Short of a masterpiece

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I'm with the original poster. Moments of greatness but overall not great. Good. U2 albums always get better with time for me - and better after having gone to some shows.

One of my biggest issue on the album, and one which no one seems to be talking about, is how bad the lyrics are. "you don't know how beautiful you are".....? Seriously? How often are they going to use the same shit? This is the same guy that wrote Bad? Hard to believe. Sounds more like Scott Stapp or Steve Miller.

This album was 5 years in the making and they had 60 tracks to choose from. Is it really the masterpiece you all expected?
 
Boots is defo a misfit. Stand Up and Crazy also break up very strong/moody opening and closing segments of the album. All the same though, still a very good album with plenty of 'new' elements to keep me excited.

Whether it really becomes a Masterpiece depends on how these songs will be in a live arena. I'm not convinced they will be easily translated.
 
Crazy, Boots, SUC, is a nice middle section to the album that has a crunch to it.
indeed, it gives the album some breathing space
it adds some (lighter) moods, textures and fun to it all


+ Crazy Tonights at times is one of my favourite tracks on the album
 
The more i listen to it less i like it. It comes short of a masterpiece by far. Each song have wonderfull music and singing moments but it seems they want to ruin it with completly wrong producing choices. I think in some songs they want to putt too much stuff on it, ex. from where did the organ came in UC? and most of time with no sense of belonging (i wonder why no one thought in a screaming cow just for the sake of more confusion) and in some songs they just strip them down too much leaving them almost empty. Once more U2 had the gold on their hands and let it go.
 
I love the ones who claim it isnt great etc all have just recentley joined (probably to get hold of the leak), and have like 20 posts the there name.
 
Yes, awful record. Way to complex for my peanut sized brain:ohmy::ohmy:.

It's not even complex, it's just confusing not for any small brain (even yours) but because the flow of the songs are not good enough with too much diferent stuff, has if they tranform diferent songs in just one. But is just my opinion...:sexywink:


P.S. Did the leak came out in december 2004?
 
I agree, also a 25 year U2 fan, it's a masterpiece. I've seen them when they were great (Unforgettable Fire, Achtung Baby) and when they were pompous (Joshua Tree, Pop) and when they were humble (ALLTUCLB) and passed when I was sick of them (HTDAAB), and I really didnt care too much about this release.

But his CD restores hope that music can be something more than a commercial enterprise, something very rare these days. They did not cop out, every song - even boots I think - has strong merits, and nothing is either immediately palatable or so esotheric that I cant relate to it. I think this a far superior effort than HTDAAB, I feel like they are familiar again, being open and vulnerable instead of ironic and clever, that sucked (OOTS excepted). I love this CD, I hope I dont get tired of it too soon.

U2 I think show they respect their audience enough to take them into new territory responsibly, a sign of what a mature rock band should be doing - giving us the benifit of their experience, not pretending to deny their status and age by acting like 18 year olds by trying to rewrite "I will Follow" over and over again. God bless U2! A for effort and A+ for execution ! This CD is a gift of hope in a very dark time in our history.

Excellent post. (In that I agree ccompletely with it) :)
 
I agree, also a 25 year U2 fan, it's a masterpiece. I've seen them when they were great (Unforgettable Fire, Achtung Baby) and when they were pompous (Joshua Tree, Pop) and when they were humble (ALLTUCLB) and passed when I was sick of them (HTDAAB), and I really didnt care too much about this release.

But his CD restores hope that music can be something more than a commercial enterprise, something very rare these days. They did not cop out, every song - even boots I think - has strong merits, and nothing is either immediately palatable or so esotheric that I cant relate to it. I think this a far superior effort than HTDAAB, I feel like they are familiar again, being open and vulnerable instead of ironic and clever, that sucked (OOTS excepted). I love this CD, I hope I dont get tired of it too soon.

U2 I think show they respect their audience enough to take them into new territory responsibly, a sign of what a mature rock band should be doing - giving us the benifit of their experience, not pretending to deny their status and age by acting like 18 year olds by trying to rewrite "I will Follow" over and over again. God bless U2! A for effort and A+ for execution ! This CD is a gift of hope in a very dark time in our history.

AGREE!!! Great review, and I completely concur.
 
