You're the Best Thing About Me - Song Discussion

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Lanois is more important that Eno. Eno is a great sounding board for what is 'experimental' and what is 'mainstream'. He'll throw tweak songs, that are commercially appealing and give it a sort of experimental sound. He's abstract and ambience. Lanois is all about songs, and song structure. Guitar here, drum patterns there, rhythm over there. He's more plugged into where U2 are, and Eno is plugged into what U2 thinks they are.

Anyhow, they're important, no doubt, but they're not in vogue. What they do is no longer where music is today. No matter what we want, U2 is in the 'business and they follow the trends...:yes:
 
Another producer they'll probably never work with again is Danger Mouse and that's a shame. I like SOI very much but I bet an early version of it with just Danger Mouse was probably more interesting.

By now I think any producer working on their albums in the initial stages knows full well that what they work on won't survive and that it will morph into something else, for better or worse.
 
Just like other aging musicians; Eno and Lanois have fallen into their own bag of tricks.

This board cracks me up, experiment experiment experiment, but what I really mean is do what you did 20 years ago.
 
Just like other aging musicians; Eno and Lanois have fallen into their own bag of tricks.

This board cracks me up, experiment experiment experiment, but what I really mean is do what you did 20 years ago.
[emoji106] if they done every album with eno and lanois I think it would just become bland. Experiment for experiment sake,I know some people here love Radiohead but to me some of their stuff is unlistenable. Especially King of limbs album.

God I hope U2 never go down that road!
 
They absolutely had to do records without Eno and Lanois. Zero doubt about that. Just like they had to do something different after War.

That doesn't mean, however, that their best, and most important music, and the music that elevated them from being merely good to iconic, wasn't made with those two, because it was.
 
[emoji106] if they done every album with eno and lanois I think it would just become bland. Experiment for experiment sake,I know some people here love Radiohead but to me some of their stuff is unlistenable. Especially King of limbs album.

God I hope U2 never go down that road!

Totally agree. Radiohead has completely lost me. And they were once a band whose album I'd go to the record store at midnight for on release days. I hope U2 never does what Radiohead are doing now.
 
Lanois is more important that Eno. Eno is a great sounding board for what is 'experimental' and what is 'mainstream'. He'll throw tweak songs, that are commercially appealing and give it a sort of experimental sound. He's abstract and ambience. Lanois is all about songs, and song structure. Guitar here, drum patterns there, rhythm over there. He's more plugged into where U2 are, and Eno is plugged into what U2 thinks they are.

Anyhow, they're important, no doubt, but they're not in vogue. What they do is no longer where music is today. No matter what we want, U2 is in the 'business and they follow the trends...:yes:

Wholeheartedly disagree. Lanois was resistant against U2's stylistic reinvention with Achtung Baby, and The Edge agreed with Eno to take With Or Without You in a more mystical direction, as opposed to Lanois who saw it as a more conventional rock song. The truly great moments from 1984-1994 are courtesy of the Eno magic. It's particularly evident on Zooropa which has it in spades, and The Unforgettable Fire.
 
Brian Eno in particular is to U2 what George Martin was to The Beatles.

A sounding board for great ideas and an expert intuition in pulling the band in a direction that never seemed capable before.

They just fit together like hand in glove - a marriage of convenience between the Celtic mysticism and deep spirituality of U2's music with Eno's abstract sonic landscapes conjures up a vivid imaginative world unlike anything other in music for me personally. Heartfelt with a range of emotions, that ability to also take your mind to a physical environment - imaginary or real - is tantamount to the success of U2.

It really depends on who the producer is - Bono and The Edge in particular have proven themselves as visionary songwriters willing to take their music to new levels, and it often required a producer with the same artistic vision and creativity to achieve those ideals. That happened without Brian Eno - Mofo (along with a few handful of tunes from Pop) for me is a monumental piece of work that achieved artistic gratification similar to their work with Eno, albeit very different sonically.

So it is a real disappointment when U2 opt for producers who just simply are not artists. The nadir of this is hiring Ryan Tedder, a producer and songwriter so artistically bankrupt it is cringeworthy and painful to see such a creatively expansive band hire him and take themselves down to a level that is unbefitting of the ethereal qualities that made this band one of the greatest ever.

And while they do try to incorporate some of the sonic tricks into these songs worked on by dull MOR producers like Tedder, it feels more or less just like attractive paraphernalia in an attempt to comfort long time fans that this is still the same band. But it's not - it doesn't have that Eno inspired organic nature to it where tiny little sonic fragments thread into the fabric of a sonic landscape and evoke a feeling. It's all too mechanical, rectilinear and tacked on, rather than the culmination of almost disparate sounds into an aural frame to create one whole piece of music ala A Sort Of Homecoming.

