Addenda

[melon]

Originally posted by bonoman:
You dont like sugar coating.

Good.

Your post is the most egotistical post i have ever read.

Hey, news flash this forum will survive without you as you will survive without it. Its only a forum not your purpose in life.

And when you come in here and post like this you cant be looking for anything but agrevation from the people you know hate you for the "big head" you posses.

I have left this forum because its full of alot of shit and meaningless posts, coupled with how busy i am. But to respond to this is my pleasure!

"If only the sugar were as sweet as you" -- Hans Moleman

Melon

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"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time

[80sU2isBest]

Originally posted by Calluna:
I am one of the people Melon was talking about. I read FYM but I don't usually post here because I consider it to be a hostile place. I don't feel comfortable sharing my views here because I feel like people would just bash me and I am not the only one who feels that way.

There was nothing wrong with what Melon posted in this thread. I think some of you just have a knee-jerk negative reaction to anything he posts and it is constantly having to defend himself against people like you that is making him hate the forum and want to leave. You are wearing him out. He has a right to his opinions even if they happen to be different from yours and he has a right to express those opinions. I'm sorry if some of the things he said came across as being "arrogant" to you but I know Melon a bit better than most of you and I know that he is not arrogant and it was not his intention to come across that way. Melon is a great asset to this forum whether you realize it or not. You all need to get off his case.
Gao

I respect you for voicing your opinion, Calluna, and you should not feel like you will get "bashed" for voicing your opinion. If I disagree with you, I will certainly debate with you, but I will not call you names, or anything like that. I have been known to use sarcasm, but that is usually when I have been pushed. And I haven't been that way near as much for the last several months, since I felt bad for a response I made to someone who is now my forum friend, bono_man. Usually, if I have misbehaved, I will apologize. In fact, for a while, I was following Melon around and every time he seemed to me to be acting arrogantly, I would make some smart aleck quip and then run. But I recently apologized for that, and now will make smart aleck quips to his face. So, if you think I have mistreated you, let me know, and if I agree that I was too sarcastic, I will apologize.
However, if you think that Melon is an innocent in all this, I'm wondering what posts you have been reading. It is not the fact that he has different opinions that get some of us going; it is the way he presents them.
One of the reasons I and several others get miffed with Melon is because of his constant boasting about his intelligence. Believe me, when you're in a debate with him, he often does indeed come off sounding arrogant and superior. So no, I will not get off his case about that.
Another thing that you may not be aware of, and of specific concern for me, is that Melon has a real anger and hatred toward fundamental Christianity. He has started thread after thread in which he has railed on and attacked fundamentalist Christianity. It is a constant for him, and sometimes it gets quite ugly. Since I consider myself a fundamentalist, it of course upsets me. Everyone knows I do not agree with Islam, Hinduism, and other religions. But everyone also knows I respect others' views enough not to start threads that lash out on the religions.

[melon]

New:

* Is it better to go out with a bang or to just fade away? Is a "bang," however, less effective because people nearly expect it nowadays? Can a slowly calculated idea somehow be more effective than throwing out all your proverbial weaponry at once?

* Is pettiness inherent within human nature or just the internet? Can people sincerely enjoy a conversation where they disagree vehemently with everything the opponent states? Can one be fervently religious while also being a pupil of science and rationalism? Or should one feel compelled to choose?

Lurkers...post here. I'm telling you right now that you are smart enough to be in "Free Your Mind," and if any asshole starts bullying you around, I will smack them up. Most assuredly.

Melon

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"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time

[This message has been edited by melon (edited 11-26-2001).]

[melon]

In case anyone has noticed, I'm attempting to get people to think here. Discuss. This is a thread on philosophy. But I'm verily disappointed so far.

As for the issue of "boasting" or "arrogance," it's a dead issue. Move on.

Melon

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"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time

[Foxxern]

Ned Flanders: And Harry Potter, and all his friends.... went to hell for practicing witchcraft! (throws book into fire)

Todd: YAY!!!


