Native Son...months later

[Hallucination]

Ok, well I already uploaded Native Son...link is on the first page of this thread. I assume you know how ysi links are handled here. Go ahead and download that one while I upload the other two.

Not usre I do know how ysi links are handled. I rarely download music(guilty of Mercy though). Anyways all the links you posted come up as "The Page cannot be displayed". If it doesn't work that's no big deal. I appreciate the effort.

 

[namkcuR]

Not usre I do know how ysi links are handled. I rarely download music(guilty of Mercy though). Anyways all the links you posted come up as "The Page cannot be displayed". If it doesn't work that's no big deal. I appreciate the effort.

Ok, do you see the spaces between you and send and it in the links? Copy and paste the addresses and remove the spaces and then go. Do you understand what I'm saying?

 

[namkcuR]

Or if it's easier you can just click on these, they'll work like a charm...

Smile:

http://tinyurl.com/7z3yt

ABOY(Alt.):

http://tinyurl.com/bomo9

 

[Earnie Shavers]

First of all, the truly criminal - in Native Son, at the same time as Bono hits that "Freeeeeeeee", Edge's guitar part. All of them should be slapped around for leaving that off Vertigo. Far, far better way to kick it into the last chorus than Bono's dumb "All of this..." lines.

To me Native Son is a far better complete song. Tells a complete story, builds brilliantly. I love the U2 songs that don't build in a way that is immediately noticeable. You'd don't notice every single step up in volume or noise or speed or addition of instrument or layer or whatever, but instead you suddenly find the song going nuts around you and you stop and think "Wait! How did we get here again?" Native Son does that. By the time Bono is singing the "freeeeeeee" and Edge's guitar is kicking in that extra bit you realise that you are smack in the middle of something that is f*cking rocking, and that's not immediately obvious from the start, it really catches you out. The different guitar parts are used to different and better effect in Native Son as well. I love how the part that is the main riff through the versus in Vertigo is used in Native Son. Whenever Bono says "to be free" that part kicks in, and it sounds at that moment like someone kicking down a door and running outside to freedom. Perfect. In Vertigo it's just a catchy riff. Nothing more. I love Native Son's chorus. But Vertigo's "Hello Hello's" are more catchy, obviously.

And that's what I think about it all really. Native Son is a far better song, but Vertigo served it's purpose far better than Native Son would have. I think if you choose one song over the other simply because you think it's a better single, then you should take the headphones off and walk away now. If that's all you can hear in the music..... but I can see both tastes between those two songs. I listen to Native Son a lot. I love it. Feels far more natural, far more emotion in there. I haven't (by choice) listened to Vertigo in months. It's too plastic and shiny. Built for a purpose from a blueprint.

 

[Hallucination]

Or if it's easier you can just click on these, they'll work like a charm...

Smile:

http://tinyurl.com/7z3yt

ABOY(Alt.):

http://tinyurl.com/bomo9

Sweet! Those two links worked and I figured out what you ment but the Native Son link is no longer available. Only problem with Smile and ABOY is they won't play What program do you use to play them namkcur?

 

[namkcuR]

Sweet! Those two links worked and I figured out what you ment but the Native Son link is no longer available. Only problem with Smile and ABOY is they won't play What program do you use to play them namkcur?

ITunes or Winamp. Either will play them. Both are free. You only need one. I'll do Native Son in a sec.

 

[namkcuR]

Here's Native Son again:

http://tinyurl.com/ds737

 

[Hallucination]

namkcuR, thanks a million. I really appreaciate it.

 

[ybird3k]

thanks a lot namkcuR!

i still have to say i prefer vertigo, though i must have heard it over 1000 times, but that 'freeeeeeeeeeee' in native son is great.

also Smile is very good, and also alternate ABOY

 

[Irishteen]

I prefer Vertigo, but still Native Son is a great song, the FREEEEEE is brillant.

 

[Rafiennes]

Yeah, I’m certainly gonna be in the minority here – While I love the raw sound of Native Son’s music and the amazing vocal Bono puts I on ‘Free’, I think they are some really poor lyrics.

They sound as if they’re half way there but not quite finished. And the whole “Officer put down your gun”…I can see why Lillywhite wanted a change. I get the story Bono was trying to tell, I just don’t think he did a good job of telling it.

The idea of finding your faith in a world that doesn’t seem to suit you (Vertigo) is more interesting and speaks to me on a more personal level than Native Son.

