Moment Of Surrender is overrated thread

[ozeeko]

i was playing this song the other night in my car with a friend who vehemently hates U2, and he actually asked "what is this? it's pretty cool" When I told him who it was he almost shit himself. "WHAT? ARE YOU SERIOUS? THIS IS U-FUCKING-U2?"

 

[MMP]

I love when things like that happen.

 

[buzzkill27]

You know it just goes to show the obvious....that we all have very different tastes...even critics when reviewing NLOTH some that have slagged off the album have said things like "If there were more organic songs like MOS blah,blah blah...this album would have been great" and other critics who love the album have pointed to this song as a weak point..."U2 by numbers" I think one critic said,it just goes to show............

YOU CANT PLEASE ALL OF THE PEOPLE ALL OF THE TIME

BTW my two cents.....Moment of Surrender = a very moving,soulful,beautiful song
Emotive Bono not Emo Bono

 

[sue4u2]

Again, what do you hope to accomplish with the thread? Kill the buzz for those who rate it higher than you do, give those people an education? It's condescending and disrespectful.

Thank you..
(with one exception, Magnificent is seriously, magnificent.)

I don't think Magnificent is the best (or 2nd best) song on the album either. So don't pigeonhole me as some Eno-hating hyperactive idiot who can't listen to a 7 minute ballad because it doesn't have a 2 minute shred solo.

The thread is simply pointing out my view (and it would seem others) that MoS (while a decent song) is not the song it was heralded as being.
While backing such statements with reasons why it doesn't hold up to some of their earlier ballads.

Well said.. but just your opinion (and others) - not fact. We who like it are not idiots either.. we see, but thank you non the less.
Some of the earlier ballards can't and will not EVER!! be heralded again.
Doesn't mean something new can't be considered GREAT!!
Get over us loving it. k..

I love when things like that happen.

I know what you mean!!

 

[dalivoxhewson]

sorry I'm new to posting on here. can someone tell me how to change 'babyface' to something more appropriate and how to put up a pic. and just for good measure again. MOS is weird and beautiful. there I'm still on topic.

 

[razredge]

Winter seems to be a better ballad than MoS, more interesting.

I'm sure a finished version would be fantastic.

 

[kennerado]

I love this song, you haters are mentally ill.

/end thread.

 

[laurent37]

I love this song, you haters are mentally ill.

That is a bit harsh. But I love every second of this song. Lyrically and musically it is everything I seek in music.

 

[intedomine]

After two listens to the album, the song hasn't yet really blown my mind at all, though the lyrics are brilliant. I'll give it time, but just at the moment I'm seeing more satisfaction in Unknown Caller especially.

Credit to this song though, it hardly feels like it goes for 7 and a half minutes, feels like a standard 3 to 4 minute song.

Hopefully I'm gonna grow to appreciate.

 

[razredge]

After two listens to the album, the song hasn't yet really blown my mind at all, though the lyrics are brilliant. I'll give it time, but just at the moment I'm seeing more satisfaction in Unknown Caller especially.

Credit to this song though, it hardly feels like it goes for 7 and a half minutes, feels like a standard 3 to 4 minute song.

Hopefully I'm gonna grow to appreciate.

The song does grow on you (did for me), however now it seems to have reached a ceiling.

 

[Chief43]

You know even Winter, even though its unfinished and has a few questionable lyrics, is a better ballad than MoS. It's actually interesting musically and the operatic vocals at the end are miles better than the uninspired 'ohhs; that finish of MoS.

A Viva La Vida rip off.

 

[ozeeko]

Remember that Bono quote in "A Year in Pop", of how these days people only like stuff that reminds them of stuff they like...that's the impression i get with "Winter". Like most of BOMB, it's a song that just reminds you of older U2, when they did this kind of song better.

Or maybe it just reminds you of Coldplay.

 

[Chief43]

Remember that Bono quote in "A Year in Pop", of how these days people only like stuff that reminds them of stuff they like...that's the impression i get with "Winter". Like most of BOMB, it's a song that just reminds you of older U2, when they did this kind of song better.

Or maybe it just reminds you of Coldplay.

Haha I swear Eno took control and forgot about his sessions with Coldplay when they went with the opening progression.

Winter isn't a bad song, but in comparison to 'White As Snow' which is meant to be is song sister I assume, it just doesn't have much inspiration for me.