------------------
Change is the only constant

[Spiral_Staircase]

On Harry Potter:
I've never read the books or seen the movie, but I don't feel like Christians should have a problem with them. It's fantasy, and I think that's the way kids look at it. When watching re-runs of Bewitched when I was a kid, I never once thought "Hey, maybe I can learn some spells and clean my room by wiggling my nose". The Bible does condemn sorcery, mediums, and the like, but I don't think that's what this is. I don't think the "magic" in THe Lord of the Rings or The Chronicals of Narnia is "evil" either. I just don't see Harry Potter leading kids into the practice of witchcraft. Maybe that's naive.
I don't think my pastor has any problem with Harry P. Melon, maybe you should join us conservative evangelicals

On "God Bless America":
The phrase doesn't lead me to the "holy war" connection, but it does bother me a bit. It's fine for people to ask God to bless this country, but I get the impression that some people think we are somehow "deserving" of God's blessing because a horrible act was committed against us. This is most definitely not the case.
Also, I think this phrase is usually used as a statement of love of country, when I think it really ought to be a statement of faith in God.

On Pettiness:
I say it's inherent within human nature, and if not inherent, then it's just wicked pervasive. It takes constant effort to be nice.

On People Sincerely Enjoying a Conversation Where They Disagree Vehemently with Everything the Opponent States:
I think it depends on the people. Some people just hate conflict too much to be able to enjoy a conversation like that. I think it's possible for me. I think one of the big problems of a forum like "Free Your Mind" is that people feel like a discussion isn't complete until their "opponent" concedes victory. Things get beaten to death because no one will drop it until they "win" the argument, which rarely happens. I say, state your views, read others' views, comment on others' views if you want, maybe clarify your views, but realize that in the end you will still disagree with someone in here. And that's ok.

Disclaimer:
My comments, particularly on the first two topics, are made from a Christian viewpoint.

Meaningless Statement:
Remember the Jelly Doughnut!

Name:
Spiral Staircase

[famous rungi]

melon, if this is another of your stunts to just rouse people, to simply generate discussion without claiming responsibility (you haven't replied to my post, for instance)... then I would think three times before replying to your posts, in the future. I'm a little disappointed now; it seems to me that you do agitate just for the sake of agitating or garnering responses. Is this really true? Sigh.


me.

[Rono]

Originally posted by melon:
In case anyone has noticed, I'm attempting to get people to think here. Discuss. This is a thread on philosophy. But I'm verily disappointed so far.

As for the issue of "boasting" or "arrogance," it's a dead issue. Move on.

Melon

I did not even miss you.

[Rono]

Topic ? I can`t make a choice. Or are you the topic ? Anyway, just make a smart remark and we can walk on.

[TheU2]

Originally posted by melon:

* I realized, one day, that I'm really tired of being smart.

Melon

I know how you feel, Melon. I'm tired of being smart, handsome, witty, and awesome in bed.



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Kennedy

[Anthony]

I for one don't really consider Melon's comments at all that arrogant or self-praising. At the end of the day, we are all exceedingly arrogant in our little (or in my case, GRAND) ways. If he is being arrogant, which I doubt, then thats good for him; he has the guts to admit to such arrogance and promote it. Before we can be acquainted with virtue, we must be acquainted with vice... I think the Marquis de Sade said that once. Anyway, I digress.

Even if he was being arrogant, the point is, he didn't call anyone stupid, so what is the big deal? I will now concern myself with his questions, some which are rather interesting.

on HARRY POTTER;
I absolutely adore the Harry Potter books. I think they're amazing (though the film was quite disappointing) and wonderfully entertaining. Yes, more entertaining (and at times, more poignant) than the Bible. Anyone is entitled to thinking it to be Boring with a capital B, but I think the notion that its evil is ludicrous.

on GOD BLESS AMERICA;
Well, its always been something the US president said anyway, by custom, isn't it? I don't think Mr.Bush, or anyone else for that matter (except the Taliban) would like to make this war 'holy'. The fact that there are many Islamic dissidents making this war a 'jihad' or holy war, is disturbing and a way to make more muslims fight against christians. They're trying to make everything black and white, something which is quite dangerous in the world of various shades of grey. So no, I don't think anyone on THIS side of the political framework is trying to make it seem like a holy war.

