Effects Unit

[PhilsFan]

I have never owned effects and while I'm familiar with the different kinds from having posted on a U2 forum for over seven years, I have to admit I don't understand them all that much.

That said, I'm interested in purchasing my first effects unit. I want it to both be something where I can learn quite a bit and get decent sound while not breaking the bank. What recommendations do the guitar players on the forum have for me?

 

[chrisn1]

I bet you have an exact replica of Edges rig.

 

[the tourist]

What sort of effects do you want to employ? Overdrive? Distortion? Fuzz? Delay? Reverb? Tremolo? Phaser? Flanger? Wah? That really is the first thing to figure out. Personally, I hate multi-effects units, so I personally would not suggest any of those types, but a few standalone pedals. And then you really get what you pay for.

I would suggest a compressor at the beginning of the signal, then an overdrive, then a delay, and then a reverb for someone just starting out. Again, you get what you pay for. Honestly, I'd suggest getting the good stuff first but slowly as things like pedals lose value the moment they're in your hand. Therefore, I'd suggest the following, routed in this order:

1. Diamond Compressor (these can be found for $180 new if you watch sales at Humbucker Music, etc)
2. Fulltone Fulldrive 2 Mosfet overdrive (I bought mine used on ebay for $100)
3. Electro Harmonix Memory Boy Deluxe delay (it's a great delay pedal albeit a lesser great and can be found for around $150 if you watch ebay and/or craigslist; they retail at $200 - if I was being honest, I'd suggest a Strymon Timeline, but that'd break your bank as they're $450)
4. Mr. Black Supermoon reverb (they're $180 new from Mr. Black, hard to find used as they're amazing pedals)

Now that's right around $600 for some real quality gear that should hold most of its value. My two cents. I figured out the other day that I've got roughly $3200 on my pedal board. It's now worth more than my hand-wired boutique amp.

Disclaimer: I don't try to emulate The Edge. I am my own guitarist. That being said, with a herdim pick and a dotted 8th delay, I've been told I can sound just like him on some stuff.

 

[PhilsFan]

What is the function of a compressor?

 

[the tourist]

What is the function of a compressor?

I could answer you with a long detailed explanation, but there's a guy who does a very good job of it with sound clips here:

Do I need a Compressor Pedal? - Demo by Just Nick for Rock n Roll Vintage - YouTube

He mentions that compression adds noise to your signal, and with the compressor he is using, that is correct. However, the Diamond Compressor has corrected this to the point where I cannot hear any additional noise when engaging it with any of my three guitars (Fenders all, Jaguar, Telecaster, and Stratocaster).

 

[PhilsFan]

So, basically, it eliminates the different things (peaks from striking the strings first, imbalances in frequency) that would cause certain strings to be louder than other strings when you don't mean for them to be?

 

[the tourist]

Yes. It also gives you the option of playing single note lines that have the same volume as a chord, which I personally find very handy for leveling leads and rhythm while maintaining the same amount of overdrive/distortion/lackthereof. You know all the jangle and chime on guitars on Beatles records? Compression. I never bought a compressor til about a year ago and I'm kicking myself for not getting one sooner.

Also I'd like to add: I didn't mean to purchase the pedals in the order I outlined above. I meant if you bought them all, that's how I'd order the signal path. In purchasing order, I'd get delay first, then overdrive, then reverb, then compression.

 

[Muad'zin]

I was going to say the Electro Harmonix Tone Tattoo would have been an awesome first effect unit, as it got distortion, chorus and analog delay in one. Then I realized that if you bought the nano version of each effect separately you'd be cheaper off. So much so you could buy another nano EHX effect probably.

Maybe it would be a good idea to get a 2nd hand Line6 Pod unit? A quick check shows me that you can get a 2nd hand Pod XT Live for like €125. Even the HD500 seems to be going for €300 2nd hand. Such a unit would take care of 95% of your sonic needs and allow you to discover what you like in effects in case you want to go pedals only later on. Now I buy stuff knowing what I like, then I bought stuff thinking I might like it. I ended up wasting a lot of money that way.

 

[the tourist]

Personally I wouldn't recommend an HD500. I always got horrible digital noise through it. But I'm pretty darn picky about tone and not having digital artifacts in it. If I have a digital pedal, if it's not quiet, it's gone in a week. I guess I just have a crazy high standard.

 

[Muad'zin]

Absolutely nothing wrong with having high standards. I have them too. But only if you really know what you're after. When I first started out however I wasted a lot of money buying pedals and stuff thinking it was cool and then it turned out it wasn't. I went through a lot of dirtpedals looking for my tone. And it still keeps changing. Every time they post an interesting layout on freestompboxes I can't help myself to try it out.