 

[Theedge070]

Yeah, I’m certainly gonna be in the minority here – While I love the raw sound of Native Son’s music and the amazing vocal Bono puts I on ‘Free’, I think they are some really poor lyrics.

Speaking of Son's lyrics, does anyone have them? At some points it's hard for me to make out what Bono's singing.

 

[Lo-Fi]

I think overall I prefer Native Son, it's a braver song, a song I'd expect from u2. The theme of the song, it actually has something to say and doesn't meander into just rhyming couplets of words the way Vertigo does.

I also think it's a fuller song, it seems to have a lot more going on in the mix than Vertigo where Lylliewhite and the boys seem to have stripped it back too far.

The more I read of Lylliewhites envolvement in the record I wish he wasn't the one they called on after Thomas had left. He just seems to got them to start from scratch so he could make it 'his' record. I've heard what they did with Thomas through the iTunes set and I prefer a lot of what Thomas was doing than the pop goo we ended up with after Lylliewhites envolvement. There were very few brave moments on HTDAAB and I find that a real shame. Hopefully next time round they get the much rumoured Rick Rubin envolved, I know they originally thought about him for HTDAAB, man, that would have been a very intresting record. RUBIN FOR THE NEXT RECORD!!

 

[ybird3k]

Speaking of Son's lyrics, does anyone have them? At some points it's hard for me to make out what Bono's singing.

Yeah, it’s on the street, it’s under your feet
It’s everywhere but if you’re looking for free
Don’t look at me
My enemy became my country

On the run
Officer put down the gun
Native son
I never wanted to own one
Native son
Both of us want to be someone
It’s so hard
Is it so hard for a native son to be free

Tears falling from the sky, falling to the ground
Bullets start to fly
He’s hurt, he’s in the dirt
On my word

Don’t want to run away
I’m safer in my father’s place
I know that I can’t stay
But if I stay, I know what’s next

On the run
Officer put down the gun
Native son
I never wanted to own one
Native son
Both of us want to be someone
It’s so hard
Is it so hard for a native son to be free
Free

Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah
Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah
Free

On the run
Officer put down the gun
Native son
I never wanted to own one
Native son
Both of us want to be someone
It’s so hard
Is it so hard for a native son to be free
Free, free

 

[Theedge070]

Wow, that was my first time listening to Smile, and I love this song! I'm not sure why, either! I think the "I don't wanna see you Smiiiiiile" is the equivalent to "You don't have to go in aloo-hooo-oone" in Sometimes.

 

[LemonMelon]

Where to begin. First off, the lyrics in Native Son are not "better". The rhymes sound forced, and Vertigo's sound natural. The guitars rock in both songs, but that riff should not fit next to lyrics like, "On my word...I did not take his life.." Eh...and people that "Freedom has a scent" was bad.

The chorus in Native Son is all right, but it's just waaayyyy too politically charged.

Native Son isn't awful, as it still is a great tune, but I just can't sing along to it like I can to Vertigo.

 

[LastEdgeOnEarth]

If U2 had gone with "Native Son" thats floating around I think everyone on here knows that it wouldn't have been as big as "Vertigo". Some say well, Native Son sounds much more U2-ish. Isn't that what so many people have had a problem with, U2 trying to sound too U2-ish and playing it safe instead of trying new things. Thats why I love Vertigo because it was totally new ground for them...the first time I heard it I was happy just because they threw me for a toal 360 loop. My dissaspointment came when the rest of the album didn't follow up to what Vertigo seemed to indicate. All along U2 had been pledging a garage album filled with huge guitars was on the way, but only about half the album is semi garage-esqe. While Miracle Drug is my favorite song on the album, when it came on second after Vertigo I felt like ATYCLB had risen again. Songs like OOTS, Sometimes, COBL, One Step, and Drug easily could have fit on ATYCLB. But getting back to Vertigo and Native Son....U2 made the right choice. Native Son too me sounds just as forced as Vetigo at times. Difference is Vertigo is catchier and thats what garage rock is supposed to be catchy...not challenging. But I do want U2 to start challening us again with the next album.

 

[lazarus]

Not to mention the fact that you could hardly open an album with Native Son. A bit political for the beginning of the record.

Vertigo's lyrics are slightly trite, but it fits; it gets you in the mood. It's VERY similar to Discotheque.

