meegannie
Blue Crack Addict
melon said:overthrowal.
I that word.
melon said:overthrowal.
gabrielvox said:Like the US would play THAT or admit to it if it did indeed happen??? Cmon now!
Dreadsox said:1) I do not believe anything was doctored.
...
Peace to All.
sharky said:I can understand people who wouldn't support this war without evidence. I am one of those people. But how can you continue to poke holes in the evidence presented? The evidence not presented is probably worse. And the evidence presented is grim.
sharky said:
"Remove." "Remove."
"The expression." "The expression, I got it."
"Nerve agents." "Nerve agents."
"Wherever it comes up."
"Got it. Wherever it comes up."
"In the wireless instructions." "In the instructions."
"Correction. No. In the wireless instructions."
"Wireless. I got it."
"Nerve agents. Stop talking about it. They are listening to us. Don't give any evidence that we have these horrible agents."
meegannie said:
Not to belittle any of your points, but wasn't this Powell's explanation of the conversation rather than the actual translation itself?
Dreadsox said:The most interesting thing that I heard him say was the Al-Qaeda operations coming from Iraq. I am very curious about this. I am sceptical about this, and would like to know more. I read somewhere that Germany was investigating credible links in theis area.
meegannie said:It wasn't the one that was on the screen when they were playing the recording.
STING2 said:...Saddam is now smuggling 4 Billion dollars worth of goods into the country every year, some of it capable of helping Iraq's WMD programs.
Klaus said:whenhiphopdrovethebigcars:
The german chancelor always pointed out that he will support the fight against terrorism, but not only the german, but also the british and the french secret service are pretty sure that Saddam and Bin Laden are more likely to fight against each other than to be alies. (Well the British prime minister seems to have "better" informations than his own secret service, but that's another story)
Our governments are just pretty sure that the war against Saddam is not part of the war against terrorism and we don't want to be ever again part of a war where another country is attacked.
Germany never had so many troups in foreign countries since the end of Worldwar II - just to support the United States in the war against terrorism.
But imho you can't fight with armies against terrorists.
Also several members of the Green Party and members of the SPD pointed out that if Saddam uses B/C Weapons against our friends our "Fuchs" Tanks (who are specialiced for a/b/c defense) will of course support the USA, also we never wanted to support that attack.
Klaus
Downing St dossier plagiarized Iraq
Published: 6 February 2003
Reporter: Julian Rush
The government's carefully co-ordinated propaganda offensive took an embarrassing hit tonight after Downing Street was accused of plagiarism.
Read sample of the accused plagiarised text
The target is an intelligence dossier released on Monday and heralded by none other than Colin Powell at the UN yesterday.
Channel Four News has learnt that the bulk of the nineteen page document was copied from three different articles - one written by a graduate student.
On Monday, the day before the US Secretary of State, Colin Powell addressed the UN, Downing Street published its latest paper on Iraq.
It gives the impression of being an up to the minute intelligence-based analysis - and Mr Powell was fulsome in his praise.
Published on the Number 10 web site, called "Iraq - Its Infrastructure of Concealment Deception and Intimidation", it outlines the structure of Saddam's intelligence organisations.
But it made familiar reading to Cambridge academic Glen Ranwala. It was copied from an article last September in a small journal: the Middle East Review of International Affairs.
It's author, Ibrahim al-Marashi, a postgraduate student from Monterey in California. Large sections do indeed appear, verbatim.
A section, for example, six paragraphs long, on Saddam's Special Security Organisation, the exact same words are in the Californian student's paper.
In several places Downing Street edits the originals to make more sinister reading.
Number 10 says the Mukhabarat - the main intelligence agency - is "spying on foreign embassies in Iraq".
The original reads: "monitoring foreign embassies in Iraq."
And the provocative role of "supporting terrorist organisations in hostile regimes" has a weaker, political context in the original: "aiding opposition groups in hostile regimes."
Even typographic mistakes in the original articles are repeated.
Of military intelligence, al-Marashi writes in his original paper:
"The head of military intelligence generally did not have to be a relative of Saddam's immediate family, nor a Tikriti. Saddam appointed, Sabir Abd Al-Aziz Al-Duri as head..." Note the comma after appointed.
Downing Street paraphrases the first sentence: "Saddam appointed, Sabir 'Abd al-'Aziz al-Duri as head during the 1991 Gulf War."
This second line is cut and pasted, complete with the same grammatical error.
plagiarism is regarded as intellectual theft.
Sample text
Government dossier: (page 13), published Jan 2003
"Saddam appointed, Sabir 'Abd al-'Aziz al-Duri as head during the 1991 Gulf War. After the Gulf War he was replaced by Wafiq Jasim al-Samarrai.
After Samarrai, Muhammad Nimah al-Tikriti headed Al-Istikhbarat al-Askariyya in early 1992 then in late 1992 Fanar Zibin Hassan al-Tikriti was appointed to this post.
These shifting appointments are part of Saddam's policy of balancing security positions. By constantly shifting the directors of these agencies, no one can establish a base in a security organisation for a substantial period of time. No one becomes powerful enough to challenge the President."
al-Marashi document: (section: "MILITARY INTELLIGENCE", published sept 2002 - relevant parts have been underlined