ABSOLUTELY REPULSED by the cd quality of this new album

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If you use foobar2000, once you've done the ReplayGain scan, you can prevent clipping according to the track (or album) peak.

By reducing the gain on the track, you can prevent your amplifier from clipping during playback, but turning down the volume would achieve the same thing.

If the levels are set too high during the original recording/mastering, there isn't enough bit depth in 16-bit PCM to represent the peak amplitude, so the waveform is literally clipped. You can't fix that.
 
I am a U2 fan. Also a music Fan. Not an audiophile but I appreciate good mastering. I also hate this trend for cd's to be so loud they clip. Once an audio signal is clipped thats it.. the original bits are gone forever never to return... Such a shame.

I found myself here by the way by doing a google search on bad mastering on the new u2 album. It really is shocking... Quality control should have stopped this. There is loud, hot , very hot and just stupid - this albums mastering is just stupid. Listen to moment of surrender on any decent amplifier and speakers. Listen to how shril the cymbals are at the start. Bono's voice is so loud it distorts and breaks up. I noticed this right away.

It grates on your nerves and is very tiring on the ears. Listen to the first line of vocal - it totally distorts and breaks up. 3 mins 30 secs into cedars - listen to the vocal its totally distorted. Whats up with the interference at the start of that track by the way?

I looked at the waveforms of the offending songs on Sound Forge and that confirmed what I was thinking.. Its a great album. I just want to hear it mastered better - now. Couldn't agree more with the first poster on this thread!

I've been using digital mastering tools for years (Sound Forge) and its more than possible to master a mix very very hot indeed - WITHOUT actually clipping the signal - its not the loudness I object to - its the clipping!
When I buy a CD or DVD I expect "master tape" quality nowadays and any good recording engineer worth his salt would never RECORD any form of vocals or instrument clipped (except for 'effect'). Its just a basic rule of recording. . .

So what gives these brain dead mastering engineers the permission to go and F**k up a good mix at the final stage????

It makes my blood boil.. really...
 
I am a U2 fan. Also a music Fan. Not an audiophile but I appreciate good mastering. I also hate this trend for cd's to be so loud they clip. Once an audio signal is clipped thats it.. the original bits are gone forever never to return... Such a shame.

I found myself here by the way by doing a google search on bad mastering on the new u2 album. It really is shocking... Quality control should have stopped this. There is loud, hot , very hot and just stupid - this albums mastering is just stupid. Listen to moment of surrender on any decent amplifier and speakers. Listen to how shril the cymbals are at the start. Bono's voice is so loud it distorts and breaks up. I noticed this right away.

It grates on your nerves and is very tiriing on the ears. Listen to the first line of vocal - it totally distorts and breaks up. 3 mins 30 secs into cedars - listen to the vocal its totally distorted. Whats up with the interference at the start of that track by the way?

I looked at the waveforms of the offending songs on Sound Forge and that confirmed what I was thinking.. Its a great album. I just want to hear it mastered better - now. Couldn't agree more with the first poster on this thread!

The interference at the start of Cedars of lebanon is probably the tape hiss from the Harold Budd that is sampled in the song.

Mastering of the album is not great, but it's better than most current pop and rock releases (Metallica's Death Magnetic, Amy Winehouse's back to black, etc..).

Also I think the vocal distortion you mention on MOS an COL is rather vocal pre-amp and compressor distortion (actually an effect used by producers to add grit to vocals) with mastering distortion.
 
>Also I think the vocal distortion you mention on MOS an COL is rather >vocal pre-amp and compressor distortion (actually an effect used by >producers to add grit to vocals) with mastering distortion.

Interesting.. Well I agree it could be vocal pre-amp and comrpessor distortion - grit - (as an effect).

Thats why I'd like to hear a better quality version of the mix to be sure - eg. the high quality and apparently lower volume without clipping soundtrack to the DVD thats going about in certain circles...

No real way of telling otherwise.. I am "looking into this now" just so I can make my mind up properly...

Curious old fart I am...
 
Danny Boy, I just read your earlier post/reply to mine.
My whole point was that it could be misleading not that it was.
I tried to be pretty generic in my explanation,I'm sure I could have stated things better.