I admire Bono's attempts to write about Leonard Peltier but in execution it's a bit weak. I'd recommend people check out the song "Sacrifice" from Robbie Robertson's album Contact From the Underworld of Redboy. Robertson knows Peltier personally, is part Native American himself, and the song contains samples of Peltier speaking about his plight. It's a trememdously moving piece of work. The whole album is, really, combining Roberton's excursions into electronic music with Native music and his own amazing songwriting skills.

 

[Shaliz]

I would have to say I prefer Vertigo to Native Son. Don't get me wrong, I think Native Son is a good song, and I don't have a problem with the political lyrics. I just love the raw power of Vertigo that to me seems to be missing from Native Son. With Vertigo, that riff just comes pounding out of the speakers and shoots my adrenalin level up several notches! That being said, I haven't listened to Native Son nearly as many times as I have Vertigo, so I'll give it another listen in the interests of fairness.

 

[U2DMfan]

Not to mention the fact that you could hardly open an album with Native Son. A bit political for the beginning of the record.

No kidding, next thing people will say is they should have opened War with Sunday Bloody Sunday. You just can't do that people!!!!

 

[lazarus]

Well the difference is that the album was called "War" and it was central to the theme that the band was exploring on that recording. The first three songs are political!

Native Son would set the stage for a show that isn't playing. Vertigo is vague, but it certainly sets you up for something.

 

[blueyedpoet]

SBS opened War and that fits because the album is called War, but a politically minded song couldn't open an album called How to Dismantle an Atomic Bomb? yeah, that album title doesn't sound political

 

[U2DMfan]

Unlike others, I don't see a recurring theme throughout the album, so I could see little problem with U2 opening with Native Son and going right into say, All Because of You. I think the tone you could set with the album could be rock and roll, then mellow, then epic, then sentimental, whatever. Or you could right into political with Native Son-Love and Peace. Or you could emulate War and go 3 in a row, Native Son-Love and Peace-Crumbs and not only would you be thematically political, but you could be thematically rock and roll. Or you could keep it as is, basically.

I get what Lazarus is saying, I was only making a joke in the first place. I don't see a thread throughout HTDAAB that couldn't be broken up though. This album to me, like ATYCLB is exactly what Bono and the others say it is, a songs album. I think in that sense you could align songs by mood and tempo more than content in the tracklisting. As far as setting the stage, I think you set the stage by grabbing the listeners attention, regardless of content. Sometimes the content grabs the attention, sometimes it's a hook and catchy chorus, sometimes it's just something epic, sometimes it's just strange. U2 cover all the bases.

I think what U2 now does anyways is set moods and emotions. There is no real correlation to Beautiful Day's upbeat rock going into Motown Stuck. I think it's mood and tempo and feeling, I don't think the band, especially on this album or the last were trying to tell a story or trying to make a theme, I think the theme was make as good "songs" as possible, with "songs" being the strictest sense of the word. And from there you try to get a track flow, I think that is primarily set upon by the moods.

So if upbeat Vertigo fits into Miracle Drug, then upbeat Native Son fits into Miracle Drug, in that sense. That's all I am saying. I don't see any disconnect in going between a song about temptation into a song about empathy and then switching it to a political song going into a song about empathy.

There are different ways to skin the cat of "track order". And I am probably just picking at hairs on a gnat's ass to make a point, but that is the point I want to make. It could work to lead off the album, I don't see a compelling reason why it wouldn't.

I don't think U2 tossed Native Son because it didn't make sense opening the album's sequence, I think they tossed it because it didn't make sense as a hit single to promote the album. Perhaps that is the best reason, it's not the catchy single they wanted.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

The chorus in Native Son is all right, but it's just waaayyyy too politically charged.

Not to mention the fact that you could hardly open an album with Native Son. A bit political for the beginning of the record.

If U2 had gone with "Native Son" thats floating around I think everyone on here knows that it wouldn't have been as big as "Vertigo".

Agreed. Native Son would not have given HTDAAB the xposure that Vertigo did.

May I ask exactly what is the problem that it seems almost everyone has (not just in this thread) with U2 writing great music for no reason other than it's great music? It seems everything must be in that little commercial box now. "Too political" "Not catchy enough" "Wouldn't be a hit" "Couldn't be a single". Does commercial success really mean more to you than the music itself? I'm not specificaly targeting the writers of the above quotes (hence why I took the names off), but these are certainly common comments around here now. A song is judged by it's hit-ness and not much more... that's sad.

