canedge
Refugee
true dat
I associate JFK and his speeches with a time when post WWII America still aspired to be great, instead of the business / political interest smash and grab that it is today.
All of that passed on with Nixon and Vietnam as we were reminded as a nation how shitty many people are. What's there to be happy about on a grand scale since the moon race and civil rights movement, besides an isolated pocket of brilliance (Silicon Valley) and the Soviet Union collapsing under its own ridiculous, groaning weight.
I'm really struggling to think of one thing Jack Kennedy did other than be youngish and handsome-ish. Johnson was an infinitely greater, albeit deeply flawed, president. Vietnam destroyed his presidency and it would have done the same to Kennedy's, had he lived.
Inclined to agree, though many historians doubt Kennedy would've gotten us into the level of involvement in Vietnam that Johnson did; Kennedy recognized how unpopular our presence was in the region and had no hope that would change, while Johnson regarded Kennedy's trepidation as weakness (despite agreeing, at the time, that this was primarily 'Asia's war to fight'), and the two men often clashed over it.
Any examples of Lennon or JFK that would make them a conservative?
Kennedy indeed was a great President who understood better than most, the importance of US Defense Spending and military intervention around the world to stop the spread of Soviet supported Communism as well as protecting US global security interest.
adam4bono said:Well, for JFK, he believed in heavy defense spending and foreign military intervention abroad that was required by the Truman Doctrine, which puts him closer to todays Republicans than to Democrats.
And obviously the best way to deter social community or "The Reds" as you call it in the US is to go and torch innocent villagers in very distant lands in front of their families.
Bravo America!
You forgot to mention Eisenhowers warning of "growing military-industrial complex."
Wouldn't want defense spending to spiral so out of control that it strangles the social growth of the homeland.
Context is key my friend.
Well, that is the stereotype that many non-US citizens and liberal US citizens like to promote and believe. But it is false, no matter how much they enjoy and cling to such beliefs. The United States saved the world from communism and World War III.
adam4bono said:It certainly is, but Kennedy would not be blind to todays US security needs unlike many Democrats.
The United States saved the world from communism and World War III.
There is more fantasy in that comment than a J.K. Rowling novel. But as long as it serves personal self-interest than why change right?
Do you think that Lee Harvey Oswald really was his murderer? Do you think he was used as a pawn by the FBI who detested JFK's withdrawal rom Vietnam? Do you think the Kennedy's were responsible for the death of Marilyn Monroe? Don't you think that Jackie Kennedy looks like Ali? Do you really think JFK was that good looking?
Hard to believe that just 50 years ago the country's leading liberal was comfortable with the use of American power overseas, was anti-abortion, cut income taxes on the rich, fought labor union corruption, named a Republican businessman as his Secretary of the Treasury, was unabashedly patriotic and, gasp!!, believed in American Exceptionalism.
Hard to believe.
Oh come on.
Today this country's leading liberal is comfortable with the use of American power overseas (see Libya as Exhibit A, rubbing out Bin Laden as Exhibit B), is friendly enough with the wealthy to piss off and disappoint his own base, and had a Republican as his secretary of defense (and one of the Republican candidates as part of his administration), is unabashedly patriotic and, gasp!! believes in American Exceptionalism.
As far as fifty years ago. . .fifty years ago I couldn't eat at the same lunch counter as you, and my marriage (to a woman) was illegal in many states and could have gotten me killed in more than a few. So you can keep your rosy "Fifty Years Ago" nostalgia.
INDY500 said:I'm sorry but saying all countries are exceptional is the same thing as saying none are.
"I believe in American exceptionalism, just as I suspect that the Brits believe in British exceptionalism and the Greeks believe in Greek exceptionalism."
-Barack Obama
I'm sorry but saying all countries are exceptional is the same thing as saying none are.
The rest of us aren't that full of ourselves
As far as fifty years ago. . .fifty years ago I couldn't eat at the same lunch counter as you, and my marriage (to a woman) was illegal in many states and could have gotten me killed in more than a few. So you can keep your rosy "Fifty Years Ago" nostalgia.
And Goldwater looks like Lincoln compared to every GOP candidate since 1996.