bono=genius
The Fly
now i'm wishing they add a 3rd canadian show
Newtshoe said:
I live on Vancouver Island (Nanaimo) and it is 'the thing' we have to deal with (Staying over night that is). If want to see anything in Vancouver it's an overnighter. To me and to most Islanders it is no big deal to stay over night, as it's part of going to a show. We all budget for it. You'd be surprised how many people travel over to see a show. I could anywhere from 1000 to 2000 people from the Island. I went to a canucks game last year and on the fast passenger ferry there were 300 people on it all going over to see a canucks game on that one particular sailing. So for U2 it isn't out of the question to have a large number from VIlanders.
STING2 said:
Did you get the tickets you wanted for the Vancouver show? Which one? Their both soldout now after 90 minutes of the first show going on sale!
Newtshoe said:
Yup 4 tickets. Seciton 315, Row 4, Seat 1-4.
I am so happy to have got 4 tickets together.
Newtshoe said:
Yup 4 tickets. Seciton 315, Row 4, Seat 1-4.
I am so happy to have got 4 tickets together.
NoControl said:The first Vancouver show will sellout fast. And then when the second show goes on sale, it'll sellout eventually - but only because of the fact there's no other Canadian shows scheduled for the first leg (or at least so far), not because there's demand here for two shows, considering the prices they're charging.
The first Seattle show will sellout fast. And then when the second show goes on sale, it'll sellout eventually - but only because of the fact there's no shows scheduled in Portland (or at least so far), not because there's demand there for two shows, considering the prices they're charging.
The second Denver show will sellout, primarily because of the fact there's no shows scheduled in Salt Lake City or Kansas City (that are relatively nearby) yet (or maybe not at all), not because there's a great demand there for two shows, considering the prices they're charging.
The first Phoenix area show will sellout fast. And then the second show will eventually - but primarily because there's no Las Vegas show scheduled (or at least so far), not because there's a great demand in this market for a second show, considering the prices they're charging.
STING2 said:
At the back of the arena, but at least your in the door!
I saw the Pittsburgh show for Elevation from similar seats and it was awesome!
NoControl said:Like I said...
Originally posted by STING2 "The first Vancouver show will sellout fast. And then when the second show goes on sale, it'll sellout eventually"
Umm yep, try; and when the second show goes on sale, it will sellout in MINUTES!
"The first Seattle show will sellout fast. And then when the second show goes on sale, it'll sellout eventually"
Once again, you should have said; and when the second show goes on sale, it will sellout in MINUTES!
Originally posted by STING2 The only major market that has any impact on the Vancouver market is Seattle! The fact that U2 are not playing shows in Edmonton, Calgary, Winnipeg, Toronto and Montreal has no impact on ticket sales in Vancouver. The number of people who would pay the expense and take of the time to travel that far is to small to impact anything in Vancouver.
For one major market to impact another, the markets have to at least be within 3 hours driving time of each other.
Denver is not even remotely close to any other major markets and as people there have said, its up to the people of Denver whether something sells out there or not.
Originally posted by STING2 By every single variable one can list, demand to see U2 on this tour is stronger than any tour since ZOO TV. The demand for this tour is just incredible!
Originally posted by STING2 I was sure the demand was there, but I thought they might play elsewhere or reserve those markets for multiple shows in the fall. Once again, not playing an additional show does not necessarily mean they would not be able to.
Originally posted by STING2 If you would read my posts, you would see that I stated the fact that I understood there would be people from all over the country at those shows, just as there is with any show. But I also said that the number of people from these other area's would not be large enough to have an impact on ticket sales.
Originally posted by STING2 One does not need to know every Canadian fan to come to my conclusion, one just needs to understand a little economics and realize that the majority of fans are not going to pay the travel and lodging expenses involved to see a show that is far enough to require and overnight stay. Especially when the band is or will eventually be coming to area's that are in these fans hometowns or close by.
Originally posted by STING2 Most U2 fans I know would not drive the 3 hours to New York City or 4 hours to Pittsburgh to see a show. Most fans would rather wait for the band to come to a place that is closer to them rather than having to spend the extra money involved with staying overnight in another city.
Originally posted by STING2 If someone lives far away enough from any of the markets, that in order to see U2 at all, it would require them to take off work and stay overnight in another city, then I could see more people in such a situation taking that option. But the number of people in that situation is tiny and would not impact ticket sales in any market.
