NFL 2007, Part One - Page 21 - U2 Feedback

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Old 09-12-2007, 11:53 AM   #301
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Well there's that. They're all gone.

Maybe next time.
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Old 09-12-2007, 11:14 PM   #302
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Quote:
Originally posted by Headache in a Suitcase
the nfl doesn't want the pats to use video... fine. they're still gonna do it
The real question is WHY?

Do they need to CHEAT to win? I doubt it. So why put your team in jeopardy? Why, as one of, if not THE, premier coach in the NFL, do you blatantly cheat?

I think it is an embarrassment to the team. Isn't Tom Brady good enough? You need to go out and CHEAT by stealing signals to beat an otherwise pathetic team? I doubt Mangini is dumb enough to use the signals in the second game against the Patriots.

I hope the league penalizes the Patriots...mainly to send a message to coaches and teams.
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Old 09-12-2007, 11:25 PM   #303
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Not to defend the Pats, but, the league issued a warning about this sort of thing to all teams last season. Probably because it was not an isolated issue.

I'm thinking that the Pats are basically guilty of getting caught, and that they are not alone in employing this practice.

They'll get penalized, and rightfully so, but, I just don't get the major outcry. I've watched and followed sports long enough to know that right or wrong, this shit always goes on, and always will.
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Old 09-12-2007, 11:43 PM   #304
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Big Grin

I don't think it's a big deal...but, WHY as the supposed best team in the league, why do you need it?
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Old 09-13-2007, 07:05 AM   #305
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From Belichick's cryptic statements thus far, what I can gather is that he interpreted the rules differently than the league (or so he is saying), and that in his mind you couldn't videotape the coaches signals to use in that game. So the Pats for all those who claim this is why they beat the Jets, apparently had not viewed any of what was recorded and planned to use it much like game film in preparation for the next game with the J-e-T-S.

Obviously they broke the rule. Did they do so with complete irreverence or did they think they were in compliance by not viewing the tape till after the game, who knows. Probably the former, but I doubt that there is much advantage to be gained from this taping as any smart team will change up signals, use decoy signals and so forth. They may have been able to catch a few things that might help them on a small number of plays, but its not like some people are saying "they knew everything the Jets were gonna do thats why they beat them so bad".

I still think Mangini is gonna regret tattling later on. He's essentially admitting to having participated in the practice himself by doing so. Plus methinks Belichick may want his team to make a statement when the Jets come to Gillette this season, a statement that might make 38-14 look like a nail biter.
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Old 09-13-2007, 08:17 AM   #306
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I bet if it had been the Eagles, there'd be hell to pay...

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Old 09-13-2007, 10:06 AM   #307
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I can't understand why this latest cheating scandal is not a bigger deal than Michael Vick. What he did sucks, but it didn't directly affect the outcome of NFL games as this did. I don't believe any NFL coach was that ignorant of the rules, of course when he says 'interpretation' what that really means is his own spin now. Come on he knew what he was doing and that it was wrong. Everyone involved should get at least as bad as Vick got (NFL suspension not jail)
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Old 09-13-2007, 10:09 AM   #308
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i think it was a genius plan by mangini to, more or less, tip off the NFL as to this practice (which is not cheating whatsoever in my eyes)... piss off the best team in the league. brilliant! no wonder he's the mangenius.

and zoney... why not? every team, every player wants to get the best competitive advantage they possibly can. i mean if they're that good, why scout? who needs to review game tape if you have tom brady!

this is so silly... so what, if an offensive player notices that a coach or a player has a tell that will make it obvious what sort of rush they're in, is the offensive player to just ignore that? "oh, whoopsie, they're not smart enough to mix up their signals and i can tell everything they're gonna do before they do it... oh shucks, i better ignore that information. it wouldn't be right"

please.

Quote:
Originally posted by AnnRKeyintheUSA
Everyone involved should get at least as bad as Vick got (NFL suspension not jail)
that is one of the single most ridiculous statements i have ever read.
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Old 09-13-2007, 10:14 AM   #309
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So you don't think cheating is a big deal uh?

Quote:
Originally posted by zonelistener
It's not cheating when the Patriots do it...right?