Subtlety is what separates U2 from being merely a big band to being a great one. While their music is typically stereotyped as euphoric, these moments of euphoria were embedded in a subdued and melancholy context which made those moments cathartic and all the more effective. And that concerns the sonic, melodic and lyrical aspects of the band where everything seems so much more blunt and hamfisted. Bono does not need to sing big choruses to be effective, but these days he thinks he has to - it doesn't work, because the subtlety in the music and the melody is not there anymore. It all appears rather crass as a result, and it just seems that they've forgotten what made them great.

Which is why the time would be right for Brian Eno to jump back on this wayward ship. I believe U2 can still make brilliant music, but I'd like to hear them reign it in a bit musically, melodically and lyrically, and offer a more introspective and contemplative approach next time around (after Songs of Experience because let's be honest, they're taking the sledgehammer approach to songwriting with this one).

I'll leave it on an optimistic note to show you that I think the genius of the band is still there. The Little Things That Give You Away is my favourite of their new songs so far, primarily because there is an element of beautiful restraint, by which I mean the pre-chorus which threads the song nicely.

'Oh la la, I'm not a ghost now/I can see you/You need to see me' offers a subdued melody with a quiet desperation attached to its lyrics, providing us with a sense of insecurity and inner turmoil that slowly eats away at the song's protagonist (autobiographical I presume). It's not obvious on first listen, but it's quietly devastating when you finally acknowledge it. And because of this, the chorus is all the better for it - a typical wide reaching Bono chorus if ever there was one, but there's meaning and tenderness attached to it once again, just like they did way back when. That pre-chorus is a beautiful moment that proves to me that it is indeed 'the little things' that may not be so noticeable on first listen but emphatically strikes at the heart of what makes U2 such a great band for me.

You should be getting paid for your writing ;]

So what do you think? Eno and Lanois for SOA?

Or is that hoping for too much? Now that the rule of threes may be broken, who knows what happens after SOE...

BTW, I rate SOI pretty highly.

I know you're not fishing for compliments, but lovely (and very well written) post MattD....I especially like this...



Welcome to the board!

Thank you! :wave:
 
You should be getting paid for your writing ;]

So what do you think? Eno and Lanois for SOA?

Or is that hoping for too much? Now that the rule of threes may be broken, who knows what happens after SOE...

BTW, I rate SOI pretty highly.

I do admit I like Songs of Innocence, and it is a decent record but decent is nothing when comparing it to the unbelievably high standards of before.

I would absolutely love to see them reunite with Eno & Lanois on Songs of Ascent. There's hopefully a germination of an idea from the sessions (nearly 10 years ago! :crack:) that could culminate in something marvellous.
 
The truly great moments from 1984-1994 are courtesy of the Eno magic. It's particularly evident on Zooropa which has it in spades, and The Unforgettable Fire.

Eh, that's a bit overstating it. Zooropa is an interesting album, as is Passengers, but mass appeal-wise, they leave a lot of listeners cold or confused. U2 likes to think they are 'avant-garde' or 'alternative' but really they're a meat and potatoes rock band with a twist.

Eno is a definitely experimental and he and Edge are definitely students of the "less is more" style, but after The Joshua Tree he tended to pop in and out of sessions. Whatever issues Lanois and U2 had on AB, they figured it out (along with Flood and contributions here and there from Eno) made the best album of their career.

I'm not saying Eno isn't important, because their two most stylistic/artistic albums of the 80's he had a huge hand in creating, but afterwards he was more or less disinterested in producing 'rock bands' and Lanois seems to have taken a larger role each album.

That said ATYCLB is a big album for them, and Eno definitely seems to have played a bigger role in that than AB...so I can't say your 'entirely' off base (because you're not), but I do think you're overstating Eno's influence over Lanois'.
 
Just like other aging musicians; Eno and Lanois have fallen into their own bag of tricks.

This board cracks me up, experiment experiment experiment, but what I really mean is do what you did 20 years ago.

You clearly haven't heard Lanois last two records, but why let that stop you from putting words in other's mouths? Eno is also not repeating himself.
 
Lanois is more important that Eno. Eno is a great sounding board for what is 'experimental' and what is 'mainstream'. He'll throw tweak songs, that are commercially appealing and give it a sort of experimental sound. He's abstract and ambience. Lanois is all about songs, and song structure. Guitar here, drum patterns there, rhythm over there. He's more plugged into where U2 are, and Eno is plugged into what U2 thinks they are.

Lanois is just as abstract and ambient as Eno, if not more so at this point. Eno is also all about "songs." That's why people he works with usually make their best songs & albums when he's there. He is a brilliant songwriter.
 
Totally agree. Radiohead has completely lost me. And they were once a band whose album I'd go to the record store at midnight for on release days. I hope U2 never does what Radiohead are doing now.

Interesting, I feel the exact opposite. Radiohead continue to fascinate me, while U2 haven't in ages. Nigel Goodrich is most certainly to Radiohead what George Martin was to the Beatles, they have a special bond and have created some fantastic music together.

The Kings of Limbs is a polarizing record, but I loved it. It certainly takes a number of listens (as does a lot of their post-OK computer stuff, with the exception of In Rainbows). It's very rewarding when it finally clicks, but to each their own. I'm also a big Radiohead fan, so there's that.

