Why You Shouldn't Blame U2

[yimou]

The more and more I read the more I think U2 are purely out to maximise on a profit. They weren't ripping off the ordinary punter selling these memberships, they were ripping off their most loyal fans. They were also ripping off those same fans when they released those different versions of HTDAAB and that Vertigo single, they knew those fans would be a copy of each or 2 copies of the most expensive box set (I know a friend who buys one U2 album to keep in his I-never-listen-to- this- U2- album shelf and keeps one for listening to).

I also want to laugh everytime someone sticks up for U2 thinking all they care about is their fans and they really only care about keeping their fans happy. Wake up and smell the coffee folks, U2 didn't go out promoting that new album just for their fans benefit, they did that so people would buy it and they could get new fans i.e. to make money. It may not all be U2's fault that things have gone wrong but ticketmaster had nothing to do with taking $40 from U2 fans to sign up to U2.com and making a handsome profit from it.

well said,,, Couldn´t agree more..

 

[Laura M]

I guess you stopped buying their music with Achtung Baby singles, then. And the album Pop.
(box set was aimed, obviously, at new fans. no sense in buying that if you have all the albums, and in the age of internet it's not that hard to get the unreleased songs anyway)
Did you also know the band was guaranteed 100 million dollars profit from their promotor on Popmart tour? I suppose that was your last tour, no wait, that would be Zoo TV with the merchandise and the first-time openly posh lifestyle and big expenses, or Joshua Tree with the movie and the book.

Yes, U2 makes money with their music. It started the day the signed a record deal and sold their first copy of Boy.

I was 6 when AB was released. I was 11 during the popmart tour i.e. too young acc. to my parents to go to concerts. JT? I was 3.

I know they make money. do they try to swindle even more than they could from fans? Definately.

 

[U2girl]

I wasn't specifically talking about you, but we all know several singles/albums versions did not start with Vertigo/HTDAAB, nor did the profit-making on the tour start with this tour.

They only swindle as much as you give them.

 

[Laura M]

sorry, you quoted what i said. my mistake.

 

[Matthew_Page2000]

It seems like there are two extreme views here:

2. U2 are greedy bastards and they have lost all the integrity they once had. They don't give a shit about their most loyal fans, and they are intentionally trying to rip us off.

Sounds about right to me.

 

[Party Boy]

oh for gods sake. This is getting ridiculous. Some people are taking this way too personally! Ultimately its about the music. I don't really give two craps about what the band say or do off stage or off record.
If your willing to give all that the music means to you and promise never to buy another U2 record because of some perceived cock-up over tickets then go ahead!

Incredile reactions going on in this forum right now

 

[fmattyh]

It seems like there are two extreme views here:

1. It's not U2's fault, it's all about the big business and they are the victims as much as we are

2. U2 are greedy bastards and they have lost all the integrity they once had. They don't give a shit about their most loyal fans, and they are intentionally trying to ripp us off.

I think the truth is somewhere in between. It seems like many people are acting out of emotion and without knowing all the facts when they are literally saying they are giving up on their favourite band.

I don't think that the band did this on purpose, and I don't think they wanted this whole fiasco to happen. But they are clearly responsible ultimately for outsourcing their fanclub to Ticketmaster. Yes, Ticketmaster is the mafia of showbusiness, but we've all known that for a while, and so did U2. They should have known this would happen, so they clearly owe us an apology, and they better fix this for the future.

This is exactly right, IMO. I think U2 management is to blame for relying on Ticketmaster and creating this U2.com joke, but U2 is to blame for not taking an active role in their management. Did U2 - the band: Larry, Adam, Bono, and the Edge - purposely try to screw people out of their money? I don't think so. Did U2 - the corporation - do this? That's much more probable.

And once again, can anyone tell me where this 26,000 tickets figure came from? And whether this includes Europe or just the U.S.?

