Imagine if Moment Of Surrender was...

[last unicorn]

I don't understand how people can think that Mercy has turned into MOS, just because MOS is rumoured to be of approx. the same length.

I love Mercy and I still think it would fit well with the clips we know so far.
I don't think Mercy and MOS are the same song and I think only one of them will be on the album and this one will be Moment Of Surrender. I hope it's an epic song with a long guitar solo. One thing I didn't like about Mercy is the (too) short guitar part that started so promising.

 

[U2DMfan]

Now, out of all these "best" U2 songs, the top 3 (arguably more) are all Eno's anyway! So when Eno said MOS was the "best thing he'd ever done with U2," it's saying the same thing as, "the best U2 song ever," without actually saying it.

Sorry, Loris you have Boy, October, War, Rattle and Hum, POP, HTDAAB
That's 6/11 more than half of U2's album catalog not produced by Eno. Not to mention the fact that (as you point out) Eno doesn't even produce every track on the albums he does produce.

You just want to believe the hype don't you?

I am as big of an Eno fan as you'll find around here but it's disengenous to say he meant something he simply never said.

 

[Screwtape2]

I love Mercy and I still think it would fit well with the clips we know so far.
I don't think Mercy and MOS are the same song and I think only one of them will be on the album and this one will be Moment Of Surrender. I hope it's an epic song with a long guitar solo. One thing I didn't like about Mercy is the (too) short guitar part that started so promising.

I hate to agree that both won't be on the album. If they were Larry's head would explode.

If they opened the album with Moment of Surrender and closed with Mercy, I'd love the album. The rest could suck but that opening and closing would be too great.

 

[Bottle Bono]

Without Brian Eno there would have been no Beautiful Day. He is the one who fought for the song when no one else believed in it. When Bono, out of no where uttered the sacred scream at one recording session .."It's a beautiful day..."

It was Eno who suggested they go in that direction.

It was a moment that could easily have been lost

When the The Edge thought it was "just another ordinary sounding U2 song"

Eno told him to go back into the studio and work harder on the chords.

It was Eno who thought of the overdub of the Heart beat...

The song was dead without Eno and it ended up winning the Grammy as Song ad Record of the Year and defined U2 in the 2000 years.

Eno's genius made it all happen.

The song is widely hailed as U2's magnum opus, and it marked a decisive point in the band's career and set them on the way to become one of the world's most popular music groups

Thank God for Brian.

He is the Wizard

In U2's Oz.

All Beacause of You, All because of Eno...

It truely is a Beautiful Day.

 

[roy]

I don't understand how people can think that Mercy has turned into MOS, just because MOS is rumoured to be of approx. the same length.

I agree.

MOS is probably one of the new songs metioned on u2.com last June:

"One track they've been working up sounds like a soul song with distinctly
Arabic rhythms. Another is an epic story-telling piece which seems to run for seven or eight minutes. This time, as the music stops, the birdsong is in competition with a local muezzin, calling the people of Fez to prayer."

 

[david]

This album sounds like it's going to be the fully realized October album.

 

[bram]

I agree.

MOS is probably one of the new songs metioned on u2.com last June:

"One track they've been working up sounds like a soul song with distinctly
Arabic rhythms. Another is an epic story-telling piece which seems to run for seven or eight minutes. This time, as the music stops, the birdsong is in competition with a local muezzin, calling the people of Fez to prayer."

Ooooh, I forgot about these quotes. Awesome. Not really a description of the song that we can sink our teeth into, however. Did the one fan who supposedly heard MOS describe it in any detail besides its length?

 

[PowerSurge]

I didn't think they could do this acoustically:

YouTube - U2 - Please acoustic (live from Elevation Miami)

MEH!

"Please" is one of my favorite songs of the U2 POST Joshua Tree era. It wasn't captured very well on POP, but it blossomed on the POPMART tour...easily the highlight of that tour.

I find it completely dissappointing and flat as an accoustic song. Some songs just don't work stripped down..and this is one of them. This song is just as much about the drums and bass as the guitar. Goes to show you how valuable Larry and Adam are to a song when you remove them from the performance.

But thank you very much for the link...It was interesting to hear it THAT way.

 

[PowerSurge]

I hate to agree that both won't be on the album. If they were Larry's head would explode.

