:29 PM   #23
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
Caroni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Under Angel´s falls in Venezuela
Posts: 3,603
Local Time: 07:25 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by ramblin rose



I realize that it would be the parents, it's just that a couple of the people whose children didn't have passports tried to go and get them and they were told at the passport office that it wasn't possible to get passports for their children until further notice.

Maybe it was just an administrative issue?




I´ll quote myself





Quote:
Originally posted by Caroni

get any paper here is a real nigthmare
Caroni is offline  
Old 05-31-2007, 03:48 PM   #24
Blue Crack Addict
 
unico's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Rage Ave.
Posts: 18,749
Local Time: 06:55 PM
hey Caroni, I heard about this the other day. that must be so frustrating. all i can say is don't give up hope. maybe soon a positive change will come.

hope for the best just like sailor moon does!
unico is offline  
Old 05-31-2007, 09:24 PM   #25
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
Caroni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Under Angel´s falls in Venezuela
Posts: 3,603
Local Time: 07:25 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by unico
hey Caroni, I heard about this the other day. that must be so frustrating. all i can say is don't give up hope. maybe soon a positive change will come.

hope for the best just like sailor moon does!



Thank you it´s getting harder to have hopes, but I believe that God has something prepared for us



Sailor moon reference --> unico
Caroni is offline  
Old 06-01-2007, 05:04 AM   #26
Rock n' Roll Doggie
FOB
 
JanuaryStar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: World of Dreams
Posts: 9,159
Local Time: 01:55 AM
Yikes Caroni, I never realised the situation in Venezuela is becoming this bad...

I can't help but stop and think about the freedom we sometimes take for granted here... I hope the situation will change though. Try to keep your hopes up for this, although it may seem very hard...
JanuaryStar is offline  
Old 06-01-2007, 10:42 AM   #27
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Canadiens1131's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 10,363
Local Time: 07:55 PM
Communism is such a good idea until it gets put into practise
Canadiens1131 is offline  
Old 06-01-2007, 11:09 AM   #28
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 09:55 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Canadiens1160
Communism is such a good idea until it gets put into practise
Is it really? Doesn't the end goal of collective ownership erode individual property rights and ultimately individualsm? Not to mention the bloody path to reach that stage which has repeatedly led to totalitarianism.
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 06-01-2007, 11:19 AM   #29
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Canadiens1131's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 10,363
Local Time: 07:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
Is it really? Doesn't the end goal of collective ownership erode individual property rights and ultimately individualsm? Not to mention the bloody path to reach that stage which has repeatedly led to totalitarianism.
If we all get Soma, who the fuck cares
Canadiens1131 is offline  
Old 06-01-2007, 11:32 PM   #30
Refugee
 
dazzlingamy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: The city of blinding lights and amazing coffee - Melbourne.
Posts: 2,468
Local Time: 10:55 AM
Caroni im sorry for what is going on but you need to stay and fight, that what people do, they need to rise up and fight and stay in their homeland and make a stand - if people just sat and let things roll over, then this is how shit happens! You can make a difference!



Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
Is it really? Doesn't the end goal of collective ownership erode individual property rights and ultimately individualsm? Not to mention the bloody path to reach that stage which has repeatedly led to totalitarianism.
I also believe communism is a good idea in theory, but know that humans can never live in that sort of society, as we are greedy people regardless, and no one can be give adminstative power in a communist society and not exploit it for their own gain - we are all far too selfish..

I don't think you'd lose your idividualism, rather you would regain your talents and skills and use these to help your fellow man and be helped in return.
dazzlingamy is offline  
Old 06-02-2007, 02:57 AM   #31
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 41,232
Local Time: 06:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
Not to mention the bloody path to reach that stage which has repeatedly led to totalitarianism.
Here is where the theory fails. The theory isn't evil by itself, but once you place it in human hands it becomes a tool of evil.

