financeguy
ONE love, blood, life
I think this is great. In fact, I encourage all crap muscians to 'Find God', hopefully then we won't have to listen to any of their shit music (Apart from U2 and Bob of course, their music is genuinely spiritual).
deep said:
Well,
let's hope he does not get lost again.
U2 - very capable, Korn... I doubt it.melon said:U2 is a great example of what I'm talking about. U2 "finding religion" nearly destroyed the band back in their early years, but they were able to realize that "finding religion" did not necessarily mean chucking it all. I wonder how many people are able to do what U2 did.
coemgen said:
I admit it may sound strange like you said. Why would anyone shift gears so suddenly? But that's a part of what Christianity is — living as Christ calls us to, or "following Christ" and his example. Instead of living the way the "world" lives, seeking money, fame, power, sex, etc. we seek to live a life that's different and one that honors God. Like Head said before, all these other things became like a god to him in a sense. That's the problem. We were made to worship God and have a relationship with him in the first place, but by being human, we've screwed it all up and we started "worshiping" money, power, sex etc. Head's realized that's an empty life, and now he's going after something different.
Irvine511 said:honestly, it doesn't. you went into an explanation of how you view God and Christ, and it's loaded with many assumptions that many (including other Christians) do not share.
i guess i want to know why Jesus Christ is required to live a good, moral life. as i understand them, the teachings of Christ are pretty basic -- do unto others, etc. it seems to me as if these are almost innate rules that become very helpful for us to simply survive and not kill each other, and as you say, to help us to live for more than money, sex, and power.
i just don't know why you need Jesus to do this. is a child in Calcutta, who is never exposed to the Christian message, then less worthy in the eyes of God? if a child born in Calcutta and a child born in Nebraska (who had given his life to Christ, as you described) were both to die, and both were to appear before God, would Johnny from Nebraska automatically be considered "better" in the eyes of God than little Amish?
i have few problems with the Jesus message, as i understand it, i do have a problem with the exclusivity to that message as so often claimed, particularly when it strikes me as almost, you know, kind of a bunch of "Duh!" rules. like, treat others as you would have been treated.
Irvine511 said:
as i understand them, the teachings of Christ are pretty basic -- do unto others, etc. it seems to me as if these are almost innate rules that become very helpful for us to simply survive and not kill each other, and as you say, to help us to live for more than money, sex, and power.
coemgen said:I never said you can't live a good life without Christ. That can happen, but so what. Who's to say it's good and is it good enough? That's what I was getting at.
A child in calcutta who's never heard the Christian message is no less worthy in God's eyes than anyone else, but that child, like the rest of us, will still be held accountable for his/her sins. Yes, she hasn't heard of Christ, but God is fair and just and will judge all of us according to what we have heard and what has been revealed to us. Those of us who have heard of Christ and what he offers will be held accountable for how we respond to it.
And you mentioned Christ's teachings, yes some of them are basic, but why do we have such a hard time keeping them? There's others that aren't so basic too. (and don't forget, the other commandments in the rest of the New Testament are from God as well, inspired by the Holy Spirit.)
What do you mean by exclusivity that the message is so often claimed with? Christ is the only way because of what he did on the cross and because he is God's son. We get to heaven by faith in all of this, not by just following his commands. Also, how was my explanation loaded with assumptions that many, including other Christians, don't share?
Headache in a Suitcase said:If this was a group that all of you liked... like, oh i don't know... The Edge leaving U2 to become a Jehova's Wittness... would you all be so accepting?
And you can't answer "Yes because that means The Edge might knock on my door " so don't even think about it.
The basic message is actually a tough one for me to live by. We're told not to judge others - yet this is something I often forget. We are told to love others - same thing. We're told to be perfect, I'm sure anyone on here knows I'm not, neither is anyone else. Seriously though - do you think I'm "good enough?" Because I don't. No way, dude. Taking all the times when I'm far from perfect - which is all the time if you think about it - makes me realize my own faults, and what I need to do to correct them in the future.Irvine511 said:what i meant by exclusivity is that the Jesus rules (for lack of a better term) can be found if you look at most religions.
i suppose my viewpoint is that all the stuff you claim is so important about Christ -- the cross, the pain, the perfection of his life, etc. -- is window dressing to what matters to me.
what matters is that i do unto others as i would have done unto me, and that i acknowledge that the material world of flesh and blood and bone isn't it. that i exist beyond my body, have something eternal within me, and that thing -- you might call it a soul -- is connected to a love and logic sewn into the fabric of everything.
that should be both good and good enough. why wouldn't it be?
what else matters other than that? why do we need to be obsessed with sin, with judgement, with standing before God? these all smell of such human-created scare tactics, and it's tough for me to imagine that God would really care if we break the Sabbath or not. really: why would God care?
what i often find to be the primary motivator in many interpretations of Christianity -- especially the more conservative ones -- is fear. fear of not getting into heaven, as if it's a prize to be won at the end of the school year.
Headache in a Suitcase said:If this was a group that all of you liked... like, oh i don't know... The Edge leaving U2 to become a Jehova's Wittness... would you all be so accepting?
And you can't answer "Yes because that means The Edge might knock on my door " so don't even think about it.
Well, he's already a Christian, so I don't know. I would think that he should still play music, he's such a gifted guy. I'd certainly be let down as a fan, but if I was in the right mind, I'd respect his decision anyways. By the way, Prince did this.Headache in a Suitcase said:If this was a group that all of you liked... like, oh i don't know... The Edge leaving U2 to become a Jehova's Wittness... would you all be so accepting?
And you can't answer "Yes because that means The Edge might knock on my door " so don't even think about it.