 

[indigo tree]

I agree with oceane. Too many people are jumping to conclusions that U2 are doing this on purpose. For some reason I honestly cannot image Bono, Edge, Larry and Adam sitting around saying, "Ok, whats the best way to fuck with our fans minds?" I know! We'll only put 26,000 tickets on presale, even though we have over 100,000 members!" However, U2 are to blame for sticking with Ticketmaster.

 

[rjhbonovox]

I agree with oceane. Too many people are jumping to conclusions that U2 are doing this on purpose. For some reason I honestly cannot image Bono, Edge, Larry and Adam sitting around saying, "Ok, whats the best way to fuck with our fans minds?" I know! We'll only put 26,000 tickets on presale, even though we have over 100,000 members!" However, U2 are to blame for sticking with Ticketmaster.

Why wouldn't they. I think Bono's masterplan to raise enough money for his African cause is by selling concert tickets for £150 each.

 

[jick]

Ultimately its about the music. I don't really give two craps about what the band say or do off stage or off record.

Their music is manufactured nowadays to sell the greatest number and maximize profit while compromising artistic integrity (not that they had much of that to begin with anyway).

Cheers,

J

 

[PurpleSeven]

...I honestly cannot image Bono, Edge, Larry and Adam sitting around saying, "Ok, whats the best way to fuck with our fans minds?" I know! We'll only put 26,000 tickets on presale, even though we have over 100,000 members!"

Of course this converstation never occured - but as this is a business (and their can not be the utopian ideals of how it's about the music) the responsibility for the actions of this organization rest solely with the five chief officers - Bono, Adam Larry, Edge and Paul.

They can not escape their roles within the organization. How is it any different than any other company? We attempt to hold our corporate leaders responsible if there are inexcusible deeds committed within the company, so why should we not hold the executives of U2 resonsible? Because they are 'U2'?

It's called corporate responsibility, and U2 and their employees are not displaying it. They are de-legitimizing the spirit that surrounds their music. Their neo-pacifist beliefs in a time in which more pacifism is needed are being overshadowed by the machine of their organization.

I have been a hard-core complete fan of theirs for the better part of 17 years. When people have asked me why it is that I have devoted so much time/money/etc. to this band, my response has been because I see in them something much bigger than just verse-chorus-verse. There has been a feeling - which has continually been perpetuated from the band - that it is about something bigger than us.

They have stood against violence, against racism, against torture, against hate against self-destruction in song. In life, they have stood against polution, and for the rights of prisoners of conscience.

Now, 25 years into it, when their organization makes a series of wildly bad decisions, we are supposed to think, 'Well, that's how it is - and we've got to accept it.'

Bullshit. It is this type of thinking that stands in absolute contrast against everything that the band, and Bono in particular fights against at all times. Look at the news today - where's Bono? Fighting against laissez-faire attitudes by the worlds richest countries.

As his fight is the good fight, and must be won - ours is the good fight too. We are not wrong! This is not just a small fiasco that too will blow over in time, this is something that is changing long-held perceptions in me - and that is something that a week ago I wouldn't have thought possible.

I do not expect the boys in the band to walk on water, I do expect them to treat their fans with the respect they deserve.

 

[firstlove]

first of all, the band itself isnt to blame for the problem. they are to blame for not doing enough to stop the problem from happening. very simply. they made many mistakes, especially having a WEBSITE membership cost $40. yes, U2 made mistakes. they're human, like the rest of us. they sometimes let things fly past when they should be paying more attn. (havent you forgotten something while in a rush???) yes, they did things wrong. everyone does. you know this is just the same as people getting mad at the pleba girls for considering the band members to be perfect. there are a bunch of whiny fans who think that U2 should have everything perfectly planned. they cant, deal with it.

people are letting TICKET SALES & two stupid websites get in the way of the music, which is the point. which is why we love U2. and jick, dont let me even get started on you.

I'm sick and tired of people who keep letting their emotions get in the way of whats important. everyone's acting like such children because they cant get exactly what they want.