The more i listen to it less i like it. It comes short of a masterpiece by far. Each song have wonderfull music and singing moments but it seems they want to ruin it with completly wrong producing choices. I think in some songs they want to putt too much stuff on it, ex. from where did the organ came in UC? and most of time with no sense of belonging (i wonder why no one thought in a screaming cow just for the sake of more confusion) and in some songs they just strip them down too much leaving them almost empty. Once more U2 had the gold on their hands and let it go.

Your comments echo exactly what I hated about HTDAAB. I think the production on this one is top notch, and keeps things interesting where Bomb would have dragged or added mention of "knees". So far, I'm loving the sound in total. Long may it continue.
 
Haha, good one. A shame you don't like it more but perhaps in the future you will.

I am glad you have sense of humour. But i like a lot some moments in each song, i just do not get it why they need to show to much in it. When we listen to Classics (one, bad,etc) we can see how simple they are, a great melody from the beginning to the end, a refrain, meaningfull words and even if the melody, refrain or words were repeated it works wonderfuly. These days U2 are complicating too much, trying too much for the old magic or to a new one and coming short...
 
Boots is defo a misfit. Stand Up and Crazy also break up very strong/moody opening and closing segments of the album. All the same though, still a very good album with plenty of 'new' elements to keep me excited.

Whether it really becomes a Masterpiece depends on how these songs will be in a live arena. I'm not convinced they will be easily translated.


Now I don't want to start a fight, b/c I've seen that the "Radiohead" word around here pisses some folks off. But I am extremely curious, and more than a little nervous to see what happens on this tour. And they might have to pull off what Radiohead does for the Kid A / Amnesiac songs in a live setting.

1. U2 has to learn how to reinterpret their songs in a live setting. They have done good with Pop - specifically Mofo. But they've avoided playing anything from that album that would involve reinterpretation for a long time. I don't know that they have the knack. And on a song like unknown caller, it's ok to have one or two backing tracks, but if you've got a wind band, a church organ, another guitar, and three extra voices coming out of the speakers, you need to change something about the composition. Not because it's bad, but to keep some immediacy.

2. the biggest thing i'm worried about is that I think the band thinks they have a different album than they do. There are rock moments. But on the whole this is an album that competes maybe with the last David Byrne record, but that's it. The Killers and KOL are after something very different (and I'm glad U2 isn't chasing them, b/c they're headed for boredom), Bono talks a big game about how this music is more alive and soulful than anything in indie, but he's probably only sort of right about the soulful bit.

This record very much has it's heart on its sleeve, and no song really has any swagger to it. MAgnificent is just huge and earnest, Boots is somewhat interesting, but they are forcing the swagger there. And Stand Up Comedy should have been killed a long time ago, unbelievably forced. So when I see U2 doing this hyper-attenuated Zoo TV/dramatic eyeliner thing, I wonder what they think about their own album. The lyrics on NLOTH, when they're good, are intensely creative, beautiful, and fresh. Not a trace of irony. Not the kind of thing to throw up on a video screen like a slogan.

I desperately wanted a Pop/Achtung stadium sized experimentation record and tour. but NLOTH is not a stadium record. If they had more songs like the "let me in the sound" bit from boots, something with a bit more thought in terms of beats (not criticizing Larry Mullen Jr., just wish the band had really listened to new music in all fields, rather than MTV2), maybe a stadium over-the-top show would have worked. But it's not that album.
 
When we listen to Classics (one, bad,etc) we can see how simple they are, a great melody from the beginning to the end, a refrain, meaningfull words and even if the melody, refrain or words were repeated it works wonderfuly. These days U2 are complicating to much, trying to much for the old magic and coming short...

For me it is the other way around. I just love the complexity of the songs. After a while you start to understand that every detail and every little noise has its place in the song and has a meaning. I am not a the biggest fan of GOYB but for instance there is a little haunting keyboard part hidden behind the fat guitar sound (you know what I mean if you listen carefully to the "Get on your Boots, yeah" part of the song) in there that makes me coming back to it. Just give it a chance to grow on you.
 
Put Mercy after Fez - Being Born, and it's a masterpiece.

NLOTH is 2 songs short of a masterpiece. It is missing a "one". a great sort of ballad that will be remembered and seen as for years by fans and causual listeners as a classic. Can you imagine that their would be a real classic like "One" on this record instead of(and I know people will call me crazy the incredible annoying Moment of surrender where Bono tries to proof a point but fails which is a shame after the first two songs) and mercy (for instance) had replaced boots. Now you have a GREAT record but it is missing that little extra to make it an absolute classic for both fans an casual listeners I think. I love the record anyway and it will be safe bet as one of the albums that I take with me on our honeymoon :love: :wink:

I am not so sure if this album will work live which has allways been U2's main focus.
 
