Breaking Bad II - Always say "thank you" to Walt. - Page 37 - U2 Feedback

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Old 09-16-2013, 11:00 PM   #541
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I love them both. I wasn't as sold on this season of BB as everyone else until last night. Cranston and Gunn were just phenomenal.
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Old 09-16-2013, 11:03 PM   #542
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They're such different animals that it's hard for me to evaluate one against the other. BrBa hits you on such a visceral level, so that likens itself to a bit of hyperbole. Mad Men is much more nuanced. Picking a favorite would change for me any given day.

They're both utterly fantastic, as close to perfect as television can get, and we're lucky to even be able to have such a discussion.
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Old 09-16-2013, 11:08 PM   #543
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Just checking: am I the only one left who still prefers Mad Men? (just to name one show)
I greatly enjoy both. Is that not allowed?
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Old 09-16-2013, 11:10 PM   #544
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They're such different animals that it's hard for me to evaluate one against the other. BrBa hits you on such a visceral level, so that likens itself to a bit of hyperbole. Mad Men is much more nuanced. Picking a favorite would change for me any given day. They're both utterly fantastic, as close to perfect as television can get, and we're lucky to even be able to have such a discussion.
100% agreed, for another year at least.
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Old 09-16-2013, 11:16 PM   #545
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They're both utterly fantastic, as close to perfect as television can get, and we're lucky to even be able to have such a discussion.
Agreed. They're nothing alike and both great, so why compare?

Personally, I greatly prefer recent episodes of BB to recent episodes of Mad Men. Last season was a for me. The show is spinning its wheels too much and the lack of character progression from Don was growing tiresome, though the end of the season showed some promise on that front. BB is going to end on top, but I'm not so sure about Mad Men. I feel like it peaked with The Suitcase, whereas every new episode of BB feels like a new favorite.
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Old 09-16-2013, 11:24 PM   #546
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Just checking: am I the only one left who still prefers Mad Men? (just to name one show)
Nope. I'm with you. But I love BB, too.
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Old 09-16-2013, 11:31 PM   #547
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That was a very intense episode.

Im wondering if Walter kills everyone but spares Todd. Or maybe Jesse kills Todd, hell, maybe Jesse kills Walt. Or Marie kills Walt....

This shit could go a bunch of different directions. But there's definitely some shit fixing to go down.....

Granite State and then Felina, and then im going to need some fucking therapy
usually when you let someone off the mat, it ends up biting you in the ass.

todd steered jack's guys away from the car right after the gun fight when it wouldn't have been that difficult to look under the car. and then he kept him from getting a bullet after walt spotted him.

it's almost too easy to say that jesse doesn't make it out of that situation. i think he ends up killing todd (partly as payback for drew sharp), maybe when walt busts into the compound and starts shooting up jack's crew.

i can see walt having jesse dead to rights with the M60 and letting him walk away.

or everybody dies. who really the fuck knows

for me, the hardest part of the episode was marie's reaction after walt said they were never going to see hank again.
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Old 09-16-2013, 11:31 PM   #548
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LAZ CAN'T KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH lT!
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Old 09-16-2013, 11:46 PM   #549
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Just checking: am I the only one left who still prefers Mad Men? (just to name one show)
As excellent as Breaking Bad is, I do enjoy Mad Men more overall. BB is a little too tense and dark for me to really enjoy watching it. Which seems weird to say when I'm so excited for these last few eps, but there it is.
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Old 09-17-2013, 12:04 AM   #550
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I agree with the fact that they're basically incomparable, so it comes down to personal preference.

I can also understand that the exuberance of BB fans can inspire some backlash among the non- or less-converted. I agree that episodes leave the viewer charged and emotional and prone to Internet hyperbole in the moments after the credits roll.

I enjoy both. A great deal. It's a privilege to watch either.

However, I just rewatched "Ozymandias" again, and what floors me is how perfect it is. Flawless. Every shot, every word, every verbal nuance. And that's one of at least a half dozen episodes I'd describe as "perfect" as well. For me, there's no other show I can think of where I can't imagine it being any better. And that's where part if the thrill of it lies for me, the ninja-like prowess of everyone working on the show. There are times when MM shows its seams, when it feels forced, when not everything works. And that makes the moments when it casts it's spell that much sweeter.

BB never misses.

And it could be so easy to get this wrong, too.
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Old 09-17-2013, 01:45 AM   #551
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Yeah, I think it's far from perfect. "BB never misses" just sounds ridiculous to me. Not to beat a dead horse, but the secondary characters (meaning everyone but Walt) could have used some better writing, especially in the first few seasons. The point was made by someone else on another forum that shows with larger ensembles like The Sopranos and The Wire managed to flesh out their people a lot better.