 

[razredge]

A Viva La Vida rip off.

That's a very simplistic comment to make, they probably started it before VLV came out.

Has a very different tone and feel to VLV.

 

[Niceman]

I love this song, you haters are mentally ill.

/end thread.

I wouldn't use the harsh language... but um...... If I'm honest that's what I actually think!

 

[razredge]

I wouldn't use the harsh language... but um...... If I'm honest that's what I actually think!

-sigh- how many times do I have to explain that this is not a 'hate' thread.
Certainly i'm not a MoS hater.

 

[Chief43]

That's a very simplistic comment to make, they probably started it before VLV came out.

Has a very different tone and feel to VLV.

I guess thats makes me rather simple with my ideas rather linear. Had to use that line. I was in fact referring to the opening as Viva La Vida like and regardless of whom wrote the song first, Coldplay released theirs first so it will be the comparison for the song.

As for the rest of the song, I agree it goes off on a totally different direction encompassing the ambience and therefore creating a mood of contemplation for the vocals, i.e the lyrics. The operatics at the end are a nice touch yet are not fluent so it lets the crescendo down.

Nevertheless, the fact that the opening sounds like Viva La Vida creates the immediate comparison for the responder and therefore unfortunately taints the song.

 

[razredge]

I guess thats makes me rather simple with my ideas rather linear. Had to use that line. I was in fact referring to the opening as Viva La Vida like and regardless of whom wrote the song first, Coldplay released theirs first so it will be the comparison for the song.


Nevertheless, the fact that the opening sounds like Viva La Vida creates the immediate comparison for the responder and therefore unfortunately taints the song.

The intro has strings, yes? and so it's like VLV?
That's a bit like saying White as Snow is like another country song because it has acoustic guitar (only in this case, strings are rarely used in popular music).

I am very familiar with Viva La Vida, listen to it quite regularly.

Winter's intro has a different feel to it, the strings have less pomp and are more relaxing and elegant. And the backing keyboards also change the sound
significantly.

However I must confess that I am a sort of a trainspotter when it comes to songs (and cars too). I tend to notice the subtle differences between pieces of music, where others may find they sound practically identical.

So it may just be me.

 

[Chief43]

-sigh- how many times do I have to explain that this is not a 'hate' thread.
Certainly i'm not a MoS hater.

That may be the case, however, it seems to be an 'Everybody who thinks MOS is a classic is an unintelligible human being thread'. Of course things can be misunderstood without tone but this is the attitude that seems to be coming across.

You have suggested that people only appreciate the song because they cannot grasp the English language which is quite an ignorant remark. I for one was born in Australia and it is the only language I speak. This, including thirteen years of school and Journalism degree have helped me in comprehending what the English language is about. This by no means makes me an expert - not by a long shot. But I make this point as I still appreciate Moment Of Surrender and consider it one of their high class songs in quite a distinguished career. By saying that people do not understand English if they like this song and the lyrics within it is simply condescending and not original. In saying this, it is more about experience when interpretating a song rather than the synthesising of ideas.

For example, One I do not appreciate like some others as the interpretation I gather from the song I have not had the experience of and therefore cannot connect to the song deeply. However, Moment Of Surrender I interpret as a piece about feeling lost and losing your place and grip in the world and reflecting on how it happened. Then hoping for absolution from all your bad deeds in hope that you can find the place in this world that you want to be. Now, just because I feel this connection does not mean that others will. However, this does not diminish my thoughts about the song and does not mean it will make it connect for other people. Songs are personal, thats why we have so many varied reactions. It's when the majority feel such a close connection that a song becomes a classic. At this point in time Moment Of Surrender has not had its fair run.

Also, I do like to hear your opinions and justifications for why the song is not a classic, which you have given - I just don't appreciate the suggestions that other people have a language barrier and therefore if they could understand the lyrics they would not appreciate it as much.

 

[Chief43]

The intro has strings, yes? and so it's like VLV?
That's a bit like saying White as Snow is like another country song because it has acoustic guitar (only in this case, strings are rarely used in popular music).

I am very familiar with Viva La Vida, listen to it quite regularly.

Winter's intro has a different feel to it, the strings have less pomp and are more relaxing and elegant. And the backing keyboards also change the sound
significantly.

However I must confess that I am a sort of a trainspotter when it comes to songs (and cars too). I tend to notice the subtle differences between pieces of music, where others may find they sound practically identical.