If they opened the album with Moment of Surrender and closed with Mercy, I'd love the album. The rest could suck but that opening and closing would be too great.

I need to ask everyone a question...and bare with me, I'm not trying to cause trouble (though I probably will)...I'm simply confused.

Why do people believe that Mercy belongs on this NEXT album or ANY album for that matter?

Seriously...I've tried, and tried, and tried to embrace the song MERCY...but can't. I hate to say this, but there are parts of the song/lyrics that just sound corny. It sounds like a new age "Elvis Presley in America" where Bono is just randomly spitting out non sensical lyrics in some parts that he hopes make sense and will be cohesive with the song's meaning...when in actuality they don't seem to be.

I've thought that maybe it was just me, because a large number of people think Mercy is the greatest thing since sliced bread. And since I like sliced bread, I thought that I was missing something.

So I ask someone to please tell me why they believe this song belongs on a U2 album.

I personally see it as a glorified long U2 b-side. I think I would have prefered to have "Xanax and Wine" on HTDAAB instead of Mercy because its just a much better song. I just don't get the whole "Mercy" thing...don't get it one bit.

 

[LemonMelon]

If they opened the album with Moment of Surrender and closed with Mercy, I'd love the album. The rest could suck but that opening and closing would be too great.

 

[U2girl]

Sorry, Loris you have Boy, October, War, Rattle and Hum, POP, HTDAAB
That's 6/11 more than half of U2's album catalog not produced by Eno.

True but non Eno/Lanois producers tend to bring more, uh, questionable results. On the other hand, Eno/Lanois produced albums are universally loved, not to mention they were behind their most crucial moments and reinventions.

I agree - if Eno and Lanois bring out the best in U2 and if Eno says MoS is the best song he's ever worked on with U2, we might be getting U2's best song overall.

ps333 - because it just might be the best U2 songs of this decade. Because it is reminiscent of something like Bad in that it abandons the usual verse/chorus structure. Because it has vocals that could pass for AB era Bono. A lot of U2 songs try and don't have *it*, this song has it. (though I fully agree some work on the lyrics needs to be done) And finally, because at first Bono announced it would be "the best B-side ever" when Bomb came out but it didn't happen. That with Bono and Edge saying it's still around/being worked on makes me think Mercy is indeed coming on this next album.

 

[PowerSurge]

ps333 - because it just might be the best U2 songs of this decade. Because it is reminiscent of something like Bad in that it abandons the usual verse/chorus structure. Because it has vocals that could pass for AB era Bono. A lot of U2 songs try and don't have *it*, this song has it. (though I fully agree some work on the lyrics needs to be done) And finally, because at first Bono announced it would be "the best B-side ever" when Bomb came out but it didn't happen. That with Bono and Edge saying it's still around/being worked on makes me think Mercy is indeed coming on this next album.

I appreciate the articulate response, and your obvious passion for the song...but I don't agree...Sorry

I agree with your comment that its DIFFERENT in the same way that BAD is different..but I think thats exactly why so many people like it; because its DIFFERENT. But IMO, its not GREAT...its merely DIFFERENT and just OKAY.

I guess most of the reason why I don't think it is a GREAT song has to be the lyrics. The whole overdone "love" thing is just too corny for me. "Love will live again...again" Doesn't do it for me. It kind of reminds me of the song "Native Son" GREAT tune...bad lyrics. They reworked it, and out came "Vertigo" GREAT tune...much better lyrics, SUPER catchy Chorus.

In the end, if they can rework the lyrics and the chorus..then maybe you've got a winner. The reason why BAD worked/works so well is because it has a slow build up, and once it gets to the point when its ready to blow...IT DOES. And it just hits a wonderful pinnacle of emotion.

Mercy has the build up...but no real EXPLOSION. It just falls flat IMO. Again, if they can rework the lyrics and change the chorus it could be a winner. As it is NOW...it is exactly what Bono called it: "The best B-side ever"

 

[U2girl]

The solo ? That's when it blows and goes off. Maybe not as much as Bad but it's there.

It's certainly the most debated and controversial song of this decade.

 

[PowerSurge]

The solo ? That's when it blows and goes off. Maybe not as much as Bad but it's there.

It's certainly the most debated and controversial song of this decade.

Well if they would have released a song called: SEXY BOOTS then we would have had a NEW winner.