 

[lazarus]

SBS opened War and that fits because the album is called War, but a politically minded song couldn't open an album called How to Dismantle an Atomic Bomb? yeah, that album title doesn't sound political

Well we're splitting hairs, really, and despite the "controversial" title, the answer to "How To..." is love, and the album is more about that than anything else. Maternal love, love for God, love for your significant other, dyfunctional family love, love of your fellow man/charity, love for a city...and the one big political song is called LOVE and Peace or Else.

Ultimately, War WAS a political record. Storming out of the gate fit. Native Son wouldn't have.

In regard to ATYCLB, my main (among many) problems with the album was the tracklisting. The album should have opened with Elevation, and the original tracklisting had Beautiful Day going right into Elevation. So I do think the flow of BD to Stuck is awkward. The three slot was Walk On, which then went into Stuck. Worked much better. I haven't listened to that original order since the day the album came out. It's crap.

There was a tracklisting written somewhere that had Crumbs taking MD's place. Not much of a difference as the song is pretty political, or at least topical and fairly "heavy". The problem with putting ABOY after Vertigo is that you give the impression the whole album's gonna rock. Bono himself said that POP was perhaps a bit too frontloaded with the dancy songs, and scared away people who otherwise may have enjoyed the rest of what is in truth a really diverse recording.

I think ultimately MD fits, because Vertigo seems to be looking for some kind of salvation or comfort amongst the chaos, and MD is about a mother being there for her child. This segues into a song about a son's love for his father, then into a song about strife between people that should be brethren. You finish with a song partially about a city affected by that same conflict, partially about a man looking back on when he was young and naive, which brings "side one" full circle.

Not bad for a band that seems to have lost the ambitious "album" mentality...

 

[innocent_eyes]

I always thought that Love and Peace or Else, had a double meaning like many of U2's great songs (One, WOWY, etc..) in how it followed Sometimes You Cant...

By this I mean there is the War and conflict between people who should be bretheran aspect, and, in following Sometimes, a kind of demand for peace between Bono and his father, as they had a rocky relationship.

Sometimes is the loss and mourning of his father, Love and Peace is the anger and resentment toward their previous relationship...and Bono is sayin, We need Love and Peace!!!!

 

[gareth brown]

May I ask exactly what is the problem that it seems almost everyone has (not just in this thread) with U2 writing great music for no reason other than it's great music? It seems everything must be in that little commercial box now. "Too political" "Not catchy enough" "Wouldn't be a hit" "Couldn't be a single". Does commercial success really mean more to you than the music itself? I'm not specificaly targeting the writers of the above quotes (hence why I took the names off), but these are certainly common comments around here now. A song is judged by it's hit-ness and not much more... that's sad.

Aaah, brilliantly put! Far too many people are viewing U2's music in terms of how 'commercially successful' it would be or 'politcally charged' it is...if it's good music, what else is wrong with it?

Like I said originally I like it for the instrumentation and those sweet, sweet vocals...I'm not saying I don't care about the lyrics, but the verses sound half ad-libbed naturally since it's a demo, BUT the chorus is fine, and I don't get why people are moaning about it being too politcal??

 

[Lancemc]

The first time I heard Vertigo I nearly shat my pants. It's slightly tarnished now by overexposure, but it's still awesome.

 

[Flying FuManchu]

I've finally got round to listening to this properly after someone sent it to me again and I must say it's fantastic! I can now see why a lot of people prefer this to Vertigo.

It really makes you realise how over-'polished' Vertigo was ...

Over-polished?

Vertigo in Edge's words outside of final guitar bit that is overdubbed (and Jacknife's insect noise thing) was the band in full motion and with little overdubbing.... just the band playing in a room type of spiel. That is the exact opposite of over-polished IMO unless you're saying a well constructed song is over-polished.

I liked Vertigo better... Edge singing Native Son in the background cheesed out the song IMO. Also the guitar bits sounded good to me (Native Son) but just not well put together enough to make a song. Sort of sounded like Edge overload and not in a good way. Sort of mish-mashing guitar bits and sounds together b/c the song doesn't sound strong enough on its own.

 

[WalkOn21]

I like Native Son much better than Vertigo. The way it kicks into the chorus, it just rocks! Waay better than the lame "Hello, hello" of Vertigo.

By the way, the lyrics mentioned in this thread aren't entirely correct. Here you can find some adequate lyrics:
http://www.leoslyrics.com/listlyrics.php?hid=f9G7ytTNmmw=

P.S. A "Native Son vs. Vertigo" poll would be interesting. Of course accompanied by the note "only vote if you've heard both".