Jive Turkey
ONE love, blood, life
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2005
- Messages
- 13,645
Well I can't say I disagree with that. I just feel the general tone of the article isn't particularly helpful
You may be right about the original sin issue, in that I'm speaking of factual guilt, not the feeling of guilt. If I've been a jerk to somebody than I'm guilty of being unkind, whether or not I feel bad about it. If I benefit from and unconsciously perpetuate a system that oppresses others (and I do- the farmworkers who get cancer from spreading the pesticides I eat and the sweatshop laborers whose clothes I buy without pushing to improve their working conditions, for instance) than I'm guilty of colluding in their oppression, whether or not I'm aware of it, or give a fuck.
When only 25 or 30% of women are getting off in hookups, and 30% of all women are not getting off regularly with partners when they want to, (another set of statistics) then we have a problem that is both social and individual. It's an individual problem in that particular men allows it to happen, and it's a social problem in that we are not as as society naming it as a problem- it's normal.
It's true that not every guy is represented by the one who said, "in a hookup I don't give a shit", but... if 90% of men are getting off in hookups and only 30% of women are, than the individual comment represents a wider social attitude that helps create that difference.
It's an individual problem in that particular men allows it to happen, and it's a social problem in that we are not as as society naming it as a problem- it's normal.
But that lack of communications is based around a culture- shared by men and women- that privileges male pleasure. If a man doesn't have to ask before giving a facial or choking out, let alone having an orgasm, and a woman does have to ask just to come.... that shows a fair bit about the unevenness in the sexual culture.
This is a cop out. You can't place the only individual blame on the male and the female blame gets lumped into the societal category. In the situation you presented above(the one I originally commented on), both individuals and society are to blame.
The other one that makes me roll my eyes is when she comes multiply, uncontrollably from hard thrusting.
Because in essence what you are saying is that the woman as an individual has absolutely no responsibility at all in that scenario. That's rather anti-feminist of you.How is that a cop out? I'm not really getting it.
I saw your pre-edited post, deep... I rated it 2 stars out of 10. This was an improvement
It's so much less complicated having sex with dudes.
Because in essence what you are saying is that the woman as an individual has absolutely no responsibility at all in that scenario. That's rather anti-feminist of you.
You guys are inadvertently making my point over and over. Most people are not trying to make babies when they go looking for an orgasm. So why are a majority of people still having sex as if they were? Unless you're trying to conceive, than you have absolutely no reason to go along with that "simple biology" business. Why are we not much more dedicated to just making sure both partners have a good time? Defending this position also makes you look like uninteresting partners...
And "Dude, my GF loves hard thrusting" is not really an adequate way to address a cultural trope. Now, if you had a nice controlled study about how many US women report howling orgasms after hard thrusting or a survey of sex acts included in erotic fictions, then I could give that some time.
And if lovemaking did consist only of oral, we would have something a lot more like equality. Neato, eh?
As for the lots of book recommendations.... that's because actual information is useful when discussing a topic. Plus, you know, finding stuff out is kinda neat.
Every possibility is absolutely reciprocal. There's no default power dynamic- they have to be decided on.
Because in essence what you are saying is that the woman as an individual has absolutely no responsibility at all in that scenario. That's rather anti-feminist of you.
Women not being in control over all of that is a long gone thing of the past.
I agree with that. I don't know how this turned into a sex topic, but anyway..it is feminist (but not necessarily- it can be just taking your own personal responsibility for your own satisfaction, happiness, whatever) to take that responsibility. If you're not getting what you want from a relationship or one night stand, whatever you're having-then take the control over that and don't be with those types of people. Change your patterns and outlook.
Women not being in control over all of that is a long gone thing of the past. Unless you have personal issues that cause you to be drawn to those sorts of people and unhealthy situations, that cause you to think you don't deserve equal pleasure, etc. That obviously exists, but it's up to that person to recognize it and to take the necessary steps to change that. No other person can take the responsibility or blame for that. Feminism means equal rights and equal personal responsibilities. Taking control over those things is very empowering.