 

[PurpleSeven]

I'm sick and tired of people who keep letting their emotions get in the way of whats important. everyone's acting like such children because they cant get exactly what they want.

I don't believe that this can be equated to behaving childish, or being over-emotional. This is business. I'm expecting them to behave in the same manner that I would expect all multi-million (perhaps billion) dollar/multi-national company to act. In a way that is not decieving, or fradulent to its customers - and with honesty.

Trust me, I don't believe the majority of large corporations act in this way, but I don't believe that U2 is just any ordianary corporation.

Any company that would hold itself and promote itself as being as intertwined with social issues as U2 has been would expect the same backlash if it were found that they were somehow involved with a scheme that could be seen as not on the up and up.

This situation is not the same as a single person forgetting something in a rush - there are layers upon layers of decision makers and decision making processess that occur with an organization the size of theirs. They're not running this thing out of a van by the River Liffey, and the attitude of 'shit happens' doesn't work for me - nor should it have to work for me.

 

[Ron2112]

I don't think that the band did this on purpose, and I don't think they wanted this whole fiasco to happen. But they are clearly responsible ultimately for outsourcing their fanclub to Ticketmaster. Yes, Ticketmaster is the mafia of showbusiness, but we've all known that for a while, and so did U2. They should have known this would happen, so they clearly owe us an apology, and they better fix this for the future.

I agree with this post 100%. The main gripe is that anyone in the band or front office paying attention could have seen this coming. The fact that they didn't means that there's some degree of disinterest within the U2 camp. Hopefully, the band is going to make this right down the road, either by fixing the ticket problem or by offering something else to those who shelled out their $40.

Peace,
Ron

 

[Ron2112]

I don't think its possible to compare U2 with the Grateful Dead (or most bands in fact) when it comes to buying tickets mainly because communication and ways to buy tickets - internet, mobile phone, a lot more scalpers around - have increased incomparably. Also, while Grateful Dead might have appealed to a cultural movement, U2 generally cross many cultural boundaries and in my opinion are much more widely popular.

Hey....here in the U.S. the Grateful Dead were playing sold-out shows at multiple dates in each city they went to in the 70s and 80s. And they didn't have these problems.

But your post kind of makes my point. U2 is arguably the biggest concert draw on the planet in the age of the Internet, cell phones, scalpers, etc. They should be anticipating this problem and figuring out ways to protect the fans. It isn't rocket science, and other bands have been successful at it before. Especially when you consider that Bono has ben harping about scalpers at concerts since 1984....

Peace,
Ron

 

[ulove2]

Shit happens, let's move on

 

[kobayashi]

Big corporate money rules my dear. With Bush in the White House the Clear Channels and TMs are not going away and any investigation is quickly wrapped up and brushed aside.

i dont know how much the resident in the white house matters. john kerry, or anyone else, 'eligible' of coming within a mile of the white house wouldn't do anything about it either-they, much like U2 in this situation, are incapable.

this situation is quite frustrating for all. however, to 'blame' U2 for this seems mostly misguided.

U2 are a product within a brand. to think this has been a cash grab by the 4 men who make up the band and their manager is laughable.

so many have their hands in the pot on this i would think the voice of the band would be drowned.

much anger stems from fans contrasting present day monolithic, corporatized U2 with the band that waved the white flag.

consider that the corporate entertainment landscape is vastly different than it was when U2 formed their image.

 

[PurpleSeven]

much anger stems from fans contrasting present day monolithic, corporatized U2 with the band that waved the white flag.

You're right. I believe the reason that they don't wave the white flags during the shows anymore is that they no there's no way that they could in their present form - becuase it's not who they are.

What I am wondering is whether or not I really like the band as it is now - or if I'm holding on to something that was true ten or fifteen years ago. It almost seems like them, along with their organization is impotent to standing up for what is right. They have a fear of offending anyone (particularly their accountants) - their continued homogenezation marches on.

If they can give up the fight, then I guess it's time for me to do the same. Bring on the Michael Bolton and Yanni!!