NLOTH is 2 songs short of a masterpiece. It is missing a "one". a great sort of ballad that will be remembered and seen as for years by fans and causual listeners as a classic. Can you imagine that their would be a real classic like "One" on this record instead of(and I know people will call me crazy the incredible annoying Moment of surrender where Bono tries to proof a point but fails which is a shame after the first two songs) and mercy (for instance) had replaced boots. Now you have a GREAT record but it is missing that little extra to make it an absolute classic for both fans an casual listeners I think. I love the record anyway and it will be safe bet as one of the albums that I take with me on our honeymoon :love: :wink:

I am not so sure if this album will work live which has allways been U2's main focus.


You apparently don't get MOS yet, but that's fine, some people took 10 years for One to sink in. MOS is the One of this album, not in terms of sonics or subject matter or what have you but in terms of spirit, and magic and the way the song came about. If anything MOS is much more of a "God walks through the room moment" because they tinkered with it less than even One was messed with. However it is also something you will either get or not and it will happen or not in it's own time. I don't think you can work at it. Someday it may hit you when you least expect it.

Dana
 
We'll see. I loved HTDAAB on first listen, but it subsequently lacked the depth for me to consistently go back to it. This album is tricky- its quite a bit different than what U2 has been doing...so its easy to be impressed or even be put off on initial listens. I'm glad they did something like this. I just wished it hadn't taken so long.

To me its a different Bono- different vocal stylings, different songwriting on a lot of songs here. Its gonna take a bit of time to really evaluate.
 
You apparently don't get MOS yet, but that's fine, some people took 10 years for One to sink in. MOS is the One of this album, not in terms of sonics or subject matter or what have you but in terms of spirit, and magic and the way the song came about. If anything MOS is much more of a "God walks through the room moment" because they tinkered with it less than even One was messed with. However it is also something you will either get or not and it will happen or not in it's own time. I don't think you can work at it. Someday it may hit you when you least expect it.

Dana

oh, so MOS IS a masterpiece and I am missing the point? great, I have something to look forward to then. I will let you know when God walked through the room. IN the case of "one": I guess you mean people who were 5 years old at the time of release.
 
oh, so MOS IS a masterpiece and I am missing the point? great, I have something to look forward to then. I will let you know when God walked through the room. IN the case of "one": I guess you mean people who were 5 years old at the time of release.

You can let me know when God walks through the room for you. That's the point. For the band they feels that One and MOS are both instances of God walking through the room. They feel that way to me too, but they don't for you and I don't have a problem with that. You may or may not feel differently at a later date.

In the case of One I am talking about reviewers who didn't think One was anything special in the beginning but years and years later talked about finally "getting it". This happens for a lot of people with a lot of things. Took me years to get the difference between the Beatle and the Monkees. Didn't understand the greatness of Dylan til just a few years ago. A lot has to do with where your own head is at and what is important to you. Doesn't mean you're lacking in any way. I don't think I was stupid not understanding some of those things just that my frame of reference was different. My views on music, singing, and songwriting have changed over the years but I'm not in any way embarassed about the views I held when I was younger. They weren't better or worse, just different.

I truly did not intend my comment to be an insult to you and I'm sorry for offending you.

Dana
 
Recipe to transform NLOTH into a masterpiece (very close)

1- Cut boots

2- Burn new CD with the following sequence

1-NLOTH
2-Magnificent
3-MOS
4-Crazy
5-Unknown caller
6-Fez-Being Born
7-white as snow
8-Breathe
9-Stand up
10-Cedars

I found that with this sequencing the album retains it's creative and melodic flow till the very end. The songs naturally bleed into each other and constantly and gradually build the album's momentum. Breathe and Stand Up together in the end make for an apocalytic stormy grand finale before album winds down, leaving you gasping for air begging for the quiet calm of Cedars of Lebanon..

In tune with my opening post, Boots is a great song but it just doesn't fit on this record. By incorporating boots on NLOTH, U2 seeming had to compromise the flow of the album so to find a home for this unfortunate orphan song! Maybe Boots could have been a hidn track deep on record!

