BonoVoxSupastar said:
I haven't made any personal cheap shots to you or anyone else in here. If you can prove me wrong then please do so and I will openly apologize. I will debate hard with someone, I will pull off the gloves sometimes, but never will I attack someone. And I will debate someone even harder when they hold a weak argument. For this is something that truly bothers me, I have seen people jump through hoops show you post after post of information and facts and you reduce everything they say to an emotional argument. You'll ignore everything this person tells you. That is not how you debate and yes I will call you out on it, but this is not a personal attack.
I have much respect for many people who do not share my opinion in here. I never have called anyone or even hinted to the idea that anyone in here was heartless, mindless, or soulless.
I have also never used the word redneck and never have I called an individual a homophobe for that matter.
I'm sorry if you see my calling a person out on a weak argument as a personal attack. Yes I can get very passionate about that, but never will I call names or dismiss someone's opinion just because it doesn't match mine.
I'll take your word for it, although I did find this kind of stuff a little over the top:
Originally posted by ImOuttaControl
I feel sorry for her loss and am grateful of her sons sacrifice. But, this woman's a loony. This letter wasn't written immediately after his death, it was 7 months after so the woman had a long time to think about it. She throws out these conspiracy theories, which don't help her cause. I just want to know what her son really thought of the war...I mean, he signed up of his own free will and was possibly very proud that he might be doing something to be proud of. Talk about demeaning her sons sacrifice. She would find much more peace of mind if she opened her mind a bit to see the good that her son might have helped to accomplish in Iraq(Women's rights, free elections..ect).
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
Who are you to judge if she's demeaning her son's sacrifice or not. One can argue that she's his mother and probably has a better insight to what his experience was than someone who's at it from a completely partisan manner. Unless you've talked to him and knew where he stood on this war I'd leave it up to those who knew him. So maybe if you opened you mind a little.
Originally posted by ImOuttaControl
Who am I to judge? Maybe she (the mother) doesn't know jack shit about what her son felt about the war and about the things the U.S. is trying to accomplish in Iraq? No offense, but mothers aren't generally the best for "insight to what his experience was." Mothers, as I know from experience, judge from an emotional standpoint. I served in Iraq for a year (got back in June) and my mother really didn't know what I was doing there...she just knew she wanted me home and well.
"So maybe if you opened you mind a little"....well, maybe open your mind to the fact that maybe this mother is using her sons death in a way her son might not approve of. Like I said before: if she wasn't using conspiracy theories and partisan B.S. to try to make her point, I might take it a bit more seriously. Is there PROOF her son disapproved of the war and felt that if he died he would have died for nothing????
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
You have no idea what conversations went on between mother and son. Believe it on not there are soldiers fighting in Iraq who don't believe in this war. So it sounds like you're the emotional and partisan one. We know where you stand, but you don't know where the son stood, so until you know for sure don't speak or judge on his behalf because it's just sickening.
And then of course, there was this:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
The reason I discuss this issue often is to get a different perspective. I believe very strongly that you don't know your own views until you hear everyone else's. I'm not trying to shove an agenda down anyone's throat, I'm trying to ask realistic, valid questions.
Originally posted by BonoVoxSuperstar
You speak one way yet you act the other. You've avoided almost all questions asked of you. People have shown you facts and you accuse them of being charged only of their feelings, and you simply haven't shown any reason why homosexuals should be changed except for your interpretations of the Bible, which you admit may or may not be human doctrine. You can understand why people are upset with you. You say you have no agenda and speak very innocently about wanting the other perspective but you have dismissed almost everyone who doesn't share your opinion. Even when they have facts and life experience that you don't pocess. So instead of preaching to everyone to open their minds maybe you should step back read everything everyone has said, and try to use your own advice to form your own educated opinion.
Probably not everyone is going to say you were giving ImOuttaControl a personal attack, but he did have a firsthand experience in Iraq, which I appreciate his service regardless of who's running the show in DC. I would say he has a valid reason to get tired of the people who claim we're out there dying in vain. Sure, some troops might not like the war - or the president - one bit, but I can't thank them enough for having the balls to serve their country.
No, I've never heard you call anyone names, I respect that, but it seems that any debate can be emotional and partisan, especially the one I just posted. Also, please explain exactly what my "agenda" is. Is my opinion my agenda? People get upset with me because they don't agree with me, and then when I ask them for a factual opinion, they don't always have one. Therefore, I don't add much value to a factless opinion. Why shouldn't I consider it a jump to conclusions? Again, I apologize if I singled you out, but I didn't know how else to tell you. Your style is pretty hot-tempered at times, I just want to inform you of that, and that I'm not necessarily used to that type of style.