Originally posted by STING2 Well there is nothing like the truth. Thanks for giving us all the real reason you keep coming to this board. We already know that you "don't respect" U2 anymore. The majority of your 208 posts center around one general theme, and its interesting to see your reactions to other posters who simply disagree with your views.
Originally posted by STING2 Interesting, will add these to the pile of other quotes.
Originally posted by STING2 "I can guarantee you that if U2 booked shows on this first leg in Portland, Edmonton/Calgary & Winnipeg, etc., there wouldn't be demand for second shows in Vancouver & Seattle. In Denver however, there still would be, but the second show wouldn't sellout."
I can guarantee you that if U2 were to book shows in these 3 cities( Portland, Edmonton/Calgary & Winnipeg) right now, they would all sellout in minutes. We have yet to see a single show on this tour sellout "Eventually" although that was your prediction for both Seattle and Vancouver.
Originally posted by STING2 "Its obvious to myself and many others that the demand for this tour is even higher than we expected.
Of course, we could make a poll out of this and see what the other intelligent members of the forum think about this.
We could also do a poll to see how many people are traveling more than 3 hours distance to either the Seattle or Vancouver shows.
Originally posted by STING2 "The fact is, the demand to see U2 on this tour is higher than any U2 tour since ZOO TV. I have two dozen die hard U2 fans who don't have any tickets despite their best efforts and we've all been able to get into some fast sellout U2 shows in the past that were not in stadiums.
Originally posted by STING2 "Most of us would love to have eventual sellouts because that would mean we would all get to see the band, but the results so far show a tour that is able to sellout anywhere in minutes and is making it incredibly difficult even for the most hardcore fans to even get in the door. [/B]
Originally posted by STING2 So in one case there are enough fans on the board to prove someone incorrect on such questions and then in the other qoute your claiming that the board does not represent enough of the fanbase to make such claims.
Originally posted by STING2 Most fans don't have the time or the money to travel and stay overnight in other cities. Its one thing to have 100 dollars to pay for a ticket to a show in the city you live near or semi- close to. Its another thing to have to get out of work, travel a distance that requires you to spend the night in another city, and spend 3 to 4 times the amount of money it would take to see the band in or near your hometown. Most people or fans faced with the increased costs and difficulties to see the band in a city that is faraway enough to require significant travel and an overnight stay will elect not to go.
Originally posted by STING2 Most people do not have unlimited funds and time to follow the band around and that is why these hardcore fans are a minority and typically are only large enough at the opening date of the tour, to effect ticket sales.
Originally posted by STING2 The majority of fans are not going to pay double or triple the face value of a tickets on this tour to see the band in their hometown. Likewise, most are not going to to travel far and stay overnight in another city to see the band, because the total cost of doing so could be two to 3 times the cost of the ticket itself.
Originally posted by STING2 Listen, both shows for Seattle and Vancouver soldout in minutes, not eventually.
Originally posted by STING2 I do not understand what your talking about when you say "Because that's the only think you have to go on"?
Originally posted by STING2 If I have made an incorrect prediction about some aspect of this tour, what is it?
Originally posted by STING2 Its not the total number of tickets sold on the tour which alone determines the demand for the tour. Its each individual market and whether the band successfully met all the demand in each market, and simply playing 4 soldout shows in one market does not by itself mean that all the demand was met for that market.
The number of shows and type of venues played will determine the number of tickets sold in total for the tour and right now, it has still not been confirmed how many shows the band will be playing on the third leg of the tour or what venues will be played.
The band's sellouts in every market in North America have been very impressive and the speed of the sellouts regardless of the size of the market is the most impressive performance I've seen since the ZOO TV tour. Nothing on POPMART or Elevation indicated a demand level of the size we are seeing for Vertigo so far. I've not said that demand is equal to that on ZOO TV, just that I've not in general seen this level of demand for U2 since that tour.
Originally posted by STING2 Would you say that such comments are a respectful way to discuss topics with other members of the forum? Would you say they are consistant with the faq/rules page you agreed to upon becoming a member of the forum? [/B]
STING2 said:NoControl,
One does not have to know "most fans" in order to accurately estimate that most fans are not going to spend the money required to travel and to see the band in a city that would require and overnight stay. This essentially triples the cost of going to the show. Any economist would tell you that the number of people willing to travel from a city a thousand miles away to see a U2 show is going to be a tiny fraction of the number of U2 fans in that city. Any travel and lodging expenses get added to the cost of seeing U2 live. There are certainly a large number of U2 fans willing to pay an average of $90 dollars to see U2, but few would pay $300 dollars to see the band play and that is what the cost could come out to for many people that are traveling and staying overnight. Then, there are the complications of taking off work and being away from home. It certainly can be arranged some of the time, but not all the time.