Sometimes progress is a bitch.

 

[Salome]

you can love Achtung Baby to death
you can think Joshua Tree is the best album by any band ever
hell, you can even masturbate over POP 3 times a week as far as I care, but to act like U2 as an organisation acts a lot different now then they did back then you're kidding yourself

I can agree with people who think they're greedy
I can agree with people who think they're not
but I don't understand who pretend like U2 changed

 

[caylan]

I ran into similar troubles with pre-sales and a BRAND new Clear Channel venue when Rush went on tour last year. First in line, I ended up in the back row and just scratched my head! I was instantly suspicous. I did a great deal of research and I have to say, there is a lot of truth to this article.

This makes a great deal of sense, not that I'm an expert, but it sure hits home.

The evil alliance is: TRicketmaster & ClearChannel.

ClearChannel controls radio play & concert venues & gives every1 up front guarantees.

TricketMaster is their ticket allocation machine.

 

[-macphisto-]

I found this quote from Bono on the internet, thought I should post it-

" Its bloody madness you know, we are sick and tired of Ticketmaster, we had no idea this would happen, they are corrupt and we must stop them. At the moment we are devising a plan to boycott Ticketmaster to be able to distribute tickets to all fans at an equal and fair price. I cant believe the news today, and i cant close my eyes and make it go away buy as God as my witness we will get to the promised land together." BONO

 

[-macphisto-]

Ticketmaster is the enemy, but U2 can do a thing about it, it all depends on them, if theyd just stand up against corruption, adn have the William Wallace heart I know they have!

 

[Flying FuManchu]

I found this quote from Bono on the internet, thought I should post it-

" Its bloody madness you know, we are sick and tired of Ticketmaster, we had no idea this would happen, they are corrupt and we must stop them. At the moment we are devising a plan to boycott Ticketmaster to be able to distribute tickets to all fans at an equal and fair price. I cant believe the news today, and i cant close my eyes and make it go away buy as God as my witness we will get to the promised land together." BONO

Uhmmmm.... when and where was that quote made? JT era U2 or Achtung era U2?

 

[fmattyh]

I found this quote from Bono on the internet, thought I should post it-

" Its bloody madness you know, we are sick and tired of Ticketmaster, we had no idea this would happen, they are corrupt and we must stop them. At the moment we are devising a plan to boycott Ticketmaster to be able to distribute tickets to all fans at an equal and fair price. I cant believe the news today, and i cant close my eyes and make it go away buy as God as my witness we will get to the promised land together." BONO

Oh man, I wish. But wouldn't be good business sense to badmouth a company you have an agreement with. Then again, if you don't plan on working with them in the future..........

I can't see them saying something quite that intense, but I would like to hear something from the band rather than Paul or U2.com or whatever.

 

[plot180]

Regarding whether or not U2 should be blamed, I think it comes down to who hired Ticketbastard and FanFuck in the first place. I very seriously doubt they were hired without U2's consent. Therefore, blame must get placed at the top of the chain of command, that being U2. If they didn't think Ticketbastard wouldn't do something completely foul and corrupt if given the chance, then the members of U2 are nowhere near as smart as I'd been led to believe.

 

[indra]

Oh man, I wish. But wouldn't be good business sense to badmouth a company you have an agreement with. Then again, if you don't plan on working with them in the future..........

I can't see them saying something quite that intense, but I would like to hear something from the band rather than Paul or U2.com or whatever.

In a sense that's what make it so sad for me...that they wouldn't and won't say anything that intense. I know that's not the way one becomes the biggest band in the world, but I rather like my bands to be quixotic. To me, rock and roll (well, the type I like to hear anyway) is the very definition of quixotic -- "foolishly impractical especially in the pursuit of ideals; especially : marked by rash lofty romantic ideas or extravagantly chivalrous action."

U2 is very pragmatic, often making deals with the devil, so to speak, and I can understand that (especially in light of their goals), but that's so "real world".... But I rather like the rash, lofty idealists.