HeartlandGirl
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
This was a thoughtful piece; thanks for sharing it. I didn’t know Elverum had been making music for so long. Gotta check out his older stuff.
Random Music Talk CXXIII: Cilantro Lover's Club
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This was a thoughtful piece; thanks for sharing it. I didn’t know Elverum had been making music for so long. Gotta check out his older stuff.
HeartlandGirl
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
New Robyn song is out today - Missing U
cobl04
45:33
It doesn't slap as much as I was hoping. The chorus feels like a bridge, I kept waiting for it to explode into a mega chorus but it never did 
HeartlandGirl
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
It doesn't slap as much as I was hoping. The chorus feels like a bridge, I kept waiting for it to explode into a mega chorus but it never did
It’s definitely subdued, but I think that vibe fits the lyrics. Reminds me of her song Monument with Röyksopp in that it has some emotional weight to it.
prbiker15
Blue Crack Addict
Was also expecting a little more of a "takeoff", but anyways it's another good one. Hope that album's coming soon.
lazarus
Blue Crack Supplier
namkcuR
ONE love, blood, life
I like the new Robyn song. Sort of a 'With Every Heartbeat' vibe. That one didn't really explode either, but it was a hit for her.
cobl04
45:33
Who would have thought that a band that makes such shit conservative music would be hanging around with a fucking loser like Jordan Peterson. Mumford & Sons Slammed Over A Photo With Alt-Right Douchebag
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
Conservative music? I mean they’re boring as hell, do you mean conservative in that sense? Because I don’t think their content is particularly ‘conservative.’
cobl04
45:33
Yes.
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
Tbh I doubt they like the guy, they’re probably just too stupid to know who he is.
cobl04
45:33
So I've noticed how overwhelmingly male my listening tastes are, and I'm trying to change it. A few records I've earmarked for listening this year include...
Horses, Stories from the City..., Hounds of Love, Chelsea Girl, Juju, Heaven or Las Vegas, Exile in Guyville, Court & Spark and Tapestry. (Let me know if there's any big oversights I'm missing... is Jagged Little Pill good?)
Anyway, I tried to put in Exile in Guyville on the way home but it clashed with Melbourne's current weather. I was after something more electronic, dark. The only name I could think of (can someone please give me recs for dope electronic music made by women?!) was Bjork. I've never listened to Bjork, outside of one try of Vulnicura, which I didn't like (at the time). But I thought for some reason that she might fit the bill, so I looked her up Wikipedia, saw Debut was in part electronic in part jazz.
It's pretty good!! The beats sound incredibly dated at times and I don't know if I can fall in love with her vocals, but definitely going to be a few more listens of this
what are others' thoughts?
Horses, Stories from the City..., Hounds of Love, Chelsea Girl, Juju, Heaven or Las Vegas, Exile in Guyville, Court & Spark and Tapestry. (Let me know if there's any big oversights I'm missing... is Jagged Little Pill good?)
Anyway, I tried to put in Exile in Guyville on the way home but it clashed with Melbourne's current weather. I was after something more electronic, dark. The only name I could think of (can someone please give me recs for dope electronic music made by women?!) was Bjork. I've never listened to Bjork, outside of one try of Vulnicura, which I didn't like (at the time). But I thought for some reason that she might fit the bill, so I looked her up Wikipedia, saw Debut was in part electronic in part jazz.
It's pretty good!! The beats sound incredibly dated at times and I don't know if I can fall in love with her vocals, but definitely going to be a few more listens of this
what are others' thoughts?
monkeyskin
Refugee
Big fan of her first three (Debut, Post and Homogenic are each an improvement on the one before), struggle to varying degrees thereafter. Debut has definitely dated, but in a fun 90s way so I can dig it. Hyperballad alone makes Post essential and Homogenic is timeless. Whenever you're in a Kid A mood, give Homogenic a spin before we get to spring.
LemonMelon
More 5G Than Man
Jagged Little Pill is pretty good but daaaaaated. The vocals are also an acquired taste. But yeah, I mean, it's cool. It was the biggest thing in North America for a minute.