Originally posted by STING2 Eventually does not suggest a quick sellout and you made a point of mentioning that the second shows would not sell nearly as fast as the first ones. But hey, take in stride, that was probably the conservative estimate of the bands management as well. The band's management has an idea of what demand could be, but they do not precisely know what it will be. U2 did an arena tour to kick of ZOO TV to test the waters to see what the demand was like. In this case, second shows were added after the first one's soldout so quickly, but it appears the band's management was surprised by the speed of the first Denver sellout as the second show did not go on sale until 6 days later. That show soldout just as quick and then the next day, all the shows for Phoenix, Seattle and Vancouver went on sale.
Originally posted by STING2 So what is incorrect about that statement?
Originally posted by STING2 Do you think demand for the Elevation tour or POPMART tour is greater than it is for the Vertigo tour?
Originally posted by STING2 Would you say that such comments are a respectful way to discuss topics with other members of the forum? Would you say they are consistant with the faq/rules page you agreed to upon becoming a member of the forum?
Originally posted by STING2 What is the point in making such comments? How are the above comments consistent with the faq/rules you agreed to follow upon becoming a member of this website?
Any understanding of basic economics would show you that when the price of doing something is several times what one would normally pay for that activity, less people are willing to do that activity. The cost associated with traveling and staying overnight in another city will be to much for most fans in the Calgary area to go to Vancouver. Most U2 fans are not willing to pay 300 or 400 dollars to see the Vertigo tour and that is what they would be paying in many of these travel and overnight stay senerio's. Its basic economics. The demand by people in Edmonton/Calgary to see U2 in Edmonton/Calgary is higher than the demand by people in Edmonton/Calgary to see U2 in Vancouver BC. The number of people in Edmonton/Calgary willing to see U2 for $90 is far larger than the number of Edmonton/Calgary people willing to see U2 in Vancouver for $300 to $400.
Originally posted by STING2 Your the one who made the point of saying that Seattle one would sellout quickly and then that Seattle 2 would sellout "eventually". You were careful to point out that one would sellout fast and the other would not sellout quickly, but eventually.
Originally posted by STING2 The first Denver show was put on sale at 10:00 AM Mountain time, well after shows to the East had already soldout and an hour before shows on the West Coast would go onsale. The first show in Denver soldout and minutes and the second show if they were prepared could have been added and soldout well before any shows on the west coast went onsale. No congestion problem at all.
Originally posted by STING2 If you look at their touring history, that is often not the case. There are good examples of the band testing the waters on both Joshua Tree and obviously ZOO TV.
Originally posted by STING2 The band new full well that they would not be playing any where near to what the level of demand was to see the band on the Elevation tour in Europe. The Elevation tour was origionally supposed to just be 5 months with the Slane shows being the last shows. The Slane shows were the only outdoor shows planned and Turin was thrown in as a way to prepare for the outdoor Slane gigs.
Originally posted by STING2 The demand for the Vertigo tour is higher than demand for either the Elevation tour or POPMART tour so your statement is incorrect.
Originally posted by STING2 In addition, I have said that the Vertigo tour has demand that is at least 50% higher than anything seen on POPMART. I never made any statement about European attendance for the Vertigo tour.
Originally posted by STING2 The tour promoter just recently said that the band could sellout a full week of shows in Dublin, something that your beloved Pink Floyd could not even do for one show there, and in fact had to cancel their show at the smaller RDS in 1988 because not enough people bought tickets.
Originally posted by STING2 I'm talking general demand regardless of ticket prices. The number of people seeking to see U2 in concert this year compared to POPMART and Elevation. [/B]
STING2 said:No Control, You haven't answered my questions in regards to the following, so that is why I have posted it several times.
Originally posted by STING2 I take it you have not read anything I said about why most fans would not travel stay overnight in another city. If you don't understand basic economics or are unwilling to learn, then I can't help you.
Originally posted by STING2 You made a clear distinction between how the first show would sell and how the second show would sell. You said the first shows would sellout quickly and then the second shows would sellout eventually.
