US Politics XXXVIII: "Patriots" vs Reality

[allaras]

30,000 people allegedly attended a Trump rally in the Bronx.

Looks more like a free Creed concert (throwback Interference reference)


View attachment 23303

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Further use of the C word may result in banning

 

[mikal]

But what if, what if, what if I accidentally use the C word?

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

 

[allaras]

He’s pissed.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

It was some sort of Libertarian event, I have no idea why he was there. He got booed for what he said about guns and the NRA too.

Donnie is not used to getting booed, must have been awful for his gigantic ego.

 

[BEAL]

He isn’t liked outside of 30% of hardcore MAGA

When his team can’t astroturf an event, this is what happens.

I did get a kick out of his 3% insult to the group.

Biden gets under his skin too. And without an audience to hoot and holler during debates, he’ll malfunction there too

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

Gave up everything to save America? On Memorial Day weekend

Eric Trump Slammed For ‘Particularly Disgusting’ Memorial Day Weekend Post

"How dare you tweet this, THIS weekend," former GOP Rep. Adam Kinzinger fired back at Donald Trump's son.

www.huffpost.com

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

First of all, Matt Gaetz didn't "sleep with" a 17 year old. I believe that's called statutory rape.

As for how many other things are wrong about this man and his complete lack of integrity and his party its a very long list

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

Cadet Bone Spurs, making Memorial Day all about himself in yet another unhinged rant.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

idiots



the defense proved one of the prosecution's theories while trying to discredit cohen.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

this point needs to be made over and over and over again.



we can argue all day about Biden's policy when it comes to Israel and Gaza. what is inarguable is that the argument won't be allowed to even take place if Biden loses in November - and nothing will improve for the Palestinians. It would only get worse. For them. For everyone.

for the love of god - stop letting fucking perfection get in the way of good. shit... don't let good get in the way of passable, or even "shit but better than the alternative."

WE ALL WISH WE HAD OTHER CANDIDATES.

we don't.

this is what we have.

we saw the results of "well they're all the same so i'm going to stay home" in 2016.

swallow your fucking pride, put aside your ideals, grow up, and start supporting the guy who isn't awful before it's too late. the greater good depends upon it.

when civil rights are scaled back even further... when Oberfefell is next to be thrown out... will it make you feel better about your protest vote (or non vote)?

 

[BEAL]

this point needs to be made over and over and over again.



we can argue all day about Biden's policy when it comes to Israel and Gaza. what is inarguable is that the argument won't be allowed to even take place if Biden loses in November - and nothing will improve for the Palestinians. It would only get worse. For them. For everyone.

for the love of god - stop letting fucking perfection get in the way of good. shit... don't let good get in the way of passable, or even "shit but better than the alternative."

WE ALL WISH WE HAD OTHER CANDIDATES.

we don't.

this is what we have.

we saw the results of "well they're all the same so i'm going to stay home" in 2016.

swallow your fucking pride, put aside your ideals, grow up, and start supporting the guy who isn't awful before it's too late. the greater good depends upon it.

when civil rights are scaled back even further... when Oberfefell is next to be thrown out... will it make you feel better about your protest vote (or non vote)?

But they don’t care. They would rather see the world burn and suffer so as they too feel the pain they can always hold on to their view of being “right”

We see it with 2016 and Clinton. Well if you only would have put up a better candidate, we’d have done the right thing…..

Bibi and Putin are both hoping for a Trump
win. If that happens, Ukraine and Palestinians will be wiped off the face of the earth

 

[BEAL]

What does my head in is the virtue signaling online of “How can YOU ALL support this genocide!!”

I’m just like, i don’t support any of this. Stop yelling at me like 99.9% of Americans can do a fucking thing to stop it. Do they want us all to light ourselves on fire ?? Scream into our phones at how outraged we are ?

It’s up to our officials to figure out a way. And it’s an extremely complicated situation. The idea that USA just stops all Aid ends this madness….and doesn’t introduce new problems.

It boggles my mind that these same people scream about our country meddling in others affairs yet they want us to meddle and dominate this conflict that no one has solved

I trust Biden and his team are the reason Israel hasn’t committed worse atrocities….considering Hamas actually wants a genocide of Jews

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

I don't see what worse atrocities Israel could commit at this point. Bombing a tent full of civilians, it goes up in flames and people are carrying the charred remains of their loved ones and at least one man is carrying his beheaded baby. And this is on video.