Certainly the audio on the CD is digital, my point was you have to take it from PCM and convert it to be able to work with it, extract it, whatever. Technically is PCM a digital format? Yes but I was using the context of extracting it, in the ease of conversation I was differing the file your PC recognizes from the file your CD player recognizes for the general board. Both digital, one is literally a digital file your computer can work with, the other is (read as) essentially just bits of digital data. I wasn't trying to have an outright audiophile moment. ;)

Also, yes, you can get an Exact Audio Copy or one of those more intensive programs to rip a near exact copy (debatable as to how exact it is, but it's certainly damn close, if the CD isn't damaged).

I was using that example just to demonstrate to the average non-audiophile person viewing this thread that Wave Forms can be deceptive. That just pulling up a Wave Form and saying "look at all that clipping" is not always an absolute indicator, it can entirely depend on levels. Not everyone uses the same shit, most regular users probably just use something like Audacity (which I don't even have, that's why I used an old Sound Forge). Some people will literally 'record' the audio as it's playing.

I actually used an old version of Sound Forge to move those levels. Just to demonstrate.
I was just (trying to) talk about context. Given that we didn't even know the source of one of those files, that was the whole point. It can be misleading, it's certainly not always misleading. I generally use one of those Exact rippers (I have two that I use) but not everyone has those or understands some of these details.
 
The 96khz sound fresher to me, and also I've noticed the sounds that make up the songs don't seem to drown out some of the other sounds as much, meaning I can literally appreciate the songs so much more.

Edit: Jesus, MOS sounds haunting. Seriously, it seems the mix is so much more vibrant and atmospheric. No wonder I didn't like the album much when I heard other versions they sounded like trash compared to this - looks like I've found what I've been looking for, finally. :drool:
 
3 mins 30 secs into cedars - listen to the vocal its totally distorted. Whats up with the interference at the start of that track by the way?
My ears must be broken, because I don't hear any distortion in the vocals 3:30 into Cedars!

The noise at the beginning of Cedars is clearly deliberate and not a mastering issue. It sounds to me like it's meant to emulate the fuzz you get turning a radio dial until you get the station you're looking for.
 
I just want to hear it mastered better - now. Couldn't agree more with the first poster on this thread!

thanks! that would be me again...i'm glad we're both agreeing on this issue that is plaguing the industry...in an earlier post, i mentioned this dynamic compression pandemic as an "obesification of music"...in which everything today is getting "bigger" (and "louder")..but bigger doesn't always mean better... i am planning on buying the vinyl edition shortly and before this thread becomes too old, i will post my findings on here.

as a u2 fan who built u2station.com almost 12 years ago, i for one appreciate good quality... and ever since i first bought zooropa on cd back in 1993 (one of my very first cds in general), i'll never forget how great the cd mastering was after listening to that album on my old aiwa stereo...the fans today of most bands deserve better. we need to bring back the quality of those days into the record industry again.
 
That just pulling up a Wave Form and saying "look at all that clipping" is not always an absolute indicator, it can entirely depend on levels.

I certainly agree with you on this part. If the audio is extracted from the CD with improper settings, you can easily make a well-mastered CD look/sound terrible.

I posted some waveforms on page 9 of this thread from both the CD and DVD versions of Stand Up Comedy. Both were ripped as cleanly as possible and normalized to a peak of 0 dB.

The screenshots I posted were from Peak, and I've looked at enough waveforms in Peak to know there's not a lot of dynamic range in these. You would have to drill down to a much smaller segment of audio to say with any certainty whether there is actual clipping.
 
Here's a much tighter shot of the SUC waveform, where you can clearly see that the peaks are flattened out. That's clipping.

SUC_ZOOM.png
 
>Also I think the vocal distortion you mention on MOS an COL is rather >vocal pre-amp and compressor distortion (actually an effect used by >producers to add grit to vocals) with mastering distortion.

Interesting.. Well I agree it could be vocal pre-amp and comrpessor distortion - grit - (as an effect).

Thats why I'd like to hear a better quality version of the mix to be sure - eg. the high quality and apparently lower volume without clipping soundtrack to the DVD thats going about in certain circles...

No real way of telling otherwise.. I am "looking into this now" just so I can make my mind up properly...