Which is why I still advise to get a decent multi FX unit. Learn to use the effects that are in it, if they are your thing or not. And only then start looking into pedals. And always keep in mind that what sounds good in a youtube vid, or when playing in a store, not always sounds as good in your own rig. Some pedals sound great on some amps and not so great on others. And the order in which you connect them influences the sound too. Fuzz Faces for instance are legendary for sounding great when the guitar plugs directly into them, but start getting meh when there's a buffered pedal in between.

 

[the tourist]

True.

But if someone outgrows a multi-fx unit, they'll wind up losing a heck of a lot of money, because it's hard to even get half of what you paid for it when you sell it. And they generally don't sound the best unless you pay through the nose for AxeFX or TC or something. Anyway, yeah, Fuzz Faces sound bad at certain points in the chain. So do wah pedals. Some pedals sound good in some rigs and some pedals do not sound good in some rigs.

The good news about the pedals I've suggested is that they sound fantastic in multiple iterations of my rig. They sound good with a Strat, a Jaguar, a Telecaster, and an SG all. And they sound good into 6L6, 6V6, EL84, and EL34 based amplification. I haven't tried them on a solid state amp, but I probably won't touch a solid state amp until builders figure out how to make them sound closer to a tube amp than they currently can.

Generally it's drive pedals that sometimes do not play well between a particular guitar and a particular amp. However, the Fulldrive 2 Mosfet has some switches that make it incredibly versatile. Basically they can do anything you want for clean boost up to medium high gain on any amp with any guitar. And do it very well. At least they do on a Rivera M100, a Fender Blues Jr, a Peavey Classic 30, a Vox AC30, a Matchless Avalon, and a Swart ST Stereo.

 

[PhilsFan]

I'm so woefully out of my element with all of this that it's amusing.

 

[Edge_Orchestra]

I've heard many get great Edge-Tones out of the Line 6 M13 and HD 500's.

But to each their own. Let your own ears be the judge.

 

[FredC]

 

[PhilsFan]

I went into one of my local guitar shops and checked out the pedals today. Their selection was limited to MXR, Boss and TC Electronic. How do they compare to other brands?

 

[gvox]

Pretty sure the Boss OD and maybe even verb were used early on by Edge (still for the OD occasionally maybe?)

Regardless of what Edge uses tho I think alot of guys in general feel the vintage Boss distortion and overdrive stompboxes are pretty solid..probably can't go wrong there..

 

[FredC]

We recorded the guitar tracks on this demo using the Line 6 HD500X Exclusively:

U2 - The Sweetest Thing - Hollywood U2 Live on AXS TV The World's Greatest Tribute Band - YouTube

It is lacking in that effects (delay, reverb, etc) will not roll over with program changes. We are now using the Fractal AXE FX II Mark II which is astounding. The only area we found troublesome is the effect for Mysterious Ways - the effect and basic tone is there, but the 'massiveness' of the Korg A3 is not. We added an A3 to the rack just for that tune.

Edge is now also using the AXE FX II. This is his new rig:

 

[PhilsFan]

Humor me as a complete novice when it comes to this, but what are the most "vital" effects to have? I know Tourist listed a few. Anyone else have thoughts? And what brands tend to work best?

 

[gvox]

What I said in my post, above. Boss Overdrive and Distortion stompboxes are pretty much regarded as essentials at least as far as I've seen. Pretty much every guitarist I know has them (not Edge-centric guys either). But they aren't 'boutique' or anything, just very common. You could look up some reviews I think some regard the earlier generations as far superior to the ones you can just buy brand new nowadays. So you might end up buying used to get that classic tone or whatever. I think that might apply to alot of those classic stomps, not just Boss. (others can concur?)

Another couple would be Tube Screamer (Ibanez?)...Delay..Reverb..Chorus..Wah..

As for the multi effects units, in particular for reproducing Edge's stuff..in terms of cheaper floor units some years ago I used to be pretty sold on what I heard guys get out of the VOX Tone Lab SE (with stuff like the A3, and a few other stomps in the chain) and I'd have to say for it's price it's going to be all (and maybe more) than most would need for a good while. Also, it is portable and easy to use. But it's an older piece and I'm not sure what guys are using instead nowadays.

Multi effects units do just that - try to accomplish multiple things at once (some very well), including amp modelling and maybe things you'll never use. If you just want straight effects, and have to start out on a limited budget, why not buy piece by piece. Tourist's suggestions are very good. Or a mid-priced floor unit as I've described above.

But if money is no object and you're trying to build a solid road rig rack mounted deal the AXE FXII is pretty much the way to go here. That is major money though, and requires some additional pieces like switching unit, expression pedals etc.

 

[the tourist]

Really, probably the only vital effects to have are a good overdrive and a good delay or reverb.

 

[the tourist]

Yeah. Suggesting something that retails around $2500 seems like a totally legit suggestion to give to someone who is a beginner at guitar effects.

