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Old 08-30-2007, 03:39 PM   #141
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Originally posted by MrsSpringsteen
GLAAD Calls on Tucker Carlson, MSNBC to Apologize for Insensitive Remarks Condoning Violence

August 29, 2007

New York, Wednesday, August 29 - The Gay & Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation (GLAAD) today called on Tucker Carlson, NBC News and MSNBC to apologize for remarks made on Tuesday night that appear to condone violent assault.

On the Tuesday, Aug. 28 edition of "MSNBC Live with Dan Abrams" MSNBC host Tucker Carlson referenced an incident from his past when he was the recipient of an unwanted advance from another man. Carlson told program host (and MSNBC General Manager) Dan Abrams and fellow MSNBC host Joe Scarborough that after being "bothered" by a man in a restroom in a Washington, D.C., mall, Carlson returned "with someone [he] knew and grabbed the guy... and hit him against the stall with his head, actually. And then the cops came and arrested him." Abrams and Scarborough are seen chuckling throughout Carlson's telling of the story.

Earlier today, GLAAD called Abrams' office to discuss NBC News and MSNBC's response to Carlson's behavior. Abrams' office responded with an e-mailed statement attributed to Carlson, which read:

Let me be clear about an incident I referred to on MSNBC last night: In the mid-1980s, while I was a high school student, a man physically grabbed me in a men's room in Washington, DC. I yelled, pulled away from him and ran out of the room. Twenty-five minutes later, a friend of mine and I returned to the men's room. The man was still there, presumably waiting to do to someone else what he had done to me. My friend and I seized the man and held him until a security guard arrived.

Several bloggers have characterized this is a sort of gay bashing. That's absurd, and an insult to anybody who has fought back against an unsolicited sexual attack. I wasn't angry with the man because he was gay. I was angry because he assaulted me.

The statement is not only a failed attempt to justify Carlson's advocacy of violence, but also changes key details of the previous night's on-air story. First, Carlson does not repeat his assertion that he "hit him against the stall with his head," instead changing his story to say that he "seized the man and held him down until a security guard arrived." The security guard element is also newly invented. In his on-air statement, Carlson said that "the cops came and arrested him."

"Carlson's story was difficult to watch on two levels," said GLAAD Senior Director of Media Programs Rashad Robinson. "To see someone brag on national television of returning, with an accomplice, to the scene of an unwanted advance to violently attack the person who made it is incredibly disturbing. But it was also hard to watch because of the sheer absurdity of most of what Carlson was saying."

"Whether Abrams and Scarborough were laughing with Carlson or laughing at him, the fact remains that MSNBC and NBC News have some explaining to do about their standards and practices," Robinson said. "They need to explain whether bragging about physically assaulting a man in response to an unwanted advance is appropriate on-air behavior for one of their employees, and whether laughter by two others is an appropriate on-air response."



GLSEN Outraged by MSNBC Host Tucker Carlson's Comments About Assaulting Gay Man


GLSEN, or the Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network, is outraged and horrified by MSNBC host Tucker Carlson's revelation Tuesday night insinuating that as a high school student he once assaulted a man for a perceived sexual advance. GLSEN is calling on Carlson to issue an apology and disavow violence against lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) people as reprehensible and unacceptable.

"Tucker Carlson's casual acknowledgment perpetrating such a violent act is shocking and sends a dangerous message to youth that physical assault based on actual or perceived sexual orientation is acceptable," said GLSEN Deputy Executive Director Eliza Byard. "Countless lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) youth are bullied, harassed and assaulted at school every day. MSNBC and Carlson need to make it clear that violence in this case was an unacceptable reaction."

More than a third of LGBT students (37.8%) reported being physically harassed (being pushed, shoved, etc.) at school in the past year because of their sexual orientation in GLSEN's 2005 National School Climate Survey. Additionally, 17.6% of LGBT students reported being physically assaulted (punched, kicked or injured with a weapon) in school in the past year because of their sexual orientation.

To watch the clip of Carlson's comments or learn more about the incident and others like it, visit Media Matters for America at www.mediamatters.org.