I like that TKOL is extremely rhythm based and very minimalist, so perhaps that's why it worked for me. It was also a different direction from In Rainbows (another thing I love about Radiohead). Of course U2 have changed their sound and reinvented themselves too, but have since abandoned this. Although, they sort of tried it with NLOTH, but then retreated back to appease. Radiohead just do what they want. Yes, they're very different bands, but are certainly two of the biggest out there. Radiohead continues to challenge their audience, U2 not so much.

Radiohead are doing what U2 were doing during the 90s, maybe to different degrees, but they're still doing it. U2 haven't quite recovered after Pop, for whatever reason. If ATYCLB was a one off, that would've been fine, but it wasn't. I suppose when they became that popular again, it was hard to turn down, hence HTDAAB (an extremely pedestrian and boring record, with some decent songs). It's sad that those 2 albums are among their highest selling and most award winning ever, but I suppose that also simply reaffirms how meaningless awards are sales are. Another thing Radiohead don't care about.

I wouldn't mind if Eno and Lanois came back, but I'm not sure if it would yield the results some people want. But perhaps it could push them in a certain direction. I don't know, U2 don't have anything to prove anymore I guess and they don't really owe me anything. Of course, I'd love for them to make good music. If SOE is a massive failure, I'm not sure where this leaves them, also the Live Nation deal ending in 2020.

All that could be a blessing, and perhaps they'll retreat to the studio and dream it up again an exciting way. Or maybe they really are making the music they want to make at this very moment, I can't really say for certain (though my hunch is they just want a hit). Hopefully as I've heard, YTBTAM will be the most pop oriented track on the album, but I'll be cautious as always. My expectations aren't high, but I'm still intrigued to give it a listen. SOI (at least the back half) showed greatness, most especially SLABT and The Troubles, which is what U2 excel at. When they want to be a "rock" band, they don't really nail it. While some may love Vertigo and yes, it's generally harmless, this band is capable of so much more and they've shown that with certain tracks. When U2 go ballsy, dark, experimental, they can really blow people away. It's sad many people I know will tear U2 an asshole, because of Vertigo or Beautiful Day, but if I play them Acrobat, Zooropa, Do You Feel Loved, Miss Sarajevo or Slug, they'll be stunned. It's nearly a different band (which could be a strength I suppose), but it also shows you what they could be when they really went for it.

Who knows? Maybe it's age too. We all evolve after all and U2 are in their late 50s, they're not the band of the 80s or 90s anymore. It would be ageist and silly of me to demand them to act their age and make "mature" music whatever that means, but this need for radio hit/relevancy does confound me. Also, considering what's in the top 100 these days, I'm not sure why U2 would want to share that company.

My dream would be for U2 to go full Bowie and just not give AF. After all, Bowie put on some incredible music in the last decade of his life. He went darker, bolder and just did whatever he pleased. But U2 aren't Bowie and it's perhaps unfair for me to expect that. One is a band after all and the other is a solo artist (granted U2 have cited him as a major influence, which is quite apparent during their 90s hey day). Hell, U2 are more or less a business these days. I would hope that U2 learned what Bowie did after his dismal 80s work with Tonight and Never Let Me Down, which clearly were more commercial attempts, especially after the massive success of Let's Dance (which is an album I do enjoy). But then Bowie bounced back and just did whatever he desired and put out some great music. Sure, maybe he didn't reach his 70s peak (it's all subjective of course), but he still made compelling music. I mean, Earthling, that record is still awesome IMO.

Anyway, sorry for my lengthy rant here, but I think U2 can still surprise us, it's just a matter of whether they desire (no pun intended) to.
 
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Both Eno & Lanois did remixes for the Joshua Tree reissue so maybe things were patched up. Eno was at the Berlin gig too...

Did Lanois throw shade at their commercial ambitions when talking about SOI?

Eno was also at the Twickenham gig I went to - Bono specifically called him out and mentioned how important he was to the Joshua Tree.
 
Anyhow, they're important, no doubt, but they're not in vogue. What they do is no longer where music is today. No matter what we want, U2 is in the 'business and they follow the trends...:yes:

:up:

Eno was old, boring and unhip when i was a teenager, and that was a loooong time ago

Nick66 is just being pretentious :D
 
:up:

Eno was old, boring and unhip when i was a teenager, and that was a loooong time ago

Nick66 is just being pretentious :D

It's true. I even drink Nespresso!

08852D2E00000514-0-image-a-25_1473377959273.jpg


PS...If I was REALLY pretentious, I'd hang out in the anti-Other Place discussing The National & Nick Cave all day. ;)
 
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Yeah. Looks like they're playing Best Thing tonight.

Probably! But if you listen closely I noticed after Edge said "I like that," someone -- probably Adam -- said "it's better ...but.."

Definitely sounds like they're still working on it.
 
Is it me or is 1,350 posts a modern day thread record.

Anyway, hope they play Best Thing tonight, it would be cool to hear.
 
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