There are a bunch of very worthwhile albums in the same vein as what you have on that list:
Fiona Apple - When the Pawn/The Idler Wheel
Laura Nyro - Christmas and the Beads of Sweat (New York Tendaberry is better IMO, but this one is a better encapsulation of everything she does well)
Dusty Springfield - Dusty in Memphis (CLASSIC)
The Ronettes - Presenting the Fabulous Ronettes Featuring Veronica
Marianne Faithful - Broken English
Tori Amos - Little Earthquakes
Rickie Lee Jones - Pirates
Susanne Sundfor - Ten Love Songs
Emmylou Harris - Wrecking Ball (Daniel Lanois with some amazing production here)
Lucinda Williams - Car Wheels on a Gravel Road
There are a bunch of very worthwhile albums in the same vein as what you have on that list:
Fiona Apple - When the Pawn/The Idler Wheel
Laura Nyro - Christmas and the Beads of Sweat (New York Tendaberry is better IMO, but this one is a better encapsulation of everything she does well)
Dusty Springfield - Dusty in Memphis (CLASSIC)
The Ronettes - Presenting the Fabulous Ronettes Featuring Veronica
Marianne Faithful - Broken English
Tori Amos - Little Earthquakes
Rickie Lee Jones - Pirates
Susanne Sundfor - Ten Love Songs
Emmylou Harris - Wrecking Ball (Daniel Lanois with some amazing production here)
Lucinda Williams - Car Wheels on a Gravel Road
cobl04
45:33
iron yuppie
ONE love, blood, life
Homogenic is arguably the best album of the 90s. Vespertine is excellent as well - a bit more chamber pop than her other albums.
lazarus
Blue Crack Supplier
Throwing in my hat for Homogenic as well, with Post not far behind. Debut is, as has already been said, good but a little dated. All the albums after Homogenic are a little tougher to get into in their own ways, those first three are the most accessible.
Another female-fronted electronic act is Saint Etienne, who I wouldn't describe as dark but have had a long, consistent career going back to the early 90s (they just released an album last year). My favorite of theirs is the one that goes full-on 60s pop, Good Humor. Well worth looking into. It's bourgeois, relaxing stuff but they can be funny as well with some of the wry lyrics.
And this may sound like an odd recommendation because of her popularity, but if you never checked out any of Madonna's full albums, Ray of Light is superlative and actually has its share of darker/heavier electronic fare. In fact, if you have never listened to much Madonna you might want to push aside everything else because you're missing out on a really significant and rewarding discography, with at least 4 albums I'd consider masterpieces (Like A Prayer, Erotica, Music).
Another female-fronted electronic act is Saint Etienne, who I wouldn't describe as dark but have had a long, consistent career going back to the early 90s (they just released an album last year). My favorite of theirs is the one that goes full-on 60s pop, Good Humor. Well worth looking into. It's bourgeois, relaxing stuff but they can be funny as well with some of the wry lyrics.
And this may sound like an odd recommendation because of her popularity, but if you never checked out any of Madonna's full albums, Ray of Light is superlative and actually has its share of darker/heavier electronic fare. In fact, if you have never listened to much Madonna you might want to push aside everything else because you're missing out on a really significant and rewarding discography, with at least 4 albums I'd consider masterpieces (Like A Prayer, Erotica, Music).
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iron yuppie
ONE love, blood, life
Pertinent to what Cobbler was posting about, NPR just ran an extensive feature on female artists:
https://www.npr.org/2018/07/30/6273...0-greatest-songs-by-21st-century-women-part-1
The top 10 could have been chosen by a Twitter bot, but oh well.
https://www.npr.org/2018/07/30/6273...0-greatest-songs-by-21st-century-women-part-1
The top 10 could have been chosen by a Twitter bot, but oh well.
LemonMelon
More 5G Than Man
Their list of best albums made by women has good stuff on it, though the order seems completely random at times:
https://www.npr.org/2017/07/24/538387823/turning-the-tables-150-greatest-albums-made-by-women
https://www.npr.org/2017/07/24/538387823/turning-the-tables-150-greatest-albums-made-by-women
joyfulgirl
Blue Crack Addict
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cobl04
45:33
Thanks everyone!!!
I will add Homogenic to the list.
I REALLY need to listen to The Roches. Someone in the last DI included "Hammond Song" on their list and I fucking adored it.
Also, I listen to this song so fucking often. It is absolute magic.
I will add Homogenic to the list.
I REALLY need to listen to The Roches. Someone in the last DI included "Hammond Song" on their list and I fucking adored it.
Also, I listen to this song so fucking often. It is absolute magic.
namkcuR
ONE love, blood, life
Some additional suggestions for Cobbler...
You mentioned Jagged Little Pill. It's good, but pretty top 40-ish. What might be more up your ally is Alanis's follow-up album, 1998's Supposed Former Infatuation Junkie. It's a left-turn from Jagged Little Pill, much less top-40-ish, more experimental, some electronic elements added, the more upbeat stuff is less aggressive than on JLP, and the ballads are less direct, more tender in a way. I can tell you there are people to this day who have big respect for her not trying to just duplicate the success of JPL. This album didn't do great commercially, because it didn't have the big pop-rock singles everyone wanted, but there are a legit faction of her fanbase that would call it her best work.