About GLSEN GLSEN, or the Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network, is the leading national education organization focused on ensuring safe schools for all lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender students. Established nationally in 1995, GLSEN envisions a world in which every child learns to respect and accept all people, regardless of sexual orientation or gender identity/expression. For more information on GLSEN's educational resources, public policy agenda, student organizing programs or development initiatives, visit www.glsen.org.
See I kind of think this is off-base. If a guy were to just randomly grab a woman and she responded with force there'd be no outrage, other than at the guy for being a perv and trying to cop a cheap feel. Assuming Carlson is recounting the situation accurately I don't see it as a gay/straight issue at all, rather a harassment/sexual assault issue. He is a coward for running and getting one of his boys and them going back in and double-teaming the guy though.

It's one thing to flirt/come on to somebody, it's another to physically grab them.
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Old 08-30-2007, 03:44 PM   #142
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He went back afterwards to bash his head against the stall or whatever he did (his story changed), so it was not a spontaneous defense.

MSNBC reaired the segment twice the following day and left out his little assault claim. So why did they do that?
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Old 08-30-2007, 03:47 PM   #143
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Originally posted by diamond


Not an officer trying to enforce the law.

Sounds a lot more like an officer trying to entrap someone to me. That officer should act like a person using the restroom for it's intended purpose, not like someone cruising for sex. And if he had done so, it would have gone no further. It just seems really sleazy -- of the police as well as anyone arrested.

But I'm not going to argue with you any more because it's pointless. So just go on feeling smugly superior. (it's not true, of course, but it seems to make you feel good)
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Old 08-30-2007, 04:11 PM   #144
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Originally posted by indra


Sounds a lot more like an officer trying to entrap someone to me. That officer should act like a person using the restroom for it's intended purpose, not like someone cruising for sex. And if he had done so, it would have gone no further. It just seems really sleazy -- of the police as well as anyone arrested.

But I'm not going to argue with you any more because it's pointless. So just go on feeling smugly superior. (it's not true, of course, but it seems to make you feel good)
The officer did, he was sitting quietly in his stall when the Senator started peeking in 2-3 times thru the cracks, I don't think you've read the police report.

and thank u for your kind words

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Old 08-30-2007, 04:39 PM   #145
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Ok,

I just read the six page transcript.

And Craig never admits anything.

And the officer tries several times to coax him into it.



I really believe if he got an attorney they would not have even charged him.
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Old 08-30-2007, 04:42 PM   #146
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Originally posted by deep
Ok,





I really believe if he got an attorney they would not have even charged him.
That's fine, but he didn't out of a gulity conscience or he didn't want to draw attention to the event as he was embarrassed/indignant and after counseling w/an attorney he chose to enter a plea trying to make it go away-but it backfired.

Now it's time to face the music.

We call this "accountability".

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Old 08-30-2007, 04:46 PM   #147
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Bob Allen is a different situation




Quote:
Florida State Representative Accused of Offering to Perform Oral Sex Claims Innocence

Thursday , July 12, 2007

AP


TITUSVILLE, Fla. —
A Republican state lawmaker charged with offering to perform oral sex for $20 on an undercover male police officer vowed Thursday to defend himself in court and said he would not resign from office.

"I am filing a not guilty plea. I am vigorously going to fight this," state Rep. Bob Allen, a co-chair of Republican presidential candidate John McCain's campaign in Florida, said at a news conference. "I am not resigning my office because the people elected me and want me to do a good job. I am going to do a good job for them in finishing this term."

Allen called his arrest "an ugly and unpleasant situation that has been thrust on me and my family." The lawmaker had sponsored a failed bill that would have tightened the state's prohibition on public sex.

He choked up when he thanked backers who had contacted him to offer their support. He warned people not to jump to conclusions about what happened but said he could not offer any details about the arrest because of his legal strategy. Allen is married and has a teenage daughter.

"It is not true. It is inaccurate and therefore, it's not guilty," Allen said.

Republican Party of Florida Chairman Jim Greer said the matter would be addressed in a timely and appropriate matter.

"While this is an extremely serious matter, the House of Representatives and the judiciary system have established a process to deal with situations of this nature," Greer said in a statement.

However, House Speaker Marco Rubio said in a statement that because the charge against Allen is a misdemeanor, not a felony, "the House rules don't provide for a specific response in the event that he is found to be guilty."

"The charge against Rep. Allen is serious," Rubio said. "We will continue to monitor the situation and take appropriate steps if necessary."