 

[U2girl]

The winner will be, no doubt, if they will one day choose to re-record Pop.

 

[LemonMelon]

It's certainly the most debated and controversial song of this decade.

Which is precisely why it deserves to be finished and released. Not simply because it's controversial, but because the number of people who absolutely love the song surpass the amount who don't get the hype.

 

[vaz02]

Stories like the creation of Elvis Presley & America tell a different story. I'd argue that on certain albums that Eno and Lanois have been far more important than Larry or Adam.

Eno compliments u2 just as much as u2 compliments Eno. They bring out the best in each other.

 

[Rob33]

As it is NOW...it is exactly what Bono called it: "The best B-side ever"

ok...? So you're agreeing that it's the best B-side ever? haha...ok well then you have to think somewhat highly of this song....by saying that you're putting it over a lot of great U2 songs....surely a song of that calibre that missed the last record deserves a chance on the new one?
And besides...think about this...if Mercy didn't make the last album, why the heck would it make the next album if it wasn't reworked to a significant degree, or at least improved in some way? Obviously it didn't make the cut because it wasn't good enough in some way...so there is no way this song will be on the next record unless it is reworked in some form....but, the best B-side ever? I think "the best B-side ever" that is currently not actually a B-side deserves to be given a chance to take a spot on the new album...I mean your opinions of the song don't align with your final conclusion, that it is what Bono says...Throughout your entire post it sounds like you really don't care much for the song and you don't understand any of this hype...but you think it's "the best B-side ever" ???

Anyway...I wouldn't like to see Mercy on the new album in the exact same form primarily because of the lyrics...there are some good lines and then some really questionable lines...and Bono has to see the lyrical weaknesses...It sounds like he was sort of thinking as he sang, and it was recorded in half-decent quality, and then that got leaked...I bet he made some of these lines up on the spot...or did some improvisational stuff while recording

 

[Michael Griffiths]

Sorry, Loris you have Boy, October, War, Rattle and Hum, POP, HTDAAB
That's 6/11 more than half of U2's album catalog not produced by Eno. Not to mention the fact that (as you point out) Eno doesn't even produce every track on the albums he does produce.

You just want to believe the hype don't you?

I am as big of an Eno fan as you'll find around here but it's disengenous to say he meant something he simply never said.

I wasn't talking about albums. I was talking about individual songs. Brian Eno didn't say anything about recording the best album ever. He said 'Moment of Surrender' was the best "thing" (song) he'd ever done with U2. So, let's examine the best U2 songs (once again). Which songs, from the general music fan's perspective (not the U2 super fan perspective), would you say are their "best"? Again, if you polled most music fans, they would put these songs as U2's best (in no particular order):

Where the Streets Have No Name (top 10 WW hit)
One (top 10 WW hit)
With or Without You (#1 WW hit)
I Still Haven't Found (#1 WW hit)
Pride (WW top 10 hit)

These are (as close to being objective as we can be in music) considered U2's best songs, not just from a sales perspective, but from a pop culture perspective and the impact they have made on the canon of pop music. Eno produced all of them. It doesn't matter how many other albums U2 have that were not produced by Eno. We are discussing songs, not albums!

Morover, even if Eno produced only one U2 song ever - and that one song was the best U2 song - that is enough to put this argument to rest. The debate of "best U2 song" usually centres around 'Streets' and 'One' and 'With or Without You'. So you have 3, one of which can be the "best" depending on which part of the majority you talk to. Now, unless you can come up with a song that is considered by the populace to be better than those 3, Eno has basically said (regardless if he truly believes it or not) that MOS is the best U2 song (if he does indeed believe it is better than the previous best songs he's produced).

But Pop is a great album. Don't believe the hype, indeed

 

[U2DMfan]

I see we have devolved into Mercy debate #4,525,789

I guess most of the reason why I don't think it is a GREAT song has to be the lyrics. The whole overdone "love" thing is just too corny for me. "Love will live again...again" Doesn't do it for me. It kind of reminds me of the song "Native Son" GREAT tune...bad lyrics. They reworked it, and out came "Vertigo" GREAT tune...much better lyrics, SUPER catchy Chorus.

Yeah, somehow lauding the greatness of Vertigo's gimmicks doesn't do much to downgrade Mercy in my eyes.