on PETTINESS;
Melon, I do think everyone has pettiness. When you claim to have found pettiness in others, others will claim that they have found 'arrogance' in you. What's the point of thinking oneself different in those terms? We're all petty human beings. We're all lined up for the crack of the guillotine.

on the NATURE OF DEBATE;
I adore contradicting myself and others. I adore debating, because it should be a way of educating yourself and others. I sincerely believe that people who don't know enough about a situation shouldn't form opinions, it stands to reason. In this day and age in particular, opinions are very important things, the more educated the opinion is, the better.

on WHETHER ITS BETTER TO GO WITH A BANG OR FADE AWAY;
I would hate to fade away. If I'm going to die (something I very much dread)I would like to go with a bang (except the bang of a gun shot, I don't want to be shot to death). I want a poetic death. Dramatic and hysterical, sort of like Clare Quilty's in LOLITA, without the gun-shots.

Melon, what do you think?

Ant.

[melon]

Originally posted by Trash Can:
... Not all Catholic priests are created equal!

Yes, I know. Honestly, this was more of a complaint about my specific priest than the whole of Catholicism. I just seemingly find myself surrounded by conservatives all the time.

My dear "Monsignor Gerrie" at my Catholic Church AND School allows Harry Potter books. Theres a mess of them in the library. He also has a children's Halloween Festival,...Witches, gouls, and all.

That's cool, really. I doubt any of these children will equate Harry Potter with a serious intent to convert to witchcraft. Right instruction and encouragement will always negate any evil, while suppression only stimulates curiousity.

It actually DID concern THIS psuedo-liberal Catholic, in fact.... So I asked him about it. He calmly looked at me and with a warm smile said, "If they don't want to read it, or take part in a festival... They don't have to!"

... I... didn't know what else to say... So I just shut up.

I really like your Monsignor. Too bad he's not in Michigan...hehe.

BTW, what's "addenda"??? Am I stupid for not knowing what that is?

ad·den·dum (-dndm)
n. pl. ad·den·da (-d)
Something added or to be added, especially a supplement to a book.

And don't feel stupid.

Melon

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"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time

[melon]

Originally posted by 80sU2isBest:
Yes, Melon, line 2 is sarcasm, but not in the way you might think. I have no doubt that you are intelligent. What I was talking about was this continuous drone of yours "oh woe is me...it is so difficult to be so damn smart". Melon, have you never heard of ...humility...modesty? I think those two characteristics are much more important in a person than "book smarts". Maybe you don't know it, but it gets awfully tiring hearing from your own lips how intelligent you are. And no, I don't feel bad about this bit of sarcasm, because this one was in direct response to you rather than the way I had been know to do it in the past, hit and run "behind your back".

I really should just start stalking your threads, quite honestly, making caddy remarks on little parts of your threads, while completely ignoring the point.

But just my luck, I'd get banned, so I'll just leave it at that.

Melon

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"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time

[melon]

Originally posted by kobayashi:
i don't know if i'm smart enough to be posting in here.
hehehe
no honestly melon some interesting thoughts.
your 'world without the internet', i'm curious as to what media you are exposing yourself to? or by media do you simply mean avoiding this particular site?

You are more than smart enough to post in here, and I will more than defend your right to post here.

The internet, to me, has seemingly replaced human interaction in so many instances. We've also become maddeningly dependent on a computer network that seemingly runs at a snail's pace, feeds us a bunch of unwanted ads, and, while broadening our horizons world-wide, it can isolate you from the real world.

But, honestly, as much as I've complained about it, I could not imagine life without it. I've used it to make my life better, but I almost think I've hit a point where I think I am better off cutting myself from it. Like a fetus which requires an umbilical cord for live in-utero, that same lifeline is cut upon birth, otherwise that same newborn would die.