Let me know what you think!!
 
I don't think Moment of Surrender is near the same league as One. The chorus damages the song I think, and ruins the great atmosphere which has been built to that point.
 
Moment of Surrender makes the album version of One sound a bit trivial
One gained a lot through it live performance
well, for me anyway
 
Let me know what you think!!

We live in a world where you can move songs around and rip what you want so why not do that? If Winter is a song you like you may be able to add it and create your own "personal masterpiece".

My personal masterpiece would be the album as it is but maybe the vinyl version or if the movie has DTS cuts on it plus other tracks I may like I could add to what I love already.
 
oh, so MOS IS a masterpiece and I am missing the point? great, I have something to look forward to then. I will let you know when God walked through the room. IN the case of "one": I guess you mean people who were 5 years old at the time of release.

Look, you are in the minority here. There are a LOT of people here who think MOS is a masterpiece. Fine, if you don't agree but don't try to convince others that it is not.
 
You can let me know when God walks through the room for you. That's the point. For the band they feels that One and MOS are both instances of God walking through the room. They feel that way to me too, but they don't for you and I don't have a problem with that. You may or may not feel differently at a later date.

In the case of One I am talking about reviewers who didn't think One was anything special in the beginning but years and years later talked about finally "getting it". This happens for a lot of people with a lot of things. Took me years to get the difference between the Beatle and the Monkees. Didn't understand the greatness of Dylan til just a few years ago. A lot has to do with where your own head is at and what is important to you. Doesn't mean you're lacking in any way. I don't think I was stupid not understanding some of those things just that my frame of reference was different. My views on music, singing, and songwriting have changed over the years but I'm not in any way embarassed about the views I held when I was younger. They weren't better or worse, just different.

I truly did not intend my comment to be an insult to you and I'm sorry for offending you.

Dana

No need to feel sorry Dana, I feel that although Moment of Surrender is not getting to me I can see the appeal for it from others. I just do not think that tis is a song that will be played as a hymne for human solidarity for instance. the problem with one is that it is overplayed and sometimes people tend to forget(see setlist whishes and which sons to drop) what an absolue beauty of songwritership it actually is. A classic (in U2 backcatagory at least) needs to be played live and appeal to a lot of people to make it a classic. songs like sreets, wowy, SBS or one have had so many icredible moments live. I just do not for the love of God happening with moments of surrender. I could be compleey wrong off course and if so, i will be more than happy to admit my lack of insight but in this cae I do not think that is necesary. Let's wait and see :wink:
 
No need to feel sorry Dana, I feel that although Moment of Surrender is not getting to me I can see the appeal for it from others. I just do not think that tis is a song that will be played as a hymne for human solidarity for instance. the problem with one is that it is overplayed and sometimes people tend to forget(see setlist whishes and which sons to drop) what an absolue beauty of songwritership it actually is. A classic (in U2 backcatagory at least) needs to be played live and appeal to a lot of people to make it a classic. songs like sreets, wowy, SBS or one have had so many icredible moments live. I just do not for the love of God happening with moments of surrender. I could be compleey wrong off course and if so, i will be more than happy to admit my lack of insight but in this cae I do not think that is necesary. Let's wait and see :wink:

Ok, that was better. :wink: (that really was not meant to sound condescending)
 
Look, you are in the minority here. There are a LOT of people here who think MOS is a masterpiece. Fine, if you don't agree but don't try to convince others that it is not.

see last post. i am NOT trying to convince anyone. Why would I WANT othes to not like the song because I don't .
where do people get these ideas? And because I am in the minority I am automaticaly wrong? Check out human history volume 1-43 and come back again :)

that is not meant mean by the way lol
 
see last post. i am NOT trying to convince anyone. Why would I WANT othes to not like the song because I don't .
where do people get these ideas? And because I am in the minority I am automaticaly wrong? Check out human history volume 1-43 and come back again :up:

Yeah, I saw. See my last post! :wink:
 
I'm sorry but in my opinion and FOR ME NLOTH has too many songs I dislike for me to consider it a masterpiece. There are some really good songs, but only SOME that I like. Whereas on JT and AB I liked both whole albums. So in my opinion and for me I don't consider it their 3rd masterpiece. But hey whatever this is just my opinion, I expect people to flame me for it still however...
 
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