POP! as it was intended

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MrBrau1 said:


They cut the guitar solo out. You think it makes it stronger?
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Which guitar solo? The original studio version of Gone doesn't have a solo?

The only thing I wish they had left there was what Larry plays just before that slow part starts! That should have stayed. :grumpy:
 
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TheBrazilianFly said:


Which guitar solo? The original studio version of Gone doesn't have a solo?

The only thing I wish they had left there was what Larry plays just before that slow part starts! That should have stayed. :grumpy:
Click to expand...

3:18-3:40. Under Bono's vocal Edge plays one of his best solos.
 
MrBrau1 said:


They cut the guitar solo out. You think it makes it stronger?
Click to expand...

I assume you mean the live solo? Well... the new mix is still a vast improvement over the Pop version that had no solo. I also like the fact that Edge's backing vocals are in there. It would have been nice if U2 played the new mix the way they do it live, but at least you've got something to look forward to when they do play it live. It's not just a regurgitation of the album, which would be boring. I think something similar will happen with Love and Peace or Else when they play it on the tour. That song is just too cool not to add a longer solo to the end of it.

Edit: Okay, I see where you're coming from in your response to TheBrazillianFly. But it's so quiet that you basically forget about it. They could have cranked Edge's amp up to 11 on the Pop version, but they didn't, so we're not really missing anything. Also, it's not really a solo. I'd classify that as halfway between a riff and a solo.
 
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MrBrau1 said:
I miss it.
Click to expand...

Meh. It's one of those things that, to me, doesn't make or break the song. It's great stuff by Edge, but it doesn't bother me that they left it out, because as a whole, the new mix has the extra oomph that the album version was missing.
 
MrBrau1 said:


3:18-3:40. Under Bono's vocal Edge plays one of his best solos.
Click to expand...

I never saw that as a solo since Bono sings over it, more like effects that suited that moment better or something but yeah I understand. I think the Best Of Mix was to sound more to what they play live rather than a perfect combination of live and studio. But in a way this is good for the new fan that is just finding those songs out, he is going to have many versions to fall in love with. But it would have been interesting to have that part on the new mix... maybe someone from Interference could do that and add that drum part I talked about that is missing and that can be found on the original version.... :hmm:
 
Well, the music may have more oomph...but the lacking vocal costs the song a lot. Bono's voice is a lot stronger now than it was then, and even on Pop it was stronger than when they did the Best of...that must have been his vocal low...

As far as the other 2 Pop songs that they did on the Best of...Staring is interresting but not as good as the original, and of course the acoustic is the best.
Discotheque...I would like the New Mix better IF they had kept Boom-cha! I cannot live without Boom-cha!

The new version of Numb is better, but thats Zooropa.

I don't like the idea of putting City on Pop. There may have been a version that they were kicking around back then, but obviously it was only finished recently. Also, why put a song on an album thats already on another album? If I want to hear songs from Atomic Bomb, I do own 3 copies of that album, I don't need to turn to Pop for that...
 
GibsonGirl said:


Meh. It's one of those things that, to me, doesn't make or break the song. It's great stuff by Edge, but it doesn't bother me that they left it out, because as a whole, the new mix has the extra oomph that the album version was missing.
Click to expand...

The new mix would only be better if it were there.
 
I think the mix of Discotheque is better than the first one.

Make Mofo shorter, it's too long. They cut a verse in the live version, why not in a mix or something?
 
I think Holy Joe could fit by Discotheque and Do You Feel Loved? easily, both r very rockin songs and start the album w/ a bang
 
MrBrau1 said:
3:18-3:40. Under Bono's vocal Edge plays one of his best solos.
Click to expand...
Uh, it, by definition, isn't a solo if another part is more prominent.


Regarding which tracks make sense for inclusion on a revisionist Pop:

All the single versions ("Discotheque," "Last Night On Earth," "Please," "If God Will Send His Angels") are eligible.

The "Dirty Day" remixes don't make sense since they were mainly Butch Vig's projects and not the band's (not to mention that the "canon" version of the song is already on an album).

Other remixes from the period (any "Discotheque" and "Mofo" remixes) also don't make sense for inclusion since, again, they are musically mostly the work of the remixer. They're also usually much more dance-oriented than anything that'd make an album.

"I'm Not Your Baby" and "North and South of the River" are eligible, despite that they're collaborations (but so was "Love Rescue Me," and it made an album). I think they'd both fit in well musically too.

"Slow Dancing" works too if the Willie Nelson version was recorded in 1997 (although it wouldn't really fit in).

"Holy Joe" is eligible, the Garage Mix moreso than the Guilty Mix (the Garage Mix seems to be considered the normal version; it's how they played it live, for instance), although it might be too much of a straightforward rock song for the album (even "Last Night On Earth" and "Gone" were much spacier than it).

I wouldn't consider "Pop Muzik" and "Happiness Is A Warm Gun," though, since they never include studio covers on their albums.

"Hold Me, Thrill Me, Kiss Me, Kill Me" and "Two Shots of Happy, One Shot of Sad" were both recorded in 1995, so you could argue their eligibility. I'd argue against it, though.