"It just seems sad and tragic," Gov. Charlie Crist said Thursday when asked in Miami about Allen's arrest.

Veteran's Memorial Park was under surveillance when Allen was seen coming in and out of a restroom three times, said police Lt. Todd Hutchinson. Allen, 48, then approached an undercover officer and was arrested.

He has been charged with solicitation for prostitution, which has a maximum penalty of one year in jail. Brevard County jail officials said Allen posted a $500 bond.

While being transported to jail, Allen told WFTV Channel 9 that the situation was "a very big misunderstanding."

Allen was elected to the Florida House in 2000. He was chairman of the House Committee on Energy.

Allen was named in March as one of six co-chairs for McCain's Florida campaign.
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Old 08-30-2007, 04:50 PM   #148
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Originally posted by deep
Bob Allen is a different situation

"It just seems sad and tragic," Gov. Charlie Crist said Thursday when asked in Miami about Allen's arrest.

Veteran's Memorial Park was under surveillance when Allen was seen coming in and out of a restroom three times, said police Lt. Todd Hutchinson. Allen, 48, then approached an undercover officer and was arrested.

He has been charged with solicitation for prostitution, which has a maximum penalty of one year in jail. Brevard County jail officials said Allen posted a $500 bond.

Republican Party of Florida Chairman Jim Greer said the matter would be addressed in a timely and appropriate matter.

"While this is an extremely serious matter, the House of Representatives and the judiciary system have established a process to deal with situations of this nature," Greer said in a statement.

However, House Speaker Marco Rubio said in a statement that because the charge against Allen is a misdemeanor, not a felony, "the House rules don't provide for a specific response in the event that he is found to be guilty."










Quote:
Originally posted by diamond

We call this "accountability".

dbs
House Speaker Marco Rubio said in a statement that because the charge against Allen is a misdemeanor, not a felony, "the House rules don't provide for a specific response in the event that he is found to be guilty."
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Old 08-30-2007, 04:55 PM   #149
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep







House Speaker Marco Rubio said in a statement that because the charge against Allen is a misdemeanor, not a felony, "the House rules don't provide for a specific response in the event that he is found to be guilty."
Who cares if it's a felony or not.

The majority of the people who elected would want him to leave office over this.

That he chooses to fight this with legal manuevering makes him not want to face the music, and is even more shameful.

If you want to defend him over this behavior, knock yourself out, I'm glad you're no longer a registered Republican (if you are you shouldn't be-you're supporting Hilary) and I'm glad you don't have kids.
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Old 08-30-2007, 05:02 PM   #150
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This guy Allen, I believe is gulity.

He offered the decoy $20 to perform oral sex on the officer.


As for you saying

'We' call this accountability

It seems the Republicans are not part of that 'We".

So who is included in your 'We' ?



I think there is enough there for Allen to be held to account.

There is not much there for Mr. Craig.


So again the GOP are frauds,
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Old 08-30-2007, 05:04 PM   #151
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep
Ok,

I just read the six page transcript.

And Craig never admits anything.

And the officer tries several times to coax him into it.



I really believe if he got an attorney they would not have even charged him.
Same.

Even had he gotten charged, Craig had an excellent defence. Remember we are working on a criminal standard here, and there is no way I believe he'd have been convicted. Based on his own words, it's very possible that this was a misunderstanding.

I am not saying that I think it necessarily was a misunderstanding. But guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, it most certainly wasn't.
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Old 08-30-2007, 05:04 PM   #152
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep
This guy Allen, I believe is gulity.

He offered the decoy $20 to perform oral sex on the officer.



So who is included in your 'We' ?






The majority of the Republican party, and not you apparently.

dbs
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Old 08-30-2007, 05:08 PM   #153
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I have my own brain

so I don't really care what a majority of this party or that party thinks

or for that matter what most Americans, atheists, Moslems, Europeans or whoever think. Sometimes, majorities are wrong.
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Old 08-30-2007, 05:17 PM   #154
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Same.

Even had he gotten charged, Craig had an excellent defence. Remember we are working on a criminal standard here, and there is no way I believe he'd have been convicted. Based on his own words, it's very possible that this was a misunderstanding.