Curious old fart I am...
That's what I've been looking for as well.
And yes I bought an actual copy. Box set btw. I'm just not savy enough to rip DVD audio yet.
 
the production on nloth is better than the last 3 albums. Feels a little less produced. The best production was probably AB. You could feel the album's textures. if there were to release the songs without touching them they would get a better sound then letting flood or lillywhite get their hands on it.
 
That's what I've been looking for as well.
And yes I bought an actual copy. Box set btw. I'm just not savy enough to rip DVD audio yet.

If you look back a few pages, I compared the audio from the CD and the DVD and they look to be about the same from a dynamic range standpoint.

I'm not sure what the source of those FLACs is, but it doesn't appear to be the DVD.
 
most of the album sounds amazing, but I really do prefer the lower quality 320mp3 that came out for MOS...the vocals on the CD are way too hot! otherwise, very crisp and clear...SUC, UC, and Fez stand out as sounding really good to me.:up:
 
To the original poster, U2station...

Was this really an issue until you read those articles??

yes, this was an issue...and then i remember reading articles a few years ago about cd mastering and how it's been deteriorating over the last couple of decades and quickly read about it at the time...didn't think about it much until a few weeks ago when the "no line on the horizon" leaks came available in mp3...and then as i was listening to the mp3s, i wondered if the actual cd would be a bit of an improvement...and then when i realized it wasn't that much of a difference after careful listening, i lost it....i just did...and i had to post this. (cause when it comes to U2, i pay EXTRA attention to them than other bands, and that includes studio album sound quality as well).

and tonight, i got out my old kenwood turntable, cleaned it up, re-strung the belt and now have it prepared for the VINYL edition of NLOTH...which i will purchase tomorow!

Vinyl, i'm coming back 2 u, baby!
 
Well, yeah, CDs are mastered now to try and sound good coming out of PC Speakers. Which sucks for those of us that still have those stereo thing-a-ma-jigs.
 
It's a shame the SACD audio disc format never took off. I'd gladly fork over extra cash for a SACD version of NLOTH. I have a PS3 capable of playing the discs connected to my high-end Yamaha receiver via HDMI cable.
 
Perhaps some interesting anectdotal evidence regarding "hot" mastering...just listened to Achtung Baby, ATYCLB, and HTDAAB, and NLOTH, in succession...without touching the volume knob on my stereo at all, Achtung Baby is noticably lower in volume than all of the latter (AB itself is much louder than the original pressing of Joshua Tree); though NLOTH does sound a bit less compressed than ATYCLB and HTDAAB to me.
 
wonder what the waveform of AB looks like? Would be a nice comparison over 20 years...

I'm not sure how to save screenshots of the waveforms, but in looking at a few in WavePad, none of the AB waveforms comes close to clipping or having that squared-off shape at the top like some of the tracks from ACTYCLB and HTDAAB do (and as do Boots, Crazy, and SUC from NLOTH). Seems to be much more dynamic range on Achtung Baby.

I hadn't actually listened to Achtung Baby in a quite a while, and I was just reminded again how great it is. It's aged well and hasn't become outdated sounding at all (and Bono's voice is perhaps in it's best form ever).
 
I, too, was struck at the loudness of the album. From the first track it just felt too loud. Music is now geared towards the masses who listen through their laptop speakers.
 
This album is mixed and mastered a hell of a lot better than HTDAAB, at least.

City of Blinding Lights is just about unlistenable for me at this point. It's the sonic equivilant of mushy peas and ruins a great, great song.
 
I think the album sounds amazing- and I am the biggest audiophobe I know! Sure it's loud- but it can be good out loud or headphones it's loud but you can still hear something new each time! What's wrong with that?!
 
I think the album sounds amazing- and I am the biggest audiophobe I know! Sure it's loud- but it can be good out loud or headphones it's loud but you can still hear something new each time! What's wrong with that?!
I really love how the producers used the panning on this record. It's really, really nice to hear guitar and subtle textures coming in from the far left or right insead of a smashed-up, compressed mess coming at you from the centre (see: White Lies - To Lose My Life (2009).
 
definitely better than htdaab. however, there is this hiss at the beginning of cedars. is this supposed to be there?
 
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