"Big Girls Are Best" and "City of Blinding Lights" aren't eligible because they weren't finished until other albums.

I honestly wouldn't include the Best of remixes of "Discotheque," "Staring at the Sun," and "Gone" since they were made so long after the album was released (especially considering that new parts were recorded for them), but I guess that's the point of this exercise. I find the "Staring at the Sun" remix particularly flat (the original mix was one of the more complete-feeling songs on the album anyway).

I haven't heard the iTunes stuff (downloading it now), so I dunno if any of it's "complete" enough.
 
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typhoon said:

Uh, it, by definition, isn't a solo if another part is more prominent.
Click to expand...

It's not the chorus riff, or the verse riff, or the bridge riff. It's a 22 second part, so it's too long to be considered a fill. So, um, what would you call it?
 
You can't dumb down every guitar part in a song to "a riff" or "a solo." It's just a fancy variant of the chorus part that he does for the last chorus.

But it's definitely not a solo if it's done during the chorus (and no one would consider it a fill either, regardless of length, since, again, it's being played during the most prominent part of the entire song).

Do you call it a drum solo if you happen to like the drum part during a (real) guitar solo?
 
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typhoon said:
You can't dumb down every guitar part in a song to "a riff" or "a solo." It's just a fancy variant of the chorus part that he does for the last chorus.

But it's definitely not a solo if it's done during the chorus.
Click to expand...

:yes:

New Year's Day has a solo. Even Better Than the Real Thing has a solo. The Fly has a solo. The studio version of Gone does not have a solo. As I said before, it's not really a riff and it's not really a solo - it's a combination of the two. And the fact that it doesn't stand out implies that it wasn't meant to. Guitar solos generally tend to stand out so I really don't think that the section can be classified as one.
 
typhoon said:
You can't dumb down every guitar part in a song to "a riff" or "a solo." It's just a fancy variant of the chorus part that he does for the last chorus.

But it's definitely not a solo if it's done during the chorus.

Do you call it a drum solo if you happen to like the drum part during a (real) guitar solo?
Click to expand...

A fancy guitar part that's 22 seconds long and starts in the bridge? Is never repeated anywhere else in the song? Do you ID a guitar solo as only the guitar playing? It's a solo. I'm sorry the presence of vocals throws you off.
 
GibsonGirl said:


:yes:

New Year's Day has a solo. Even Better Than the Real Thing has a solo. The Fly has a solo. The studio version of Gone does not have a solo. As I said before, it's not really a riff and it's not really a solo - it's a combination of the two. And the fact that it doesn't stand out implies that it wasn't meant to. Guitar solos generally tend to stand out so I really don't think that the section can be classified as one.
Click to expand...

Well, it's a solo.
 
MrBrau1 said:
A fancy guitar part that's 22 seconds long and starts in the bridge? Is never repeated anywhere else in the song?
Click to expand...
Yes, exactly. It is not uncommon for the guitar to be less restrained during the final chorus. It's also a variant of the main riff and supports the chorus (solos don't support jack).

"In music, solo means to play alone. This does not necessarily mean that no one else is playing at that time, only that the soloist's part is the most prominent."

(from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solo_(music))

When it says that other people can be playing, that means Adam and Larry.

Edge's part is not nearly as prominent as Bono's. It is not a solo.

I'm sorry you're sorry.
 
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MrBrau1 said:


Well, it's a solo.
Click to expand...

:banghead:

No, it isn't! As a general rule, guitar solos consist of more than four notes! To prove the point, here is just a general overview of the notes Edge is playing:

Code: 
e|---------------------------|
B|--11-----11--9-------------|
G|------8----------6--6/8----|
D|---------------------------|
A|---------------------------|
E|---------------------------|

AND HE PLAYS IT OVER AND OVER AGAIN. At one point, he plays a TINY portion of the main riff, before going into those same four notes again. IT IS NOT A SOLO!
 
typhoon said:

Yes, exactly. It is not uncommon for the guitar to be less restrained during the final chorus. It's also a variant of the main riff and supports the chorus (solos don't support jack).

"In music, solo means to play alone. This does not necessarily mean that no one else is playing at that time, only that the soloist's part is the most prominent."

(from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solo_(music))

When it says that other people can be playing, that means Adam and Larry.

Edge's part is not nearly as prominent as Bono's. It is not a solo.

I'm sorry you're sorry.
Click to expand...

Going to the dictionary eh. weak.
 
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GibsonGirl said:


:banghead:

No, it isn't! As a general rule, guitar solos consist of more than four notes! To prove the point, here is just a general overview of the notes Edge is playing:

Code: 
e|---------------------------|
B|--11-----11--9-------------|
G|------8----------6--6/8----|
D|---------------------------|
A|---------------------------|
E|---------------------------|

AND HE PLAYS IT OVER AND OVER AGAIN. At one point, he plays a TINY portion of the main riff, before going into those same four notes again. IT IS NOT A SOLO!
Click to expand...

Wrong. What's you piece of tab supposed to prove? You didn't even hear the part until i mentioned it earlier in this thread.
 