We can all find a cheesy couplet in any 2 U2 songs.
"Love will come again" vs "Your love is teaching me how to kneel"-Jeezus, talk about straight up corny. How about this? It's more of the same thing.

However there is nothing in the 'Radio Friendly Unit Shifter' known as Vertigo (a song that I like well enough) that resembles this:

I was drinking some wine and it turned to blood
What’s the use of religion if you’re any good
I know I’m weed killer, honey, and you’re sugar
If you’re the prosecution I get away with murder
If you were ice, I’m water
And with your telescope I can see further
We’re binary code, a one and a zero
You wanted violins and you got Nero
You’re gravity searching for the ground
You’re silence searching for a sound
Your heart is aching, your heart is my home
It’s fascinating, I know I’ll never be alone

It might not be his best lyric overall but these verses are among his best since the end of POPmart. With some work it could be an epic song.

Why do people believe that Mercy belongs on this NEXT album or ANY album for that matter?

Because as is, it's as good as half of the songs on the last 2 albums.
And it's not even a fully realized song, that just about says it all.

 

[Screwtape2]

I need to ask everyone a question...and bare with me, I'm not trying to cause trouble (though I probably will)...I'm simply confused.

Why do people believe that Mercy belongs on this NEXT album or ANY album for that matter?

Seriously...I've tried, and tried, and tried to embrace the song MERCY...but can't. I hate to say this, but there are parts of the song/lyrics that just sound corny. It sounds like a new age "Elvis Presley in America" where Bono is just randomly spitting out non sensical lyrics in some parts that he hopes make sense and will be cohesive with the song's meaning...when in actuality they don't seem to be.

I've thought that maybe it was just me, because a large number of people think Mercy is the greatest thing since sliced bread. And since I like sliced bread, I thought that I was missing something.

So I ask someone to please tell me why they believe this song belongs on a U2 album.

I personally see it as a glorified long U2 b-side. I think I would have prefered to have "Xanax and Wine" on HTDAAB instead of Mercy because its just a much better song. I just don't get the whole "Mercy" thing...don't get it one bit.

First off, most of the songs from this decade have an awkward lyric. That's who Bono is this decade.

People think Mercy should be on the album because it captures that energy through uncertainty that songs like Bad and Lemon had. Bono sounds great and the ending is amazing. Plus I feel a lot of fans imagine what it would be like live and it excites them. Personally, U2 hasn't had a new song this powerful in their live arsenal since Please.

 

[LemonMelon]

Mercy sounds a whole lot like Clips 1 and 4 from the beach clips. I'm sorry, but that song would absolutely fit into the new album, and those who think that it wouldn't fit there because it originated in another album's sessions are simply mistaken.

 

[Rob33]

Mercy sounds a whole lot like Clips 1 and 4 from the beach clips. I'm sorry, but that song would absolutely fit into the new album, and those who think that it wouldn't fit there because it originated in another album's sessions are simply mistaken.

new record:

clip 402
No Line On the Horizon
beach clip 1
Breathe
Get On Your Boots
Moment of Surrender
Beach clip 5
Mercy
Beach clip 4



how does that sound so far.... LemonMelon?

 

[Screwtape2]

new record:

clip 402
No Line On the Horizon
beach clip 1
Breathe
Get On Your Boots
Moment of Surrender
Beach clip 5
Mercy
Beach clip 4



how does that sound so far.... LemonMelon?

I really hope 402 isn't on the album unless it got darker and more of an edge to it. That's what I'm getting the sense of in the clips.

 

[popacrobat]

402= Spider man. I stand by it. Boy falls from the Sky. as rumored by that spider man article. and I think it's better served there. I'm surprised more people aren't excited for the U2-version of the soundtrack. It's the closest thing to a dual album we're going to get I think.

 

[popacrobat]

As for Mercy, I hope it does make the album. I hope it's reworked though because I don't want the same version of it. I'm sure it will be, 4 years later and all. But I think it has heaps of potential and could really be a great live song. My opinion on it has changed over the years.

 

[LemonMelon]

new record:

clip 402
No Line On the Horizon
beach clip 1
Breathe
Get On Your Boots
Moment of Surrender
Beach clip 5
Mercy
Beach clip 4



how does that sound so far.... LemonMelon?