I consider myself a big fan of Breaking Bad. And while I admire the visual approach, I don't think the writing comes anywhere near that level, and that's why it fails to resonate with me beyond simple entertainment.

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There are times when MM shows its seams, when it feels forced, when not everything works. And that makes the moments when it casts it's spell that much sweeter.
I'd argue that because MM is tackling more than one storyline, more themes, and trying dissect the time in which it takes place (BB, by contrast, exists in a total cultural vacuum), it's a lot harder to achieve the supposed perfection you're hoping for.
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Old 09-17-2013, 02:27 AM   #552
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It may be reductive: Mad Men is a great collection of short stories with a fuller ensemble; Breaking Bad is a tight, propulsive narrative with a more set structure. Within that structure, however, Gilligan and Co. establish a greater universe and hone it as it spirals downward. The reading of Gilligan's showrunning technique mimicking the scientific structure and method of its central protagonist is really fitting. Weiner's more controlled, authorial style ironically exhibits more of a focus on what we see/hear/feel about the characters on the show, though it allows for a greater ambiguity.

I think the comparison skews towards Breaking Bad's favor in that it seeks narrative fulfillment. It's a masterfully-constructed show, not without its missteps of course, but even from a pure plot-perspective it is easier to enjoy than Mad Men... though who would argue that is the "point" of either show.

Even the way folks phrase the end of Breaking Bad on here: "I don't know what's going to happen," or "I hope the writer's don't screw it up," or "I think this will happen to Character X" all phrase the conversation in a more straightforward way than one would discuss Mad Men. Then again, Breaking Bad is the more popular show of the two which merits some consideration in this argument.

tl;dr - They both rule.
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Old 09-17-2013, 02:36 AM   #553
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Just checking: am I the only one left who still prefers Mad Men? (just to name one show)
Not at all. I tried picking up on season five this morning, and found that I couldn't care less about this show anymore. So I figured maybe I just need to go back and do a complete run through before it ends/I finish it. I think I've made my opinions known, in that I thought the first two seasons were a really well-done mix of dark humor, seriousness, and emotional turmoil, whereas by the third season it becomes ridiculous in its Walt vs (everything). And each time, he wins. Small town drug dealers? Check. Cancer? Check. Major drug cartels? Check. That's a long way from the guys he and Jesse were when they bumblingly robbed the chemical supply warehouse, and I didn't think they did a good enough job either 1) setting up a "watch how these characters change and grow more and more capable of doing worse and worse things," or 2) in the name of shooting for likability or sympathy, spent too much time early on focusing on fears of being caught, doubts and bring disturbed by how easy it is to dispose of a body, or mistakes made along the way. Trying to pull off both makes for muddy story telling, and what I thoroughly enjoyed for 2 seasons grew to be too over the top and dramatic. I don't know where else it could have gone, and don't know how it could have been done better. But I don't really care for where it went.

At any rate, I tried watching season 1 again, and after about three episodes, realized I didn't think it was half as good as I did the first time. Whereas with Mad Men, I could dive back in and go through that entire show a 3rd time tomorrow (I probably will once the last season starts so I'm set to pick up with that as soon as it actually ends). Yes, they're two entirely different shows, but that's what I actually find so easy about picking one over the other. Multiple story lines over the backdrop of the 1960s, even on episodes where it's not done 10/10 perfectly, it's still much more interesting to me than the obvious tensions that are manufactured solely to provide weight to the story of Walt's meth operation.

Also tl;dr. And not as nearly as well-informed on anything as LMP's.
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Old 09-17-2013, 02:50 AM   #554
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The more I think about the last episode (Ozymandias), the more I think Walt has finally realized what he has done. I think after that last confrontation with his family, he saw himself through their eyes, as the thing that he's become, a monster. Maybe one of the last things he can try to do to hang on to his last shred of humanity is save Jesse. I would love this so much more than a Walt vs. Jesse ending. At first I didn't think I'd want it to end with Walt vs. the Nazis, but it wouldn't be that at all. It's Walt vs. himself now.
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Old 09-17-2013, 03:01 AM   #555
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Also, to the comment above - I know, it was by way of comparison with Mad Men - but there is no way that Breaking Bad exists in a cultural vacuum.

This is early 21st-century America. The hanging-by-the-fingernails, self-deluding, middle class portion of it (in most other western countries, Walt would never have had nearly so plausible a reason to embark on his course). I live on the other side of the world and it is a terrifying place, to me.

No other place or time. This is the 2000s in the same way that Boardwalk Empire is the Twenties, and the twenties in America, not England or anywhere else.

Probably Breaking Bad feels a bit floating-up-somewhere-on-a-tether because it never namechecks news or current events, but let's say it's set in some vague land called 2007-2013, and at most it is twelve to fifteen months of these people's lives.
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