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Old 04-21-2009, 07:28 PM   #31
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“With me the horrid doubt always arises whether the convictions of man’s mind, which has been developed from the mind of the lower animals, are of any value or at all trustworthy. Would any one trust in the convictions of a monkey’s mind, if there are any convictions in such a mind?”


~Charles Darwin
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Old 04-21-2009, 07:35 PM   #32
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^ torture memos ?


that is why we need constant review and evaluation of writings, we are evolving into smarter monkeys.
we can eliminate the waste. not cling to it and call it holy.
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Old 04-21-2009, 07:56 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kieran McConville View Post
...It's got nothing to do with Hollywood ideals of some super-race. At the end of it all, on this earth, as the sun goes supernova, the 'fittest' may well be hardy bacteria living inside rocks.
I'm really lichen your take on this.
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Old 04-21-2009, 10:42 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the iron horse View Post
“With me the horrid doubt always arises whether the convictions of man’s mind, which has been developed from the mind of the lower animals, are of any value or at all trustworthy. Would any one trust in the convictions of a monkey’s mind, if there are any convictions in such a mind?”


~Charles Darwin
The quote doesn't deny the fact of human origins
Quote:
He who understands baboon would do more towards metaphysics than Locke

~Charles Darwin
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Old 04-22-2009, 02:38 PM   #35
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That Darwin quote is all about convictions.

I have never really heard people argue for people to be tolerant of their scientific convictions
or even for the enactment of laws to protect the practice their scientific convictions.
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Old 04-23-2009, 09:38 AM   #36
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Nothing says happy birthday like the fossil of a "walking seal".

CTV.ca | Canadian fossil find sheds new light on seal evolution


A model of the Puijila darwini, a four-legged, semi-aquatic creature.
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Old 04-23-2009, 09:54 AM   #37
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Thank you posting that video Jive Turkey. It's interesting what this Ken Miller said about a "designer" and the fact that he's a Catholic. Again it proves that being a Christian doesn't mean that you should deny evolution, and Miller lectures on the subject. Has Ken Miller written any books on evolution?
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Old 04-24-2009, 07:30 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by A_Wanderer View Post
The quote doesn't deny the fact of human origins

I don't know the source of your quote.

I can post a several more quotes where Darwin either doubted his theory or stated that future discoveries could disprove his theory. He was open to that happening.

I'm not trying to start a battle here, but the truth is that Darwin was not truly convinced his ideas were correct.
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Old 04-24-2009, 08:19 PM   #39
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Darwin was a careful scientist who accepted the idea of falsifiability (that his theory could be disproven, like any other scientific theory). He also took two decades to collect the evidence which helped shape the theory. He did not publish until his hand was forced, at which time he had accrued a terrific quantity of data.

My quote was taken from Darwin's Notebook M, the context is speculation about the implications of human beings as evolved creatures, something which Darwin accepted. If you want a sceptic about evolving human intelligence look to Alfred Russell Wallace.

The idea that Darwin was very doubtful about evolution by the time that he published is an old creationist canard, not unlike the claims of deathbed conversion, it is also a lie. Of course you can pull in points where Darwin posited evidence which would disprove his hypothesis (mismatched fossils, unevolvable organs etc.) but in 200 years these have not come to light, and effectively all the new data fits into an evolutionary framework.


Rather than engage in creationist quote mining I suggest that you dig into some decent Darwinia and build up a picture of a fascinating man.
- Darwin Correspondence Project
- The Complete Work of Charles Darwin Online
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Old 04-24-2009, 11:31 PM   #40
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but the truth is that Darwin was not truly convinced his ideas were correct.

The truth is Darwin, like all humans should be, was careful to announce any absolutes. You know little about science or Darwin if you honestly think that quote meant he doubted his own theory.
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Old 09-22-2009, 03:09 PM   #41
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It's even better than a very special episode of Growing Pains


Kirk Cameron, best known for his role in the 1980s sitcom Growing Pains, now spends much of his time advocating for far-right Christian evangelical causes.

In a video posted recently to YouTube, Cameron lays out a plan to subvert 'Darwin Day' on November 22, 2009 -- a date marking the 150th anniversary of the publishing of Charles Darwin's "Origin of Species." Cameron says that he and like-minded activists plan to deliver 50,000 copies of an altered version of Darwin's book to students at dozens of U.S. universities.

Cameron explains that this "very special" edition of the "Origin of Species" will include an introduction explaining "Adolf Hitler's undeniable connection" to the theory of evolution, and highlighting "Darwin's racism" and "his disdain for women." Cameron's edition also exposes the "many hoaxes" of evolutionary theory, while presenting a "balanced view of Creationism."

YouTube - Origin Into Schools
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Old 09-22-2009, 03:15 PM   #42
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YouTube - John Hurt monologue (the proposition)


love the bit about charles darwin & "MONKEEEEEEEEYS!"
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Old 09-22-2009, 08:11 PM   #43
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I'd be down for requesting a couple hundred copies of Kirk Cameron's Origin of Species to 'give out at universities', then hold a mass bonfire. Anyone else in? We should start a grassroots campaign
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Old 09-22-2009, 08:30 PM   #44
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Yay for scientific capitalism!
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Old 09-23-2009, 11:01 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsSpringsteen View Post
Cameron explains that this "very special" edition of the "Origin of Species" will include an introduction explaining "Adolf Hitler's undeniable connection" to the theory of evolution, and highlighting "Darwin's racism" and "his disdain for women." Cameron's edition also exposes the "many hoaxes" of evolutionary theory, while presenting a "balanced view of Creationism."
You can point and laugh at this introduction over here!
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