This is something that many fail to see.
BVS is offline  
Old 06-02-2007, 06:51 AM   #32
Rock n' Roll Doggie
ALL ACCESS
 
Vincent Vega's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Berlin
Posts: 6,739
Local Time: 01:55 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by dazzlingamy
Caroni im sorry for what is going on but you need to stay and fight, that what people do, they need to rise up and fight and stay in their homeland and make a stand - if people just sat and let things roll over, then this is how shit happens! You can make a difference!
This sounds so good in theory, but in reality it is far too dangerous under most regimes.

Stay as long as it is safe to protest, but dare to leave if it becomes too dangerous.
Vincent Vega is offline  
Old 06-02-2007, 07:40 AM   #33
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 09:55 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Here is where the theory fails. The theory isn't evil by itself, but once you place it in human hands it becomes a tool of evil.

This is something that many fail to see.
But I think the idea of communal ownership is a bad thing, not evil per se but certainly undesirable.
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 06-03-2007, 08:21 AM   #34
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: The American Resistance
Posts: 4,754
Local Time: 05:55 PM
Quote:
Memorial To Be Dedicated June 12

"The world has been reluctant to acknowledge the horrors of Communism... Now at last they will be memorialized." - Washington Times

The Victims of Communism Memorial will be dedicated on Tuesday morning, June 12, 2007, in Washington, D.C. Rep. Tom Lantos, chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, will give the keynote address while Rep. Dana Rohrabacher will deliver remarks. President George W. Bush has also been invited to speak. A crowd of 1,000 including Congressional leaders, members of the diplomatic corps, ethnic leaders, foreign dignitaries, and Memorial supporters, is expected to attend the historic event.

The dedication will take place at the Memorial site at the intersection of Massachusetts Ave., N.W., New Jersey Ave., N.W., and G St., N.W., two blocks from Union Station and within view of the U.S. Capitol.
Built to honor the more than 100 million people who died because of a tyrannical ideology.
INDY500 is offline  
Old 06-03-2007, 09:04 AM   #35
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
CTU2fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 5,366
Local Time: 07:55 PM
It's not the ideology that's tyrannical, rather the tyrants who've killed in its name.
CTU2fan is offline  
Old 06-03-2007, 09:42 AM   #36
Rock n' Roll Doggie
ALL ACCESS
 
Vincent Vega's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Berlin
Posts: 6,739
Local Time: 01:55 AM
Capitalism didn't kill less.
Vincent Vega is offline  
Old 06-03-2007, 09:53 AM   #37
War Child
 
Ormus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Frontios
Posts: 758
Local Time: 07:55 PM
Not that I'm a fan of communism, but what a silly memorial. But give it a few years, and I'm sure "The Victims of Capitalism Memorial" will be erected somewhere to commemorate everything from the U.S./U.K. toppling of Iran PM Mohammed Mossadegh to Guatemalan President Jacobo Arbenz to U.S. intervention in Chile that led to support for the dictator, Gen. Augusto Pinochet to the U.S.' support of Indonesia's invasion of East Timor that killed 200,000 people.
Ormus is offline  
Old 06-03-2007, 11:44 AM   #38
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
Caroni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Under Angel´s falls in Venezuela
Posts: 3,603
Local Time: 07:25 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by dazzlingamy
Caroni im sorry for what is going on but you need to stay and fight, that what people do, they need to rise up and fight and stay in their homeland and make a stand - if people just sat and let things roll over, then this is how shit happens! You can make a difference!




Do you think that I just stayed watching TV while the others figth?. Of course not, I`ve spent this 8 years first preaching to people not to vote for him, then, figthing, protesting and most importanty, voting, even my family suffered, whe were kicked out of PDVSA (the state oil company) because we supported the general strike (we were forced to support it because our goods and employees were in danger) , my counsins almost got shooted at a march and even my mom got some tear gas at a protest.


it is not safe to protest anymore, but still we do it.