Originally posted by STING2 The first leg of the Joshua Tree tour was in Arena's with the exception of the Stadium show near Detriot which was a tests. Tickets for the first leg of the tour did not go on sale until two weeks prior to the first show. I bought my tickets to the Philly show 3 weeks before it happened. As Paul McGuinness has always said, he has to break the band again any time they come out with a new album and tour. The fact is, the band's management often does not know the exact demand. The band even did a short theater tour in 1984 to test the waters before they did a full tour in the Spring of 1985 in North America. Testing the waters by booking smaller venues is a common practice in the touring industry.
Originally posted by STING2 The band had already soldout several stadiums years earlier on a less popular album and tour called POPMART. Elevation was designed as a stripped down arena tour and that is the only reason why most of the dates were in Arena's in Europe with the exception of 3. Depending on what the artist wants, they will sometimes choose to play smaller venues than what one would normally play if the only purpose was to try and meet all the demand that was out there.
Originally posted by STING2 The speed of the sellouts in these softer North American markets plus adding additional dates in these same markets and having them sellout just as fast shows that the demand is higher. In addition, the new album is far ahead of where POP or ATYCLB were after their first 10 weeks in sales.
Originally posted by STING2 There is no evidence to show that less people would be interested in attending the Vertigo European tour if the band had done stadiums in Europe back in 2001. Four years pass and the biggest factor in demand for the new tour is the new album. But take for instance the Dublin shows in 2001. 160,000 tickets soldout in a combined 135 minutes. Last week, the two Dublin shows sold 160,000 tickets in less than 50 minutes and the promoter said they could have done a week of shows at Croke Park. Despite playing one of the largest venues in the country in 2001, there is more demand on this 2005 tour to see the band in Dublin despite all the stadium shows being booked in nearby countries if one believes those traveling to Dublin are a key factor.
Originally posted by STING2 If I did say that, when and where did I say it? I have always stated that I thought that demand for the Elevation tour in North America would have translated to a 50% increase in attendance over the POPMART tour if the tour had been booked in stadiums at POPMART prices. Its possible I may have made a mistake in typing up a posts, but I think your probably getting mixed up about things. In any event, I know you'll show me where I stated this since you know I said it.
Originally posted by STING2 A Promoter doesn't get paid to create hype and demand for shows that are not going to happen.
Originally posted by STING2 Most people who wanted to see the two Dublin shows did not get tickets! A third Dublin show will sellout just as fast as the first two! The band could easily play 7 shows at Croke Park based on the level of demand that is out there given the speed of the sellouts and the massive of number of people unable to obtain tickets.
Originally posted by STING2 Pink Floyd is not the largest drawing band or highest selling band in the World. Pink Floyd in fact is not even a band anymore.
The only tour where Pink Floyd truely had stronger attendance levels for individual cities than U2 was their North American Division Bell tour. This was because the majority of the tickets were sold at the low ticket price of $22.50. These tickets covered the back area's of the stadium which are difficult to sale. Adjusted for inflation, these tickets were priced below the price for tickets in 1987. Adjusted for inflation today (2005), and these tickets would only cost 29 dollars. Thats right, 29 dollars. Everyone's Grandparents could sellout a stadium tour for 29 dollars in 2005.
Pink Floyd did not crush U2 back in the early 1990s or late 1980s, and would not crush anything U2 is doing today unless possibly if they announced it as their last tour.
Originally posted by STING2 The latest news from Billboard reports that the U2's soldout 28 date North American leg has GROSSED 47 million dollars!
In Europe, the band has sold out 19 stadium shows, for a gross of $94 million and 1.05 million tickets, so far. Thats an average GROSS of nearly 5 million per night. The average ticket price for these shows is 89 dollars, more than double Pink Floyds Division Bell prices adjusted for inflation! Despite playing stadiums in Europe, every show has completely soldout quickly. The band has already Grossed a combined 141 million dollars from just 47 soldout shows! Less than half of the dates for this tour have been put on sale and the band has already GROSSED 141 million dollars with every show soldout the day it was put on sale!
The new album has sold 8.5 million copies worldwide in only 10 weeks. There is not another band or artist that is as hot as U2 in 2005. Not even some band that has been dead since 1994.
Desert Dog said:any Pink Floyd albums or tours like the Division Bell that dont include the true genius of Floyd - Roger Waters - absolutely suck in my book. That Tour was all about Dave Gilmour and the rest of em trying to milk the Floyd name for a few bucks.