MrBrau1 said:


Wrong. What's you piece of tab supposed to prove? You didn't even hear the part until i mentioned it earlier in this thread.
Click to expand...

The tab proves the fact that it is NOT a solo. Here is a tab of a real solo (tabbed by someone else at the guitar archive):

Code: 
e-----------------------------------------------------------------------
B--20--20--19--15--17(hold)s/---------------20--20--19--15--12(hold)s/--
G-----------------------------------------------------------------------

e------------------------------------------------------------------------
B---20--19--15--17--20--20--19--15--------15--15--14--14--12--12--10--10-
G------------------------------------------------------------------------

e------------------------------------------------------------------------
B--8--8--7--7--5--5--3--3s/5----------s/10--9--7--5------s/10--9--7--9---
G------------------------------------------------------------------------

e------------------------------------------------------------------------
B-13b(14)-13b(14)--13b(14)--13b(14)--s/14--14-12-12-12s/10--10s/9--9h10--9-7-
G----------------------------------------------------------------------------

e--------------------------------------------------------------------------
B--5---5h7---s/9--7--5--7--7s/9--7--5--5h7--7s/9--7--5h7-----5--5--7--7--9--9
G----------------------------------------------------------------------------

e-----------------------------------------------
B--10--10--12--12--14--14--15--15--17--17-------
G-----------------------------------------------

And you know why I didn't even recognize the part you indicated? BECAUSE IT ISN'T A SOLO. Solos stand out. That section is so forgettable and QUIET in the mix, that I hardly think twice about it when I'm listening to the song. It just melds into the rest of the music.
 
GibsonGirl said:


The tab proves the fact that it is NOT a solo. Here is a tab of a real solo (tabbed by someone else at the guitar archive):

Code: 
e-----------------------------------------------------------------------
B--20--20--19--15--17(hold)s/---------------20--20--19--15--12(hold)s/--
G-----------------------------------------------------------------------

e------------------------------------------------------------------------
B---20--19--15--17--20--20--19--15--------15--15--14--14--12--12--10--10-
G------------------------------------------------------------------------

e------------------------------------------------------------------------
B--8--8--7--7--5--5--3--3s/5----------s/10--9--7--5------s/10--9--7--9---
G------------------------------------------------------------------------

e------------------------------------------------------------------------
B-13b(14)-13b(14)--13b(14)--13b(14)--s/14--14-12-12-12s/10--10s/9--9h10--9-7-
G----------------------------------------------------------------------------

e--------------------------------------------------------------------------
B--5---5h7---s/9--7--5--7--7s/9--7--5--5h7--7s/9--7--5h7-----5--5--7--7--9--9
G----------------------------------------------------------------------------

e-----------------------------------------------
B--10--10--12--12--14--14--15--15--17--17-------
G-----------------------------------------------

And you know why I didn't even recognize the part you indicated? BECAUSE IT ISN'T A SOLO. Solos stand out. That section is so forgettable and QUIET in the mix, that I hardly think twice about it when I'm listening to the song. It just melds into the rest of the music.
Click to expand...

You're silly.
 
MrBrau1 said:


You're silly.
Click to expand...

This discussion is silly. I've been playing the guitar for a long time now, so I think I'm a fairly good judge of what is a solo and what isn't. If you want to believe that what can only be classified as a glorified riff is a solo, then do so. I'm not going to waste any more time on this.

Have a nice day. :wave:
 
GibsonGirl said:


This discussion is silly. I've been playing the guitar for a long time now, so I think I'm a fairly good judge of what is a solo and what isn't. If you want to believe that what can only be classified as a glorified riff is a solo, then do so. I'm not going to waste any more time on this.

Have a nice day. :wave:
Click to expand...

I've been playing the guitar for 10 years. It's a solo.
 
GibsonGirl said:


:yes:

New Year's Day has a solo. Even Better Than the Real Thing has a solo. The Fly has a solo. The studio version of Gone does not have a solo. As I said before, it's not really a riff and it's not really a solo - it's a combination of the two. And the fact that it doesn't stand out implies that it wasn't meant to. Guitar solos generally tend to stand out so I really don't think that the section can be classified as one.
Click to expand...

I agree. :up: I just listened to Gone again a couple times and I don't see that as a solo at all. I only consider solo's to be something that stands out by itself, hence the word solo. Bono's voice is meant to be the prominant "instrument" here, not the guitar riff.
 
Hola amigos :wave:

As I said before, I never believed Pop was "unfinished". I still think many fans believe that just because U2 said that:censored:

I´m sure if the band would have said "ATYCLB is unfinished" every fan would be talking about how unfinished is ATYCLB.

Pop is Pop because it was the last U2 ALBUM for me ( I don´t know if you don´t get me wrong, but for me an ALBUM doesn´t mean 11 or 12 putting togheter, like ATYCLB or HTDAAB )

Every "new mix" from Best of 1990 - 2000 is a disaster :madspit: :down: :tsk:. Single versions from the songs are great :yes:

I think the album was released as it was intended, really.
 
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