Fantastic. Better than HTDAAB by a fair amount, and I dug that record.

 

[PowerSurge]

ok...? So you're agreeing that it's the best B-side ever? haha...ok well then you have to think somewhat highly of this song....by saying that you're putting it over a lot of great U2 songs....surely a song of that calibre that missed the last record deserves a chance on the new one?
And besides...think about this...if Mercy didn't make the last album, why the heck would it make the next album if it wasn't reworked to a significant degree, or at least improved in some way? Obviously it didn't make the cut because it wasn't good enough in some way...so there is no way this song will be on the next record unless it is reworked in some form....but, the best B-side ever? I think "the best B-side ever" that is currently not actually a B-side deserves to be given a chance to take a spot on the new album...I mean your opinions of the song don't align with your final conclusion, that it is what Bono says...Throughout your entire post it sounds like you really don't care much for the song and you don't understand any of this hype...but you think it's "the best B-side ever" ???

Anyway...I wouldn't like to see Mercy on the new album in the exact same form primarily because of the lyrics...there are some good lines and then some really questionable lines...and Bono has to see the lyrical weaknesses...It sounds like he was sort of thinking as he sang, and it was recorded in half-decent quality, and then that got leaked...I bet he made some of these lines up on the spot...or did some improvisational stuff while recording

I think you are either completely missing my point or actually backing up what I said in your post. Hmmm....not sure.

Not sure which it is because you yourself seem like you are weaving back and forth between whether or not the song is great in its current form or would be great in a modified form.

Like I said before, it just doesn't seem good enough to be on any record because it just doesn't seemed finished and polished enought to be on an album. The lyrics seem like they aren't quite fully developed and it doesn't sound to me like they fit the music playing. Sometimes it seems like Bono's just making up the words as he goes. Not very polished to my ears. I appreciate "raw" but not "under done".

Again, yes, I think its a great "b-side" Best ever? Eh..possibly...but then again....maybe not. I actually think that "Xanax and Wine" is a much better b-side because its as close to finished as possible, while still being able to be on an album. Problem is that its not even really a b-side since it was reworked and made into a pretty good song (Fast Cars)

I believe "Mercy" has the very same potential to be reworked...maybe even shortened and made into the fantastic song that it COULD be, but just isn't right now.

Hey, just MY opinion...you and everyone else have your own opinion. We can agree to disagree. I'm sure we see eye to eye about U2's music more often than not. I have a feeling that this is not one of them...but...its cool.

 

[PowerSurge]

I see we have devolved into Mercy debate #4,525,789



Yeah, somehow lauding the greatness of Vertigo's gimmicks doesn't do much to downgrade Mercy in my eyes.

We can all find a cheesy couplet in any 2 U2 songs.
"Love will come again" vs "Your love is teaching me how to kneel"-Jeezus, talk about straight up corny. How about this? It's more of the same thing.

However there is nothing in the 'Radio Friendly Unit Shifter' known as Vertigo (a song that I like well enough) that resembles this:

I was drinking some wine and it turned to blood
What’s the use of religion if you’re any good
I know I’m weed killer, honey, and you’re sugar
If you’re the prosecution I get away with murder
If you were ice, I’m water
And with your telescope I can see further
We’re binary code, a one and a zero
You wanted violins and you got Nero
You’re gravity searching for the ground
You’re silence searching for a sound
Your heart is aching, your heart is my home
It’s fascinating, I know I’ll never be alone

It might not be his best lyric overall but these verses are among his best since the end of POPmart. With some work it could be an epic song.



Because as is, it's as good as half of the songs on the last 2 albums.
And it's not even a fully realized song, that just about says it all.

You are further proving my point...it needs work. I've NEVER said the song was BAD. I also never said that Vertigo was THE GREATEST THING SINCE SLICED BREAD. I merely used it as an example of how a song can be reworked to be made better...not as a direct comparison to "Mercy". You obviously totally missed my point.

As it stands...it does not belong on any album...WITH SOME REWORKING...it could be great and find itself on the new album. THATS MY POINT!!!

 

[Screwtape2]

I believe "Mercy" has the very same potential to be reworked...maybe even shortened and made into the fantastic song that it COULD be, but just isn't right now.

Never use the word 'shortened' when talking about Mercy. It should stay at its current length unless they want to extend the intro.