So it may just be me.

Yes, but the chord progression is quite similar and the timbral qualities are very close too. It reminds me of VLV and that does not make me a simple listener of music. If you want to know, I studied music and musicology for six years and currently am part of a band and am a regular musician. All be it, I am not commercially successful haha. This elitism that you express is rather ignorant and narrow minded. You have an opinion and are entitled too it as are others. I realise that every chord progression and every harmony and scale has been done to death. However, it is my opinion that the Winter intro has a similar feel to VLV and due to the success of Coldplay's single I am immediately reminded of it.

In music, songs often remind you of a riff of a past song, or a phrase from a past vocal melody or the grace notes of an old piano piece.
However, Im glad U2 left this off NLOTH as I could not appreciate the song as much if the opening has tainted my thinking.

 

[Chief43]

The intro has strings, yes? and so it's like VLV?
That's a bit like saying White as Snow is like another country song because it has acoustic guitar (only in this case, strings are rarely used in popular music).
.

And to follow up, what do you mean strings are rarely used in popular music? The Beatles were a big fan of strings and in fact a lot of songs that come out that contain a string harmony can remind people of The Beatles, my father for one example. The Verve's greatest hit 'Bitter Sweet Symphony' samples the strings for the song and made it a great unifying anthem for the piece. Even Metallica did a whole concert with a string orchestra involving a lot of hits from the Black Album. So no, strings are not a new thing. And just because VLV and Winter had some kind of string synthesiser is not how I connected the two.

 

[razredge]

And to follow up, what do you mean strings are rarely used in popular music? The Beatles were a big fan of strings and in fact a lot of songs that come out that contain a string harmony can remind people of The Beatles, my father for one example. The Verve's greatest hit 'Bitter Sweet Symphony' samples the strings for the song and made it a great unifying anthem for the piece. Even Metallica did a whole concert with a string orchestra involving a lot of hits from the Black Album. So no, strings are not a new thing. And just because VLV and Winter had some kind of string synthesiser is not how I connected the two.

In the Beatles time yes they were common, these days not so much.

And the issues I have with MoS extend further than just lyrics.

PS: Wait a minute, you're apparently a One hater, unfortunately that means this discussion is going to go nowhere. I know your kind well

 

[Galeongirl]

Just for you razredge.

No, actually, I agree. It's a decent song and I realise that lots of people love it, but it drags on for too long. I don't mind the occasional calm song, but this just stays on the same level the whole time.

And I dislike you generalising One haters. Because I'm one of 'his kind' aswell.

 

[djparky]

MOS is a good/great track but it was a mistake claiming it was better than One- I largely ignored the hype and just took the song for what it is- but I don't believe it's better than One-

but how can we tell- the album has only be around for a week or so- perhaps in 5 years we'll have a different view- all I know is that I like the song- try not to get into the compare game

 

[Swan269]

I am actually scared to say that this is not one of my favorite songs on the album. It's actually on my lower half of the list.

i am with you...not a bad song...just not my favorite right now

 

[zwervers2]

MOS is decent. sorry mrpryck2u, I couldnt resist

 

[TheFlyOnTheWall]

I like all but the chorus in the song... It sounds like some christian rock song... don't like the melody of it..

 

[razredge]

I like all but the chorus in the song... It sounds like some christian rock song... don't like the melody of it..

I think it would be a significantly better song if it had a better chorus, it just sounds like the most obvious and boring way to sing those lyrics, reminds me of a Christmas carol.
It's possibly the biggest thing wrong with the song.

Maybe they should have gone with almost spoken word instead, or even no discrete chorus at all, like One.

 

[razredge]

Just for you razredge.

No, actually, I agree. It's a decent song and I realise that lots of people love it, but it drags on for too long. I don't mind the occasional calm song, but this just stays on the same level the whole time.

And I dislike you generalising One haters. Because I'm one of 'his kind' aswell.

Thanks for posting, I agree it doesn't really go anywhere, it starts off promising but ends rather flat. I think songs that end on a high note (while note necessarily getting off to the best start) are received better than songs that are the other way round. Take Zooropa for instance, begins rather sleepily, but has an absolute cracker of an ending.

I'll try not to generalise 'One haters' in future either.

 

[Iskra]

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay over rated.
It's like people have never heard other bands or something. It sounds like someone else's song.