 

[PhilsFan]

Ha, I bought a car last month so I literally have like $1500 to my name.

 

[FredC]

Yeah. Suggesting something that retails around $2500 seems like a totally legit suggestion to give to someone who is a beginner at guitar effects.

You'd be surprised how fast quality pedals add up to more than that.

Strymon Timeline + Bogner Blue = $700 right there

 

[gvox]

Right, and they're both 3-4 times (or more, if you go used) more than any beginner remotely needs to spend to have the vital sounds of delay and overdrive.

 

[PhilsFan]

I've been playing the same guitar and amp for seven years without any effects. I did buy a whammy bar once, though, so I got that going for me.

 

[the tourist]

You'd be surprised how fast quality pedals add up to more than that.

Strymon Timeline + Bogner Blue = $700 right there

The fun thing about pedals is that there is a whole range of quality. PhilsFan happens to be a beginner with the pedals. There is a lot of quality product out there for the beginner that doesn't cost nearly as much. I suggested 4 very quality pedals earlier in this very thread that cost less than the two you mention combined. It's pretty silly to suggest something that costs as much as a boutique guitar amp to someone who is looking to begin looking at pedals.

I suppose if I were to make a suggestion to PhilsFan based on the highest quality, I wouldn't even suggest an AxeFX then. I'd suggest a Klon and three Strymon pedals. But you know what? There's no way anyone brand new at pedals would spend that much. Not even probably a quarter of that much.

 

[Muad'zin]

I went into one of my local guitar shops and checked out the pedals today. Their selection was limited to MXR, Boss and TC Electronic. How do they compare to other brands?

Those are all good pedals. The way I see it there are two kinds of pedals. There are the mass produced factory pedals you named, which are solid dependable pedals. Which many famous artists use live on stage.

And there are boutique pedals. Which are just as good in every way. But which cost 2 to 3 times as much (sometimes even more), and when you look under the hood you'll find that they are almost all modified Boss, MXR and Ibanez pedals anyway. Swap out a resister and cap here and there and voilá, Bob's your uncle. At 2 to 3 times the price. There was a time that 95% of all overdrive pedals out there were all modified copies of the Ibanez Tubescreamer. You name it, it's probably a tubescreamer. The tubescreamer, the fuzz face and the big muff are probably the most copied pedals out there.

Humor me as a complete novice when it comes to this, but what are the most "vital" effects to have? I know Tourist listed a few. Anyone else have thoughts? And what brands tend to work best?

Tourist probably nailed it on the head, overdrive and delay being the most common. But keep in mind, it totally depends on your personal tastes. Lots of people love compressors, I hate compressors. Lots of people love wah pedals *cough* Kirk Hammet *cough*, I can't be arsed about them. Fuzz? Could be fun for a song or two, but give me hi-gain overdrive any time. And some people do absolutely nothing with delay.

That is why I said to get some cheap 2nd hand multi-FX unit. Use it to find out what your tastes are in FX, and only then go find the pedals that will satisfy your tastes. Of course, if you have the spare cash about to buy the Axe FX 2 from the start you're probably set for the next decade.

And if you are good with a soldering iron the sky is the limit. Most pedals that are out there have been traced and you can find layouts of them so you can build them yourself. It usually costs me about $50 to build a pedal from scratch. Or modify that Boss or MXR pedal to make them sound like a boutique pedal? You can even get complete kits to make your own pedal, including well known mods from place like buildyourownclone.com or generalguitargadgets.com.

 

[Izzy.nyc]

Essentials depends on what you want to play

I have an M13 which gets you a lot of great tones, but I find their distortions and overdrives to be in the mediocre range

Start with an ibanez tube screamer, reverb, delay(I like the boss models) and maybe a compression and wah.

 

[the tourist]

And there are boutique pedals. Which are just as good in every way. But which cost 2 to 3 times as much (sometimes even more), and when you look under the hood you'll find that they are almost all modified Boss, MXR and Ibanez pedals anyway. Swap out a resister and cap here and there and voilá, Bob's your uncle. At 2 to 3 times the price. There was a time that 95% of all overdrive pedals out there were all modified copies of the Ibanez Tubescreamer. You name it, it's probably a tubescreamer. The tubescreamer, the fuzz face and the big muff are probably the most copied pedals out there.

This is true. However, a lot of those mass-made pedals have garbage buffers in them that wind up screwing with your guitar tone even when the pedal isn't on. I would never use a Boss or an Ibanez pedal unless it was going through a true bypass switch and only in the signal path when I want it to be. That might just be the elitist with regard to signal purity inside of me talking.

 

[PhilsFan]

I don't actually know what I want to play, that's really the thing. I'm not trying to start a U2 tribute band so replicating Edge's pedalboard isn't the point. I just want a larger arsenal for my songwriting.