Bacon, Indiana Superthread

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Slopsy said:
:tongue: Don't worry, I don't know what I'm talking about.
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Because the myth that the Maori exterminated the Moriori (by cannibalism or otherwise) when they colonised New Zealand is a flat-out lie.

The Moriori were in fact descendents of the Maori.
 
Axver said:
Because the myth that the Maori exterminated the Moriori (by cannibalism or otherwise) when they colonised New Zealand is a flat-out lie.

The Moriori were in fact descendents of the Maori.
Click to expand...

Ah, I did not know that! I knew that myth wasn't proven or anything, but I did not know that the Moriori were descendents :up:
 
Slopsy said:
Why so hyper, Reggo?
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This:
Reggo said:
Superthread! I issue a warning to you all!

:hyper: Reggo is hyper.

Maybe it has something to do with the peanut butter fudge which is half confectioner's sugar.

Maybe it has something to do with Green Day announcing their tour dates for the summer of 2009.

Maybe.

But Reggo is hyper.

And this is never a good thing. :mac:
Click to expand...
 
Slopsy said:
Ah, I did not know that! I knew that myth wasn't proven or anything, but I did not know that the Moriori were descendents :up:
Click to expand...

The misinformation (and, considering some of the authors, disinformation) about the Moriori is simply staggering. Michael King's A People Rediscovered should be compulsory reading in every Kiwi school just to counter the bullshit that had been raked over this land.

Basically, the Moriori were eastern South Island Maori who migrated east to the Chatham Islands at some point between 1200 and 1500 AD (if I remember correctly, Michael King believes the 1400s). During their centuries of isolation on the Chathams, they became genetically and culturally distinct from their Maori ancestors. It was in 1835 that a warlike Maori tribe dispossessed from Taranaki invaded the Chathams, hungry for territory. The Moriori had evolved a code of pacifism, as it was the only way to survive in the marginal Chatham conditions, thus they did not fight back. The particular Maori tribe that invaded did not respect this pacifism and swiftly killed and enslaved the Moriori. By the time the Moriori were restored to freedom later in the 19th century, their population had dropped dramatically, beyond the point of survival. The last full-blooded Moriori died in 1933.

/history nerd
... and yes, I'm working on my thesis right now; it shows ...
 
I thought Maori was a general term for native New Zealanders, like Aborigine in Australia. :shrug:
 
Axver said:
The misinformation (and, considering some of the authors, disinformation) about the Moriori is simply staggering. Michael King's A People Rediscovered should be compulsory reading in every Kiwi school just to counter the bullshit that had been raked over this land.

Basically, the Moriori were eastern South Island Maori who migrated east to the Chatham Islands at some point between 1200 and 1500 AD (if I remember correctly, Michael King believes the 1400s). During their centuries of isolation on the Chathams, they became genetically and culturally distinct from their Maori ancestors. It was in 1835 that a warlike Maori tribe dispossessed from Taranaki invaded the Chathams, hungry for territory. The Moriori had evolved a code of pacifism, as it was the only way to survive in the marginal Chatham conditions, thus they did not fight back. The particular Maori tribe that invaded did not respect this pacifism and swiftly killed and enslaved the Moriori. By the time the Moriori were restored to freedom later in the 19th century, their population had dropped dramatically, beyond the point of survival. The last full-blooded Moriori died in 1933.

/history nerd
... and yes, I'm working on my thesis right now; it shows ...
Click to expand...

:ohmy:

That's actually really interesting. Most people I've talked to just think that the Moriori were the original inhabitants of New Zealand and then the Maori came later, killed them and claimed colonisation as their own. Just goes to show how misleading a lot of "historical" sources are.
 
Reggo said:
I thought Maori was a general term for native New Zealanders, like Aborigine in Australia. :shrug:
Click to expand...

It is. The Maori are the original settlers of New Zealand, having arrived around 900-1200 AD from Polynesia, and the Moriori were the original settlers of the Chathams, having arrived around 1200-1500 AD from New Zealand.

Hence the Moriori were descended from the Maori who are descended from Polynesians.
 
ugh, exam studying. Study sessions are good though, I really deal with saying things out loud well.
 
Axver said:
It is. The Maori are the original settlers of New Zealand, having arrived around 900-1200 AD from Polynesia, and the Moriori were the original settlers of the Chathams, having arrived around 1200-1500 AD from New Zealand.

Hence the Moriori were descended from the Maori who are descended from Polynesians.
Click to expand...

That recently, really? Wow. New Zealand really is the youngest country on earth...Well, not including like former soviet republics n such.
 
Slopsy said:
:ohmy:

That's actually really interesting. Most people I've talked to just think that the Moriori were the original inhabitants of New Zealand and then the Maori came later, killed them and claimed colonisation as their own. Just goes to show how misleading a lot of "historical" sources are.
Click to expand...

This was (and still is, I suppose) a popular racist myth that has been used for various purposes over the years - both Pakeha and Maori. Pakeha racists have used it to justify casting Maori as uncivilised savages and being discriminatory towards them. Maori racists, in turn, have used the Moriori as an under-class to bolster their own status; the Moriori could be somebody who Maori and Pakeha could unite against.

The original inhabitants of New Zealand were very much the Maori. There was nobody here beforehand. All genetic, archaeological, and linguistic evidence reveals that the Moriori were the descendents of eastern South Island Maori. There was a popular claim that the Moriori were Melanesian rather than Polynesian, but that has been thoroughly discredited.
 
Reggo said:
That recently, really? Wow. New Zealand really is the youngest country on earth...Well, not including like former soviet republics n such.
Click to expand...

In terms of human settlement, yep, New Zealand is far and away the youngest country on earth. There is perhaps some indication Maori made contact with New Zealand a couple of hundred years before 900 AD (not at all my field, so I can't speak for the accuracy of the evidence, though I am under the impression that even if there was earlier contact, the full-scale migration did not take place until later). Whatever the case, though, up until just over a millennium ago, no human had ever set foot in New Zealand.
 
Axver said:
This was (and still is, I suppose) a popular racist myth that has been used for various purposes over the years - both Pakeha and Maori. Pakeha racists have used it to justify casting Maori as uncivilised savages and being discriminatory towards them. Maori racists, in turn, have used the Moriori as an under-class to bolster their own status; the Moriori could be somebody who Maori and Pakeha could unite against.

The original inhabitants of New Zealand were very much the Maori. There was nobody here beforehand. All genetic, archaeological, and linguistic evidence reveals that the Moriori were the descendents of eastern South Island Maori. There was a popular claim that the Moriori were Melanesian rather than Polynesian, but that has been thoroughly discredited.
Click to expand...

This is almost completely random, but did you hear about the fellow who was determined to prove to the Aborigines (I think) that they were not natives of Australia, in his quest to prove that all life comes out of Africa?
 
Axver said:
This was (and still is, I suppose) a popular racist myth that has been used for various purposes over the years - both Pakeha and Maori. Pakeha racists have used it to justify casting Maori as uncivilised savages and being discriminatory towards them. Maori racists, in turn, have used the Moriori as an under-class to bolster their own status; the Moriori could be somebody who Maori and Pakeha could unite against.

The original inhabitants of New Zealand were very much the Maori. There was nobody here beforehand. All genetic, archaeological, and linguistic evidence reveals that the Moriori were the descendents of eastern South Island Maori. There was a popular claim that the Moriori were Melanesian rather than Polynesian, but that has been thoroughly discredited.
Click to expand...

You should just write your whole thesis on the Superthread to educate and entertain us.
 
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