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Old 04-24-2010, 11:31 AM   #751
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...but it does sound suspiciously close to the mantra that was going on during the housing bubble, "Home ownership is the key to middle-class wealth." So buy a bigger, more expensive house now! What are you, a loser?
Yes, you are right on with this.
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Old 04-24-2010, 12:18 PM   #752
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I'd comment on this if I could hear you over the noise of my absurd bills to go to a public university. Over $100,000.


if taxes were lower, you'd be able to afford your public university.

right?

after all, the only reason Memphis has been paying off his student loans from his own public university for the past 10 years is because our taxes are too high.
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Old 04-24-2010, 12:32 PM   #753
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after all, the only reason Memphis has been paying off his student loans from his own public university for the past 10 years is because our taxes are too high.
10 years? That's pretty common I think.
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Old 04-24-2010, 12:36 PM   #754
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10 years? That's pretty common I think.

with a good 10 more to go.
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Old 04-24-2010, 12:40 PM   #755
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so, where do the Tea Partiers wish to begin cutting defense?
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Old 04-24-2010, 12:44 PM   #756
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so, where do the Tea Partiers wish to begin cutting defense?
I can't speak for Tea Partiers - but I certainly think we can cut defense. I am more in favor of a quicker, lighter, deadlier force (increased reliance on special forces and technology and less reliance on the huge sys admin force).
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Old 04-24-2010, 01:01 PM   #757
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with a good 10 more to go.
Public tuition does vary a lot between states. But in general I think it provides a good value to both state and student, no matter how you choose to pay off your loans.

Anyway, it's up to each state to decide how much to subsidize their public universities. I'd rather it happen at that level rather than Washington, D.C.
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Old 04-24-2010, 01:18 PM   #758
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Public tuition does vary a lot between states. But in general I think it provides a good value to both state and student, no matter how you choose to pay off your loans.

Anyway, it's up to each state to decide how much to subsidize their public universities. I'd rather it happen at that level rather than Washington, D.C.

the point i'm trying to make is that students have to incur incredible amounts of debt at even state universities in a world where a college degree is essential to making even a lower-middle class income, and simply lowering taxes -- the Tea Party raison d'etre -- is an inane approach to problems like public education. more, treating public education like a marketplace is exactly the wrong way to go about dealing with the issue, and the same with health care.
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Old 04-24-2010, 01:36 PM   #759
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I can't speak for Tea Partiers - but I certainly think we can cut defense. I am more in favor of a quicker, lighter, deadlier force (increased reliance on special forces and technology and less reliance on the huge sys admin force).
I don't know too much about how defense money is appropriated, but I'm worried that a "quicker, lighter, deadlier force" is what the branches of the military ARE going for these days; this means more expensive aircraft, stealthier machinery that costs hundreds of millions of dollars to manufacture, and massive contracts to revamp the combat uniforms of soldiers and turn them into truly 21st century/futuristic-looking warriors. Unfortunately, these expensive and pioneering programs represent much of the $$ that bloats the defense budget.

Sure, we can make strides in reducing the size of our armed forces bases around the world; there's been recent criticism of bases in unstable countries throughout Central Asia, for example. But if we want the ability to do all the things that a more effective, stealthier military ought to do, we will still need these safe havens and landing strips to accomplish our missions.

For both sides — conservatives and liberals — it seems like it's going to get really hard to separate the rhetoric that surrounds 'Defense-Speak' from what kind of serious defense spending reform we're willing to support.

I'm not looking forward to hearing this debate on Cable News/online news sites, etc...they don't seem to do a very good job of channeling emotions into good dialogue
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Old 04-24-2010, 02:52 PM   #760
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so, where do the Tea Partiers wish to begin cutting defense?
Don't ask so they won't have to tell.
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Old 04-24-2010, 03:01 PM   #761
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Don't ask so they won't have to tell.


certainly, the elimination in that policy will save millions, and it will also mean that the 3-4 dozen fluent-in-arabic-and-farsi translators wouldn't have been kicked out of the military, so bonus for good intelligence, and with good intelligence, we might not have wasted $1T in Mesopotamia.
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Old 04-24-2010, 03:47 PM   #762
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the point i'm trying to make is that students have to incur incredible amounts of debt at even state universities in a world where a college degree is essential to making even a lower-middle class income, and simply lowering taxes -- the Tea Party raison d'etre -- is an inane approach to problems like public education. more, treating public education like a marketplace is exactly the wrong way to go about dealing with the issue
I get your point about big debt, but what are you suggesting? The taxpayer is responsible for K-thru-12 education. Would you make the taxpayer responsible for K-thru-16?

I wonder what the Tea Party would say about removing the marketplace for college degrees...

(and centralizing it in state capitals and D.C.)
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Old 04-24-2010, 04:41 PM   #763
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I get your point about big debt, but what are you suggesting? The taxpayer is responsible for K-thru-12 education. Would you make the taxpayer responsible for K-thru-16?

I wonder what the Tea Party would say about removing the marketplace for college degrees...

(and centralizing it in state capitals and D.C.)


i'm suggesting that taxes are a necessary evil, and state education should be heavily subsidized so that more citizens are able to get a college education regardless of their ability to pay. i also think it's criminal to start saddling an 18 year old with $100,000 in debt.
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Old 04-24-2010, 05:56 PM   #764
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i also think it's criminal to start saddling an 18 year old with $100,000 in debt.
Not when what's desired in the current state of affairs is a cheap, obedient debt slave on the corporate ladder. Works perfectly for that.
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Old 04-24-2010, 06:03 PM   #765
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Will you read the whole thing? Or dismiss it out of hand?

Ephphatha Poetry: "Imagine if the Tea Party Was Black" - Tim Wise

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Imagine that hundreds of black protesters were to descend upon Washington DC and Northern Virginia, just a few miles from the Capitol and White House, armed with AK-47s, assorted handguns, and ammunition. And imagine that some of these protesters —the black protesters — spoke of the need for political revolution, and possibly even armed conflict in the event that laws they didn’t like were enforced by the government? Would these protester — these black protesters with guns — be seen as brave defenders of the Second Amendment, or would they be viewed by most whites as a danger to the republic? What if they were Arab-Americans? Because, after all, that’s what happened recently when white gun enthusiasts descended upon the nation’s capital, arms in hand, and verbally announced their readiness to make war on the country’s political leaders if the need arose.

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Imagine that a black radio host were to suggest that the only way to get promoted in the administration of a white president is by “hating black people,” or that a prominent white person had only endorsed a white presidential candidate as an act of racial bonding, or blamed a white president for a fight on a school bus in which a black kid was jumped by two white kids, or said that he wouldn’t want to kill all conservatives, but rather, would like to leave just enough—“living fossils” as he called them—“so we will never forget what these people stood for.” After all, these are things that Rush Limbaugh has said, about Barack Obama’s administration, Colin Powell’s endorsement of Barack Obama, a fight on a school bus in Belleville, Illinois in which two black kids beat up a white kid, and about liberals, generally.
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