Plus, I cannot but lament the fact that this forum has increasingly pissed me off, not because of disagreement with what I write, but because of all the personal attacks and two-faced activities in Interference. And it's not just this post. It's been several, and I cannot help but wonder what they would do if I similarly went on a personal attack spree unprovoked in their posts. One must ask, at some point, as to whether it is all worth it?

Melon

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"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time

[melon]

Originally posted by rougerum:
Screenwriting.........going to conform at all to the type of scripts that get bought or keep it personal as possible?

~rougerum

I love all my scripts, honestly. They are written in my style, but in different genres. Some genres are more commercial, by nature, so they will likely be what I write mostly in the beginning, if I can break through. Then, if I am lucky enough to be successful, I would definitely be more apt to try and push the envelope, and by "push the envelope," I'm not talking gratuitiousness in sex and violence--it's already been done, and it bores me--but in genuine plots, which, historically, have been hard to come by in Hollywood. I would love to, someday, be able to try and make my mark in the world of film and television, whether it be in writing or in production.

Melon

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"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time

[melon]

Originally posted by Klodomir:
Mr. Melon is a glutton for punishment, methinks.

If I can successfully make people think outside of conventions, then I will have served my purpose. I don't expect people to change their beliefs, but, rather, take the time to ask "why" they believe what they do.

My style of debate and writing is, actually, heavily influenced by a high school religion teacher I had. He knew the right buttons to push to make me think, and I still don't know what ideology he prescribes to in reality.

Melon

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"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time

[80sU2isBest]

Originally posted by melon:
I really should just start stalking your threads, quite honestly, making caddy remarks on little parts of your threads, while completely ignoring the point.
But just my luck, I'd get banned, so I'll just leave it at that.

Melon, I only make what you call "caddy" remarks when you make comments about your own intelligence. And how can you boast about your intelligence all the time and NOT expect people to make remarks? This is a discussion forum, for crying out loud. How come you can proclaim "In am smart", but then whine when someone says "Maybe so, but you're pretty darned arrogant, evidently". You can't have it both ways, melon. If you draw attention to yourself in a boastful manner like that, that leaves the door wide open for people to comment on how egotistical it is to do so.

You may be smart, so what? We know that by now - you have told us no less than 5 times. Why do you have to keep reminding us of that by proclaiming it? Shouldn't your intelligence speak for itself?

But maybe I should just let it go. I don't know why it bugs me so much, but it does. People who brag about their intellignce has always gotten under my skin. It just bugs me to no end, and that is why I feel I must say something everytime you do it. In a weird way, my strange compulsion to jump on you for that is every bit as strong as your strange compulsion to do it.

But it's not my job to change someone's personality into something that is more pleasant to me. I couldn't do it even if it were my job.

Sadly, I think I will always bug you, and you will always bug me. Ah well, such is life. Not everyone gets along swimmingly.

I am going to make every effort now to let it go.



[This message has been edited by 80sU2isBest (edited 11-26-2001).]

[melon]

Originally posted by Anthony:
Melon, I would LOVE to chat with your priest, he seems to be a rather amusing fellow. Not to mention deluded.

Well, I would just like to mention that I don't think he's really representative of Catholicism as a whole. At least in my experience, I've found it to be fairly open minded and lacking in hysterics regarding touchy subjects in art and literature.

But I cannot help still getting mad over it. An archeology art exhibit on lesbian frescoes unearthed in Italy from the Roman era was suppressed for more than half a century because the Vatican disliked it. My favorite deluded comment was, "It could make even the most chaste tempted to sin." And I could only just drop my head in disbelief. Are we so obsessed with social control and sugar-coating our past that we cannot handle the truth? Do we have so little faith in mankind that we expect people to become lesbians because of ancient frescos? Do we have so little faith in mankind that we expect people to become witches after reading Harry Potter?

And perhaps this is what puts me at odds with many of my fellow Christians. I give people credit for being able to choose what is right and wrong.

And I think it would be interesting if you ever did argue with my priest. He probably would never expect it.

Melon

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"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time

[melon]

Originally posted by famous rungi:
Look at the monster of a thread you created melon; this is either talent or a curse .

I "freed my mind," to say the least, and I do believe everything I wrote. I don't like to avoid controversy.