What can we do if this goverment has absolute control of everthing? from the things you eat till the process of making laws


Of course I don´t want to leave, but I don´t want to stay in a country where all you have is not really yours and can be taken at any moment




I´m hoping for a miracle to happen (and trying make it happen)
Caroni is offline  
Old 06-03-2007, 12:10 PM   #39
Blue Crack Addict
 
anitram's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: NY
Posts: 18,918
Local Time: 07:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by dazzlingamy
Caroni im sorry for what is going on but you need to stay and fight, that what people do, they need to rise up and fight and stay in their homeland and make a stand - if people just sat and let things roll over, then this is how shit happens! You can make a difference!
I don't think we have any place to tell people who to live their lives, when to go or when to leave. Sometimes, leaving is the right thing to do, sometimes it is not. It's certainly not for us to decide, sitting on our asses thousands of miles away.
anitram is offline  
Old 11-27-2007, 07:14 PM   #40
Forum Moderator
 
yolland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 7,471
Local Time: 12:55 AM
Quote:
Venezuelans vote Sunday on Chávez's plan to scrap term limits on his rule

By Sara Miller Llana
Christian Science Monitor, Nov. 28


CARACAS -- University student Elena Mela had never protested in her life. But last week she joined thousands of students in the streets of Caracas to fight against Sunday's referendum on President Hugo Chávez's plan to scrap term limits on his rule. "This will change our entire country," says Ms. Mela. "I will keep fighting for my values."

Despite recent polls showing a decline in support for Mr. Chávez's proposed constitutional reforms, most analysts say he will prevail. But unlike other chapters in his eight-year reign, the growing opposition among students and even from members within his own party--including a longtime ally and former general--could signal that he is pushing changes too fast and too hard.

...In addition to abolishing presidential term limits, Chávez's proposed reforms would lower the voting age to 16 from 18, reduce the workday from eight to six hours, and establish Venezuela as a socialist state, among scores of other changes.

The referendum has provoked an enormous--and at times tense--display of people power. One man was shot dead on Monday as he tried to drive his truck through an area blocked by protesters. Among a fractured opposition, students have emerged as the most cohesive antireferendum force...But students have been careful not to link themselves to the opposition, which has been defeated repeatedly at the ballot box since Chávez, was first elected in 1998. Students say they are focused solely on the referendum--not on the ouster of Chávez as the opposition often calls for.

Students, as they have across Latin America, have played important roles in Venezuela, protesting its dictatorships, first in 1928 and then again 30 years later. But during the Chávez regime they had remained quiet--until the shutdown of an opposition television station in late May that was widely watched by Venezuelans of all economic backgrounds. This is the first time they emerged in force during his rule, and analysts say it caught the country off-guard. "This went after something that really touched a nerve," says Michael Shifter, vice president for policy at the Inter-American Dialogue in Washington. "It was the first egregious example of overreaching [by Chávez]."

While the student movement stems largely from private universities or more elite ones like the public Central University of Venezuela, students resent the fact that Chávez has linked them to the so-called oligarchy--at one point calling them "rich bourgeois brats." "I'm not the daughter of rich parents, like the president says," says Mela, who voted for Chávez during his first election because the country needed a change, she says, and put herself through school with a scholarship and job.

To be sure, there are also tens of thousands of students on Chávez's side. Doors and walls at the Bolivarian University of Venezuela, opened by Chávez in 2003 to give access to scores of students who otherwise might not have a chance to attend university, are plastered with red stickers reading "Sí," a call to vote "Yes" on the amendment changes. César Trompiz, a member of the President's Student Commission for Popular Power, says that it is ironic that some students are protesting of the "revolution." "The opposition has lost everything in this country but private companies and universities; this is all they have left," he says. "[The opposition students] have kidnapped the symbols of student protest. No student in the world would protest to defend a company, or a [university] rector."

Still, some say that Chávez should be more concerned about former allies who have come out against him--most notably his former Defense Minister Gen. Raul Baduel, who recently called the reform package a "coup."

[Central University sociologist Edgardo] Lander says such discontent among Chávez supporters will be the new challenge for the government in the coming years. "There are a lot of [discontented] people who will vote 'yes,' because they don't want the opposition to win and don't want to weaken the government," says Lander. "It won't have that much impact on this referendum, but it is a new part of the political situation."
__________________

__________________
yolland [at] interference.com


μελετώ αποτυγχάνειν. -- Διογένης της Σινώπης
yolland is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:55 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com
×