It's a big overlong, and there a couple of tracks that probably could've been cut, but the highs are career highlights, imo. Definitely worth checking out. You shouldn't judge her just based JPL, she had an angry I-hate-men persona on that album that really didn't last beyond that album.
Also, Tori's Little Earthquakes was mentioned; I'd also check out her From The Choirgirl Hotel, my personal favorite album of hers, certainly her darkest. Key tracks include Spark, ieeeee, Jackie's Strength, Playboy Mommy.
You mentioned Jagged Little Pill. It's good, but pretty top 40-ish. What might be more up your ally is Alanis's follow-up album, 1998's Supposed Former Infatuation Junkie. It's a left-turn from Jagged Little Pill, much less top-40-ish, more experimental, some electronic elements added, the more upbeat stuff is less aggressive than on JLP, and the ballads are less direct, more tender in a way. I can tell you there are people to this day who have big respect for her not trying to just duplicate the success of JPL. This album didn't do great commercially, because it didn't have the big pop-rock singles everyone wanted, but there are a legit faction of her fanbase that would call it her best work.
It's a big overlong, and there a couple of tracks that probably could've been cut, but the highs are career highlights, imo. Definitely worth checking out. You shouldn't judge her just based JPL, she had an angry I-hate-men persona on that album that really didn't last beyond that album.
Also, Tori's Little Earthquakes was mentioned; I'd also check out her From The Choirgirl Hotel, my personal favorite album of hers, certainly her darkest. Key tracks include Spark, ieeeee, Jackie's Strength, Playboy Mommy.
cobl04
45:33
I have no issue whatsoever with an angry I-hate-men persona and I wish more men weren't so triggered by it, but thanks Ruckman, I appreciate the suggestions
Love to get people's thoughts on their own tastes. It struck me when I was trying to do the '10 albums that had an impact' thing on FB. I could have rattled off 20 or 30 with absolute ease, but then when I tried to make it a 50-50 gender split I found it really difficult to think of albums by females that have had a big impact :/ possibly because I'm holding myself to too high a standard, there's been plenty of female artists I've enjoyed... but yeah, my tastes are overwhelmingly male.
I recall a discussion here a few years ago where there was a joke flying around about Mikal being a misogynist, and I'm starting to reconsider whether my whole "you're into what you're into" think just isn't quite good enough. Obviously, Mikal is not even remotely a misogynist, and neither am I, but previously I held the view that there was no bias in my music listening, you're just into what you're into. But I've been re-evaluating that of late. And whilst I don't think I'm biased towards enjoying male artists, if you purely look at the numbers... I am. I've just never thought about it before.
So why is this? I'm not too sure. In B&C, which has been responsible for a huge percentage of my tastes, there's never been a bias towards any one gender. We've probably always had more males than females posting here, but we've all got along pretty well and I think we're all pretty similar politically.
So it has to be a cultural thing, I think. I think as a society, in music/artistry, just like in every other facet of life, we undervalue women, we place men above them. When I think of the 'greatest albums ever' in a Pazz & Jop sense, all the ones that come to mind are by men. And I think as a result of that societal tendency, most things I've reached for have been male.
And so now the time has come for me to make more of an effort to explore female music, just like I made the decision in my mid-late teens to explore more music outside of U2. And let's see where I end up in a couple of years.
Love to get people's thoughts on their own tastes. It struck me when I was trying to do the '10 albums that had an impact' thing on FB. I could have rattled off 20 or 30 with absolute ease, but then when I tried to make it a 50-50 gender split I found it really difficult to think of albums by females that have had a big impact :/
possibly because I'm holding myself to too high a standard, there's been plenty of female artists I've enjoyed... but yeah, my tastes are overwhelmingly male.I recall a discussion here a few years ago where there was a joke flying around about Mikal being a misogynist, and I'm starting to reconsider whether my whole "you're into what you're into" think just isn't quite good enough. Obviously, Mikal is not even remotely a misogynist, and neither am I, but previously I held the view that there was no bias in my music listening, you're just into what you're into. But I've been re-evaluating that of late. And whilst I don't think I'm biased towards enjoying male artists, if you purely look at the numbers... I am. I've just never thought about it before.
So why is this? I'm not too sure. In B&C, which has been responsible for a huge percentage of my tastes, there's never been a bias towards any one gender. We've probably always had more males than females posting here, but we've all got along pretty well and I think we're all pretty similar politically.
So it has to be a cultural thing, I think. I think as a society, in music/artistry, just like in every other facet of life, we undervalue women, we place men above them. When I think of the 'greatest albums ever' in a Pazz & Jop sense, all the ones that come to mind are by men. And I think as a result of that societal tendency, most things I've reached for have been male.