Harry Potter. I don't think 80s was saying the books are evil in themselves, he was agreeing with the possible negative influence they could have.

Well, he is free to believe that, and I'm more than free to disagree. I have no problem with that.

Then again, almost anything floating around in the modern world has possible negative influence. I don't think Harry Potter is evil myself; I just think the books are Boring.

Exactly. I think people should be free to decide for themselves. Everything can be negative if people put that label on it. Likewise, everything can be positive if people put that label on it. I think Trash Can's Monsignor is an excellent example of that; while not denying the fun and fantasy aspects of Harry Potter, he has also probably made it clear that this is fiction. In such a context, I think it is great. It really confounded me when the controversy did begin. Did anyone really think that people took Harry Potter anywhere beyond the realm of fiction?

To melon, honestly I think it is foolish to get disillusioned with your religion, or Christianity in general, just because your priest reacted too strongly towards Harry Potter, while you yourself know inside that his reaction was wrong. In other words, you know he is not being wise about it yet you get affected by him. If you're still not happy about it, consider changing church or denomination?

Well, I probably should have made this clearer. My priest has made tons of social commentary points, everything from making people feel guilty for not voting Republican to telling us that children should only read the Bible to going on emotion-filled guilt trips about any topic imaginable. Just so you know the context this comes from, the Catholic Church officially preaches neutrality on political issues--i.e., priests are not to tell you which party or candidate to vote for, but to inform you of the Church's stance on issues. Basically, rather than say, "Vote Republican," he should have stated the issues, like pro-life issues. Plus, this book banning stuff is very un-Catholic, particularly since this practice was frowned upon after Vatican II. Basically, this may be acceptable in many denominations, but I do not think this should be acceptable, even on the basis of official Catholic law. But, what kills me the most is that liberal dissidents are often silenced, while conservative dissidents are left alone.

But I have considered a new denomination, but I don't like most of them, due to doctrine issues, which I am pretty close in agreement with Catholicism. It's the social stances I end up having problems with. I would likely end up creating my own Christian denomination, but, considering I'm Catholic in upbringing, that is harder than, say, I had been brought up Protestant. Whether I'd like to admit it or not, I'm quite old-fashioned at heart, but circumstances and reality have rendered that impossible.

Wisdom is like maturity, I think. The rule is that you're not allowed to say or even acknowledge that you're mature because once you do, it shows a lack of it. As someone great once said, "the more I know, the more I know that I do not know", or was it "the more I learn, the more there is to learn".

Yes, I do like this statement. One thing I will admit is that I sound more boastful on the internet than in person. I sometimes think that if Interferencers met me in person, they would not believe that I am really "melon" and the real "melon" must be hiding behind a curtain. I think that, sometimes, the person behind "melon" is more like "Whortense" in too many respects.

You don't truly believe that of Christians, do you, melon?

I don't think this of all Christians. Certain sects exhibit this behavior, though, and I personally find it disconcerting.

The opinion that the Bible glorifies genocide is looking at it pretty narrowly. Putting it very simply, the Bible shows that God punishes nations who behave badly. Jeremiah 44, for eg. What is this big chip against Christianity or the Bible that you carry on your shoulder?

Well, my point with that, really, is that the Bible is a very violent book, full of every human emotion imaginable. It is said that all plots, really, were originally stated in the Bible. However, people are smart enough to know that they shouldn't emulate Joshua's use of "The Ban" in conquering Canaan, where God commanded the Israelite army to destroy all living people and all property in it's path. Likewise, I think people are smart enough not to emulate any witchcraft elements in Harry Potter.

Melon

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"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time

[Anthony]

"And I think it would be interesting if you ever did argue with my priest. He probably would never expect it. "

Hehe, I have a long history involving me irritating priests to the point where they reccomend my family to have my first holy communion somewhere else. Spending the first years of my life in a Nun's school and then a formal Catholic School didn't do wonders for my faith. Oh, I do believe in God, I just don't believe in all the paperwork surrounding him. ie - religion.

Melon, what do you believe in?

Ant.