I am not saying that I think it necessarily was a misunderstanding. But guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, it most certainly wasn't.
I don't know how a person could read the transcript and not come to that conclusion.

I expected to read something that would lead me to conclude quite the opposite.
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Old 08-30-2007, 05:27 PM   #155
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep


I don't know how a person could read the transcript and not come to that conclusion.

I expected to read something that would lead me to conclude quite the opposite.
Well apparently the Senator felt otherwise, being there and witnessing first hand of what really happened, and maybe appreciative that the arresting officers didn't make a scene and thereby chose to plead guilty, after I'm sure he being a lawmaker got legal advice- but it backfired.

Now he has the hindsight, and arm chair quaterbacks on FYM supporting his current lie.

Speaks volumes from many angles.


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Old 08-30-2007, 05:36 PM   #156
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You know looking at these two cases.


Just answer this question honestly;


assuming both of the incidents happen to you

1. A guy offers you $20 if you will led him perform oral sex you.

2. You are sitting in a enclosed stall. A foot in the next stalls taps a couple of times. That foot slides over into your stall. Also, a hand appears under the divider.

Would you report both, neither, or one of these incidents to the police?

Which one would you be more inclined to remember?


I have never had a person offer me money for sex. If I did I would consider it a sexual advance.

I think I do recall seeing a random foot or hand under a stall. I just ignored it. And nothing came of it. I always thought it was a kid fooling around.
Perhaps it was a U S Senator. Regardless, I never considered myself sexually assaulted.
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Old 08-30-2007, 06:38 PM   #157
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep
You know looking at these two cases.


Just answer this question honestly;


assuming both of the incidents happen to you

1. A guy offers you $20 if you will led him perform oral sex you.

2. You are sitting in a enclosed stall. A foot in the next stalls taps a couple of times. That foot slides over into your stall. Also, a hand appears under the divider.

Would you report both, neither, or one of these incidents to the police?

Which one would you be more inclined to remember?


I have never had a person offer me money for sex. If I did I would consider it a sexual advance.

I think I do recall seeing a random foot or hand under a stall. I just ignored it. And nothing came of it. I always thought it was a kid fooling around.
Perhaps it was a U S Senator. Regardless, I never considered myself sexually assaulted.
You chose to leave out that the Senator peeked in on the officer a couple of times thru the cracks in the stall first in #2.

And I have been approached numerous times as a youth and young adult, but being a youth wasn't fully cognizant of my rights and did nothing.

If I was being peeked on in a stall in a public bathroom and that guy that sat next to me a started sliding his foot over and then his hand under the divider, then yes I would probably dial 911 and/or find the nearest officer and report him.

And if a fruitball offered me 20.00 for sex I would do take the same course of action.

dbs
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Old 08-30-2007, 06:46 PM   #158
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond

And I have been approached numerous times as a youth and young adult, but being a youth wasn't fully cognizant of my rights and did nothing.

dbs
this is not about children or youths


and you know I have no tolerance for people that harm children


If you are including this into your thought process
then that explains why you responses are out of proportion to the actual incident
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Old 08-30-2007, 06:52 PM   #159
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond


You chose to leave out that the Senator peeked in on the officer a couple of times thru the cracks in the stall first in #2.



If I was being peeked on in a stall in a public bathroom

dbs
honestly, I have no idea how many times I have been peaked in at when I have been in a stall


I have noticed feet outside of the stall a few times
but I didn't make eye contact


I suppose if I made eye contact I might be looking for a hook up

so if any cruisers checked me out,
they moved on because I don't play that game



Now, it is obvious a police decoy does the opposite, they do what they can to solicit sexual advances.
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Old 08-30-2007, 07:19 PM   #160
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if the religious right didn't get their blessed panties in a bunch over homosexuality this "behavior" for the most part wouldn't exist because these men wouldn't be scared to hide it from society.

ugh... it's not that relgion is a bad thing. if only those who believed in those religions didn't try to save the rest of the fucking world from their so called sins, we'd all be better off.

if god really believes homosexuality is a sin, then every gay person in the world will burn in hell for all eternity. shouldn't that be enough? the person who's doing what you don't like, if what you believe in is true, is going to burn like the flamer you think he is. have a cookie and shut the fuck up about it already.
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