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Old 08-20-2007, 03:29 PM   #21
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While I personally don't believe symbols are the way to keep Christ's memory, it's flat out stupid to compare the cross to keeping an axe to remember someone getting murdered. Christ dying on the cross was done for the good of mankind, he did it intentionally as a sacrifice for people, so people remember the sacrifice by remembering the cross.
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Old 08-20-2007, 03:32 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond


Please explain why keeping a cross is essentail or demonstrates a healthy belief in Christ.
Ok, let's just remove the cross part of the story about Jesus, let's say he never went on the cross.

Your right, for me it changes nothing.

I don't need the crucification/ or resurrection to accept the things he said about charity and kindness and the examples of love and tolerance he set for us all to follow.


And I challenge everyone to say the same thing!
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Old 08-20-2007, 03:33 PM   #23
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originally quoted by deep
I don't need the crucification/ or resurrection to accept the things he said about charity and kindness and the examples of love and tolerance he sat for us all to follow.
I agree with you on that.

But why did Jesus make such a big emphasis on following him in order to "live"?
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Old 08-20-2007, 03:42 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by Pearl

But why did Jesus make such a big emphasis on following him in order to "live"?
I don't know that he did


I do believe that the powers that wanted to control "the church" by controlling what was in and not in the Bible hundreds of years after Jesus died,

well, it was in their interest to put in a lot of the "emphasis' to support their goals
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Old 08-20-2007, 03:44 PM   #25
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True, the church forgot what it was supposed to be about a very long time ago
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Old 08-20-2007, 04:12 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by Pearl
Catholics and Eastern Orthodox Christians will, but I doubt any Protestants bow to a cross.

To answer you're question (which is a good one), I would pick A. Heck, I have a portrait of Jesus hanging in my room. But I also have a collection of crosses on chain necklaces. I think you have to look at the history of Christianity, and to see why the cross evolved from a symbol of execution to a symbol of the religion. In the early days of Christianity, the fish was the symbol.

I don't know if your thinking is anti-Catholic, because I've known Catholics - and even a priest during mass - that questioned the use of a cross as a symbol of Christianity.
Bowing to a bare cross and bowing to a crucifix with Jesus' likeness on it are 2 different things though
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Old 08-20-2007, 04:15 PM   #27
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is it like the difference of bowing to a golden calf
and bowing to a bronze calf?
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Old 08-20-2007, 04:15 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond


Please explain why keeping a cross is essentail or demonstrates a healthy belief in Christ.
Who's saying it's essential ?

Who says it demonstrates a healthy belief in Christ ?

I've seen plenty of people wear crosses from a purely decorative aspect

Since the cornerstone of Christianity is the resurrection of Jesus from the dead after he died on the cross, I think it's self-explanatory as to why there is such a huge significance.......
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Old 08-20-2007, 04:34 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by toscano




I've seen plenty of people wear crosses from a purely decorative aspect

Since the cornerstone of Christianity is the resurrection of Jesus from the dead after he died on the cross, ....


If I saw a friend that died by the use of a weapon and came back to life I wouldn't keep a replica of the weapon that killed him in his rememberance.

I find ppl wearing a replica as of a weapon as decorative or in rememberance of somebody quite puzzling.

I think pictures, illustrations or replicating person's example on how he lived when alive would be a more appropiate way to celebrate that person's life.

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Old 08-20-2007, 05:07 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond
If I saw a friend that died by the use of a weapon and came back to life I wouldn't keep a replica of the weapon that killed him in his rememberance.

I find ppl wearing a replica as of a weapon as decorative or in rememberance of somebody quite puzzling.

I think pictures, illustrations or replicating person's example on how he lived when alive would be a more appropiate way to celebrate that person's life.

dbs
That's a terrible analogy.

How did Jesus live? He sacrificed. He gave himself to mankind. His sacrifice on the cross represents that.
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Old 08-20-2007, 05:34 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally posted by phillyfan26


That's a terrible analogy.

How did Jesus live? He sacrificed. He gave himself to mankind. His sacrifice on the cross represents that.
And in his rememberance I don't need a cross to remember him; I remember Him by sacraficing and helping others, even sacrificing my own time to occassionally respond your insipid posts.j/k

Now you're back on Ignore.

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Old 08-20-2007, 05:58 PM   #32
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Re: New Documentary About Jesus/The Muslim Perspective

Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
However, Patrick Sookhdeo, an Anglican canon and spokesman for the Barnabas Fund, which works with persecuted Christians, accused broadcasters of double standards. Mr Sookhdeo, who was born a Muslim and converted to Christianity in 1969, said: "How would the Muslim community respond if ITV made a programme challenging Muhammad as the last prophet?"

The Koran's denial of Jesus's divinity was "unacceptable". "On the last day the Koran says Jesus will destroy all the crosses. How can we praise that?"
What a ridiculous line of logic. The main difference in all of this is that Jesus' presence in the Koran was never meant to be denigrating or insulting. Islam's beliefs on Jesus are just that: their beliefs. And I presume that this is all that program is about: outlining Jesus' place in Islamic theology, which very few non-Muslims know about.

You can probably make the argument that religion has a tendency to try and tie in the theology of its ideological predecessors, and since Judaism and Christianity predated Islam, they wanted to include Jesus into their theology. Likewise, the Book of Revelation, in particular, is thought to have reappropriated what the Pharisees of the time thought the Messiah's First Coming was supposed to entail, which, in itself, was reappropriated from Zoroastrian eschatology before it.
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Old 08-20-2007, 07:11 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep
is it like the difference of bowing to a golden calf
and bowing to a bronze calf?
yes.......

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Old 08-20-2007, 07:13 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond




If I saw a friend that died by the use of a weapon and came back to life I wouldn't keep a replica of the weapon that killed him in his rememberance.

I find ppl wearing a replica as of a weapon as decorative or in rememberance of somebody quite puzzling.

I think pictures, illustrations or replicating person's example on how he lived when alive would be a more appropiate way to celebrate that person's life.

dbs
In your eyes, is the only thing of significance that happened on the cross that some guy was killed ?
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Old 08-20-2007, 07:19 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally posted by toscano


In your eyes, is the only thing of significance that happened on the cross that some guy was killed ?
No.
I worship the risen Christ.

dbs
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Old 08-20-2007, 07:24 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond


No.
Then you ARE aware of the significance, good !

you make it sound like other religions worship the symbol of the cross or Christ on the crucifix, really shows little understanding of what they are about.

Ah, what the heck, it's just cult A vs. cult B anyway.........

"being gay is a choice"
"dinosaurs walked the earth with man"
"Water is actually Na+H2O3"
"the earth is flat, wait, better hold that thought..."
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Old 08-20-2007, 07:50 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by toscano


Then you ARE aware of the significance, good !

..."
It's just how we remember him is all.


dbs
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Old 08-20-2007, 08:35 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond


And in his rememberance I don't need a cross to remember him; I remember Him by sacraficing and helping others, even sacrificing my own time to occassionally respond your insipid posts.j/k

Now you're back on Ignore.

dbs
And what did I say earlier? I said I don't need to remember Jesus that way either. All I said was that it's not ANYTHING like your axe analogy.
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Old 08-20-2007, 11:12 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep





If I were Jesus
I would not be too fond of crosses.
Indeed. The cross is a symbol of defeat and I really have no idea why it was chosen as Christ's symbol.
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Old 08-20-2007, 11:23 PM   #40
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I would hardly call the cross a symbol of defeat in Christian theology.
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