And so now the time has come for me to make more of an effort to explore female music, just like I made the decision in my mid-late teens to explore more music outside of U2. And let's see where I end up in a couple of years.
LemonMelon
More 5G Than Man
Some people just don't like singers in higher registers, which crosses off a lot of female musicians, sadly. I know Ashley felt that way for a while. Others simply don't relate to or connect with the subject matter of music's more socially-aware female writers, so that keeps them at arm's length. The promo that talented, artistic female singer/songwriters get is piss poor too, so that also limits their reach. A lot of women also do not feel welcome in or supported by the music industry. We could get into a whole patriarchy discussion but that's best saved for FYM.
There are many reasons why women get ignored in discussions of the all-time greats and none of them have to do with talent.
There are many reasons why women get ignored in discussions of the all-time greats and none of them have to do with talent.
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iron yuppie
ONE love, blood, life
It seems like significant numbers of women in indie music is a relatively recent phenomenon. And, like in almost every other profession, women leave the industry in disproportionate numbers to pursue a family or take on domestic duties so the husband's career can progress (this is why extended paternity leave needs to be a standard, expected thing). Sharon van Etten is a recent example. So Cobbler, I think getting to a 50-50 split will be tough because female-dominant acts are still in the minority, I would guess.
iron yuppie
ONE love, blood, life
Now that I think of it, Beach House is probably my only top-10 act with a significant female presence.
iron yuppie
ONE love, blood, life
I've had this song on repeat since I heard it in a movie a few weeks ago:
namkcuR
ONE love, blood, life
I have no issue whatsoever with an angry I-hate-men persona and I wish more men weren't so triggered by it, but thanks Ruckman, I appreciate the suggestions
Oh, I wasn't suggesting it was a bad thing at all, I was just saying if you haven't heard any of her later stuff, it would be easy to assume from JLP that that's all she is, and it just isn't. That was my only point. JLP is a really good record, a 90s classic, just overplayed to these ears.
joyfulgirl
Blue Crack Addict
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Cat Power's "Metal Heart" came up like 3x on a long road trip recently and I forgot how much I freaking love it. You should definitely put her on the list if you haven't already.
HeartlandGirl
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
Another suggestion for you, Cobbler - Concrete Blonde.
The band's singer/bass player is a woman, Johnette Napolitano. Concrete Blonde were one of my staples growing up., and they have quite the catalog of just pure, solid rock music. If you need an album to start with, go with Mexican Moon or Bloodletting.
I commend you for trying to diversify, and I am doing the same. I just put together an 80s mix for yoga class, and I really struggled to get women onto it. My rule was, no cheese. If I could envision a bachelorette party yelling along to a song, it was a no. The women from yoga class and I talked/texted a lot about non-cheesy women's music from the 80s and why it felt so hard to find those types of songs. The theory was that not many women had the opportunity to just throw together a band or an album of straightforward songs - they always had to be doing something beyond simply writing songs that could become ageless classics in order to get played. Men could just do their thing and let the chips fall where they would. They didn't have to have a schtick. Again, just a theory. Things definitely changed in the 90s, and when I put together a yoga mix from that time, I've already got so many more ideas of women to include.
I also just put together a giant mix of ambient, drone, post-rock, etc. 90 some songs, and hardly any women associated with these acts at all. I think the same could be said for the world of trance music. Dudes everywhere and women in short supply. I would love to hear more from women in these genres, but I don't yet know where to find them.
Good luck, Cobbz. Let me know what you think of Concrete Blonde if you give them a try.
The band's singer/bass player is a woman, Johnette Napolitano. Concrete Blonde were one of my staples growing up., and they have quite the catalog of just pure, solid rock music. If you need an album to start with, go with Mexican Moon or Bloodletting.
I commend you for trying to diversify, and I am doing the same. I just put together an 80s mix for yoga class, and I really struggled to get women onto it. My rule was, no cheese. If I could envision a bachelorette party yelling along to a song, it was a no. The women from yoga class and I talked/texted a lot about non-cheesy women's music from the 80s and why it felt so hard to find those types of songs. The theory was that not many women had the opportunity to just throw together a band or an album of straightforward songs - they always had to be doing something beyond simply writing songs that could become ageless classics in order to get played. Men could just do their thing and let the chips fall where they would. They didn't have to have a schtick. Again, just a theory. Things definitely changed in the 90s, and when I put together a yoga mix from that time, I've already got so many more ideas of women to include.
I also just put together a giant mix of ambient, drone, post-rock, etc. 90 some songs, and hardly any women associated with these acts at all. I think the same could be said for the world of trance music. Dudes everywhere and women in short supply. I would love to hear more from women in these genres, but I don't yet know where to find them.
Good luck, Cobbz. Let me know what you think of Concrete Blonde if you give them a try.
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