All of the teams get "tapes" in the NFL of the teams they will be playing. I have reviewed CDs left on airplanes by certain NFL teams we fly...they show the plays (so they can scout like Headache does). The videos do not show coaches calling in plays to the field.

There is prep, and there is cheating. It is like the difference between knowing how another poker player at your table plays, and knowing his actual cards.

And I agree, the video camera is a better technology than binoculars!
That's the difference. And it's against the rules.
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Old 09-13-2007, 10:18 AM   #310
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Quote:
Originally posted by AnnRKeyintheUSA
I can't understand why this latest cheating scandal is not a bigger deal than Michael Vick.

...

Come on he knew what he was doing and that it was wrong. Everyone involved should get at least as bad as Vick got (NFL suspension not jail)
From my understanding of the story, Bill Belichick has not electrocuted or strangled any living beings.

While my feelings on this story should be pretty clear, Headache's right - it is awfully ridiculous to compare this to Vick.
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Old 09-13-2007, 10:19 AM   #311
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i don't think it's cheating... not even a little cheating, and everybody cheats a little.

it's against the rules to use a video camera... fine. fine 'em, take a draft pick. but to suspend everyone involved for a year or longer like vick will get? over something that every team has always done and will continue to always do, just without the brain to use modern technology to help them do it? that's ridiculous.

the jets didn't get blown out because some guy video taped a few signals. the jets got blown out because they suck.
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Old 09-13-2007, 10:25 AM   #312
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Quote:
Originally posted by Headache in a Suitcase
this is so silly... so what, if an offensive player notices that a coach or a player has a tell that will make it obvious what sort of rush they're in, is the offensive player to just ignore that? "oh, whoopsie, they're not smart enough to mix up their signals and i can tell everything they're gonna do before they do it... oh shucks, i better ignore that information. it wouldn't be right"

please.
To clarify my own position, despite my very obvious dislike for the Patriots, and the fact that this specific type of incident is cheating (it's against the rules, so it's cheating by definition)...I still agree somewhat with you Headache. Every team does (and should, if they're smart) scout opponents' signals and plays before the game. And watching the other sideline to try to pick up on those signals. What I disagree with is the use of the video camera, but I can't get myself all worked up over this because we all know every team does it (scout opponents' signals, not necessarily film them), it's a smart thing to do to get a competitive advantage.

Meanwhile, ESPN is shitting bricks, as if all 3 Super Bowls should be "asterisked"...give me a break.

If the Raiders had been caught doing this, we'd all be making "well clearly it does nothing for them" jokes. But since it's the Pats, it's like frickin' Watergate.

I honestly don't care too much about it. I feel like I ought to, but I don't.
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Old 09-13-2007, 10:32 AM   #313
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Quote:
Originally posted by AnnRKeyintheUSA
Everyone involved should get at least as bad as Vick got (NFL suspension not jail)

Quote:
Originally posted by Headache in a Suitcase
that is one of the single most ridiculous statements i have ever read.
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Old 09-13-2007, 10:33 AM   #314
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So Mangenius knew about this and just sat on it for 5 games, then decides to rat?

Personally I think it's brilliant. It's like stealing signs in baseball. And I'd be shocked if other teams don't do it...I'd bet Parcells has, and it sure looks like the Colts know what's coming sometimes.

But I'm probably a tad biased...
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Old 09-13-2007, 10:33 AM   #315
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Quote:
Originally posted by DaveC


To clarify my own position, despite my very obvious dislike for the Patriots, and the fact that this specific type of incident is cheating (it's against the rules, so it's cheating by definition)...I still agree somewhat with you Headache. Every team does (and should, if they're smart) scout opponents' signals and plays before the game. And watching the other sideline to try to pick up on those signals. What I disagree with is the use of the video camera, but I can't get myself all worked up over this because we all know every team does it (scout opponents' signals, not necessarily film them), it's a smart thing to do to get a competitive advantage.

Meanwhile, ESPN is shitting bricks, as if all 3 Super Bowls should be "asterisked"...give me a break.

If the Raiders had been caught doing this, we'd all be making "well clearly it does nothing for them" jokes. But since it's the Pats, it's like frickin' Watergate.

I honestly don't care too much about it. I feel like I ought to, but I don't.
well... we disagree on symantics, but we agree on everything else.
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