And the govt of Israel calls it, what was it, an "unfortunate error"? Something like that.

And I AM voting for Biden. But the US funding and acceptance of such atrocities is morally repugnant to me, that's my moral standard not what I consider an ideal. Just basic human decency.

And yes 100 percent Hamas is morally repugnant, and 100 percent what they did on Oct 7th is too.

Biden is supposedly "working behind the scenes to have a cease fire". How many times does Netanyahu have to commit war crimes before Biden says enough is enough? That's my question. And yes I know, Hamas is a terrorist organization and they are morally repugnant to me too and they commit war crimes too. But Hamas is not the innocent civilians and children of Gaza. The number of children reported to be killed in Gaza is sickening beyond any words.

That video made me feel ill, enough is enough is enough.

I do believe that Trump would make the situation in Gaza even worse, yes I do believe that.

 

[BEAL]

Hamas has rejected multiple ceasefires and when Israel has rejected them it’s been said Hamas has changed the deal that was agreed upon

Hamas has no benefit to a ceasefire. They do not care about their people. The longer it goes on, the worse it gets for Israel.

Asking Biden to do something just seems like posturing. Cutting off aid seems like the popular choice but does that produce a ceasefire ?

The Arab world needs to put more pressure on Hamas as the West pressures Israel.

Unfortunately the Palestinians are nothing but pawns in this bullshit.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

Yes the Palestinian people are pawns, who knows how many tens of thousands of dead pawns including children. Even reliable sources for estimates can't accurately say.

I don't see asking Biden to do something (stop giving Israel the money and the weapons to carry this out) as "posturing". I'm not posturing, nope. I voted for the man so I think I have the right. The buck stops with Biden, the US government is doing what they're doing no denying the facts.

The elephant in the room is trying to balance losing the Jewish vote, I can't help but cynically see it that way. I believe that Joe Biden is a good man and should be doing the morally courageous thing over politics. Too much to ask I guess. Too naive.

 

[BEAL]

Correct. Biden stops aid and he’ll be torn apart by republicans and some democrats as abandoning Israel.

He is in a lose lose situation and i don’t know of any other president who would fare better. We know who would do worse….

I don’t agree with Israel dropping bombs in urban warfare. Hamas hides behind civilians. To me you gotta send in troops tho you’re gonna suffer casualties on your side.

While it’s not acceptable to lose any innocent life, there’s been what 40,000 deaths? And after revisions from non Hamas sources, about 20,000 deaths are Hamas….leaving a lot of dead innocent life.

But considering the landscape of how terrorists fight and hide, this is not a mass extinction of life by Israel. And it would be even less if they didn’t just drop 2000lbs as their means of attack

You’ve got two war criminals fighting to save THEIR lives, so nothing Biden can do except try and pressure Israel for new elections immediately is gonna help

 

[mikal]

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

one of the main issues with the situation in Gaza is that both sides have been caught lying on multiple occasions about what is actually happening on the ground. There's very little independent verification going on.

Hamas claims the last strike was within the humanitarian zone and was a direct hit. Israel says it was outside the humanitarian zone and the thing that actually caused the fire was exploding Hamas armaments.

I can remember the hospital strike from early on that caused all sorts of outrage - that ended up not being true at all. in that case Israel was correct and Hamas lied - and the world media just ran with it.

The fog of war causes misinformation under normal circumstances. We're now in a scenario where a) there's little to no independent verification on the ground, be that from the press or from the UN, and b) we're in an era where the slightest bit of misinformation gets amplified by a million.

It creates an unwinnable situation that's being exploited by both sides.

Israel today said they expect the war to continue through the end of the year. When I put my tin foil hat on, i could have readily predicted that. Israel would like to wipe them off the face of the earth. This issue divides the left. Trump will let him do what he wants.

And we're primed to let that happen.

The only hopes of any sort of viable solution for the Palestinian people involves Trump losing. The only hope of any sort of winnable solution for the Ukrainian people is Trump losing.

Protest votes against Biden will cause Trump to win.

I'm not sure why this is so hard.

