A question for the believers

[melon]

Originally posted by nbcrusader


The application of original sin is extreme when combined with the ancient philosophy of stoicism, but original sin does not lead to a pleasure-deprived and emotionless life. Rather it demonstrates our absolute need for a Savior and the free gift that is grace.

Perhaps it is.

Of course, I think I am merely expressing my anger at Catholic tradition. Perhaps when we speak of "original sin," we are now talking about two different things...

Melon

[nbcrusader]

Originally posted by melon
Of course, I think I am merely expressing my anger at Catholic tradition.

That, I can understand.

Peace brother.

[verte76]

To me, "original sin" is a theological way of saying "no one is perfect". It doesn't particularly conjure up images of people getting thrown into the pits of Hell or whatever. It doesn't necessarily mean "sexual sin". Melon, are you blaming the Stoics for medieval puritanism? I'm not sure I agree with this. Augustine was a neo-Platonist, not a Stoic. It's true that some of the early monastic establishments used Stoic books, Epictetus in particular. But Augustine did not--he used Platonism, which is where we got those wonderful "universals" that we had to put up with in philosophy class.

[Klaus]

I think BonoVoxSupastar mentioned something important: Sin is the seperation of God and from this point of view it makes sense. The "Original Sin" - don't know who used that word first - would be when they ate fruit - because it was the first time when they were seperated from God.
Personaly i don't think Babies are seperated from god, but that's just a feeling, no theologic argumentation for this one.

melon:
I respect your point of view. Well we can't prove how it all began, so everyone can decide what he wants to believe.
We are living in a few seconds of a film and we (Scientists) try to think about what would be the "logic" way how this all started.

"Secondly, if Jesus came to take away original sin"

He didn't take away the sin - he just gave us the option to be saved, he was the lamb for all the sins and therefore we don't need traditional sacrifice, that didn't work anymore, because mankind became to cruel, and animal sacrifice became "business".

Klaus

[DebbieSG]

Originally posted by U2girl





Thanks for the explanation everyone.

hey, then you are siding with melon, original sin is just a made up, not a real christian thing, to get us all to believe in Jesus and repent for our selfish ways?

there is a lot that many different believers have written(i haven't even had the time to read it all!)...and all kinds of explanations and quotes from the bible, it is probably hard to understand if you have no background in the New Testament or the books of Moses (the Jewish law) or any of that religious training that we all sat through until we were old enough to choose our own church or group of worshippers (studying and enjoying the Lord together).

Being a Presbyterian, by baptism and general membership, I would say you have to read the bible to find the answer in your own way, with the help of the holy spirit to guide you...original sin is definately discussed in the first book of the bible and later, the apostles deal with it in many different ways...

Look at your own life, are you sinning? Were you "innocent" when you were a very young child? did you ever do anything "evil" or a little wrong, just because it would be fun or an adventure...can you stop doing things that are sinful, like lying, or worshipping idols (like our very own Bono), envy, all those that are OH SO familiar, lol!

take a little time out, evaluate your own life, because the thing about Jesus is that if you find no way to "fix" your sins, He, the Lamb, is there to forgive and set you FREE (celebrate!)

(debbie goes to find obscure single, or watch videoslide...)

Love, Debbie