 

[mikal]

The jury just asked for the transcript of the testimony from Cohen and Pecker on the Trump tower meeting. That’s a good sign considering the defenses argument was that that meeting wasn’t a catch and kill

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

they now want to rehear instructions.

my guess would be around the whole "you don't have to be unanimous on WHAT underlying crime he did, just unanimous that an underlying crime exists" part.

 

[mikal]

they now want to rehear instructions.

my guess would be around the whole "you don't have to be unanimous on WHAT underlying crime he did, just unanimous that an underlying crime exists" part.

Yeah, I'm not a legal expert but it sure seems like the 2 notes combined make it look really good for a conviction.

 

[mikal]

Another possibility that isn't as rosy is that there could be 11 jurors saying guilty and one hold out, but they could be putting the pressure on the holdout and having the testimony read back to him/her in efforts to convince them to go along.

 

[BEAL]

He’s either convicted of all or it’s a hung jury.

He won’t be acquitted

I am still hopeful that the DC trial can still happen this summer

 

[Irvine511]

Another possibility that isn't as rosy is that there could be 11 jurors saying guilty and one hold out, but they could be putting the pressure on the holdout and having the testimony read back to him/her in efforts to convince them to go along.

this so feels like the outcome to me, and i haven't been paying attention at all.

he gets away with murder, because people are afraid of actually indicting someone who was elected to the presidency, and because they fear his followers.

 

[mikal]

this so feels like the outcome to me, and i haven't been paying attention at all.

he gets away with murder, because people are afraid of actually indicting someone who was elected to the presidency, and because they fear his followers.

Well, it's more likely that they are being careful with everything and are about to convict. All the signs point to this right now, but there is the chance that they are amping up the pressure on one juror to go with "guilty", and in this case, that's also a good sign that they requested notes with substance. If you had one juror just crossing his arms and saying "nope, I've been a closet MAGA the whole time, and you can't change my mind", then they wouldn't be asking for this specific information.

So all in all, these developments are a positive.

 

[Diemen]

Having served on a jury with relatively low stakes (wrongful termination) where I thought the evidence clearly lead to a certain verdict, and being surprised at how many people on the jury thought it lead to the opposite verdict when we sat for deliberations, I'd be very careful about opining about what is or isn't more likely to happen based on what we can tell from the outside.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Having served on a jury with relatively low stakes (wrongful termination) where I thought the evidence clearly lead to a certain verdict, and being surprised at how many people on the jury thought it lead to the opposite verdict when we sat for deliberations, I'd be very careful about opining about what is or isn't more likely to happen based on what we can tell from the outside.

I've been on one jury that went to trial. It was a theft case, where a cop witnessed someone stealing the wallet from a foreign visitor (who had gone back home and couldn't testify). The wallet was found in the hoodie pocket of the defendant.

One guy refused to convict because there was no video evidence and "the cop could be lying."

Hung jury after two days.

I felt so bad for the ADA. It was such a low level and easy case and an absolute no brainer.

I lost a lot of faith in our system after that.

 

[allaras]

Hamas has rejected multiple ceasefires and when Israel has rejected them it’s been said Hamas has changed the deal that was agreed upon

Hamas has no benefit to a ceasefire. They do not care about their people. The longer it goes on, the worse it gets for Israel.

Asking Biden to do something just seems like posturing. Cutting off aid seems like the popular choice but does that produce a ceasefire ?

The Arab world needs to put more pressure on Hamas as the West pressures Israel.

Unfortunately the Palestinians are nothing but pawns in this bullshit.

Aid is voted on by Congress, so while Biden can not sign any aid bill to Israel and not push forward anything in the budget, they wisely tied the last one to Ukraine aid so that it eventually got passed. No aid to Israel/No aid to Ukraine. He’d also open up another avenue of attack by the GOP and moderates in his party by not “supporting” Israel.

Biden is damned either way.


As for Netanyahu, there’s no reason to come to a ceasefire/scale back the bombing for several reasons:
-US coverage in the UN
-maintaining power at home
- and my conspiracy theory is that he’d rather Biden look weak in not being able to restrain Israel/broker a ceasefire because he’d rather have Trump win in a November.
For Bibi, a Trump “do whatever you want” administration is better than a Biden “you have a right to do whatever you want , but maybe you shouldn’t, so let’s bring this to an end…” administration