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Old 02-21-2007, 08:56 PM   #106
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I confess right off I am not getting this saccharine reference a few (?) of you have made; perhaps I have missed some posts? Or maybe I just live in the dark, lol.

My first post was (we're talking about the long one?) out of sheer frustration but every word was true. I can't apologise for it. I did mean what I said about not finding anything there, either. Literally, not just people to relate to, but there's no sense of anything you church goers speak of. Perhaps that adds to my growing frustration and irritation with sanctimonious views put forward by some. It's not like it's entirely choice, after all. I've done a damn lot to try and understand and to no avail. Still, that's my personal lot and issue to work out and one which doesn't really belong in a public politics forum. All this given, my knowledge that I am far from anything described so far leaves me wondering; who is not understanding who? Remember, I don't disbelieve in God; I just don't know what or how to believe. I can look outside any window and know I am looking at evidence of an incredible world and incredible humankind filling it. Be it science or God which created it, I know it is more immense than I will ever understand and I am awed.
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Old 02-21-2007, 09:10 PM   #107
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Angela, I empathize with your plight. We've all felt that. I feel it now. You are not alone.

We're justing using the word 'saccharine' to describe that fake sweetness that leave an aftertaste in your mouth.

Much worse than splenda.
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Old 02-21-2007, 09:18 PM   #108
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i like splenda!



yours sincerely,
type 1 diabetic.
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Old 02-21-2007, 10:58 PM   #109
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Originally posted by MadelynIris
I can only assume?
That's a very trite and uninformed take on the reality and depth of karma. It's not about luck, or "helping" others; it's about taking one's actions more seriously than you can imagine. It's knowing that whatever you do, say, or think, good, bad or indifferent, it will have a consequence. And I don't mean in the Christian sense of pissing off God and then saying you're sorry and all's good. I mean a real reaction and consequence in the next lifetime or two. You will be accountable for all you do and say.
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Old 02-21-2007, 11:40 PM   #110
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Originally posted by anitram


Oh good grief.

Yes, 5 billion people out there are living in daily misery.
Probably more like 8 billion.
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Old 02-22-2007, 07:20 AM   #111
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The dream country is modern day America with a few tweaks.

1) return of American mythology - meaning, I think there is value in building up the lives of men like Washington, Jefferson, FDR, MLK. Keep them larger than life and hold them up as examples of courage and leadership.

2) allow Judeo/Christian ethics and morality to be taught in public schools. Secular Humanism is the current religion being taught and I think it is leading us down the wrong path.

3) removal of activist judges, both conservative and liberal.

4) an end to big oil and big auto as we know it. We are slaves to this outdated, robber barron system and I hate it. Electric cars are very patriotic

5) the banning and removal of Islamic Fascism.

6) extreme funding of green technology. The ROI will be worth it!

7) outlaw abortion (this is a brutal and barbaric practice - medical advances will only continue to reveal how truly awful this is)

8) mandatory 2 year service for every man and woman (can be military, peace corps, Red Cross...etc)

9) that we choose to reject the sewage that comes from Hollywood.

10) that our university teachers stop usuing their position to spread the hatred of America and Judeo/Christian values.

Any candidate, man/woman/black/white/Republican/Democrat/Independent, running on these basic principles, and he walks as he talks (i.e. integrity), is my ideal candidate
so...I'm a bit late to this thread...but I'm gonna add my piece anyway.

even as someone who grew up with a Christian background, I have to say that the idea of a government run by one very narrow interpretation of values scares the shite outta me...but that's just me. Christianity is a universal community and therefore VERY diverse. For example, your Judeo-Christian ethics are clearly different from mine. So, I'm assuming you want a government based on YOUR interpretation of these ethics.

I'm really puzzled by how many conservative Christians are so patriotic, yet the government they desire is one that is even more controlling than our current one. Your ideal seems to call for a complete makeover of the First Amendment...which, IMHO, pretty much devalues why this nation was created in the first place.

By the way, welcome back, AEON.
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Old 02-22-2007, 07:54 AM   #112
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Quote:
Originally posted by AEON


Probably more like 8 billion.
It must feel so good to know that you're absolutely right, with no margin for error and no reason to ever, ever doubt that your human mind has it all figured out. And that the rest of us are pathetic figures, just aching, really, for your insight. Your self-righteous, selective, exclusionary, smug insight.

And people wonder why Christians drive people nuts.
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Old 02-22-2007, 07:54 AM   #113
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Originally posted by AEON
1) return of American mythology - meaning, I think there is value in building up the lives of men like Washington, Jefferson, FDR, MLK. Keep them larger than life and hold them up as examples of courage and leadership.
Actually, I think that this is one of the worst parts of the American mythos. Our presidents were ordinary men who deserve vehement criticism, where necessary, and, in a culture where we already let presidents get away with far too much, propping them up as false idols is the last thing we need. To hell with romanticism.

Quote:
2) allow Judeo/Christian ethics and morality to be taught in public schools. Secular Humanism is the current religion being taught and I think it is leading us down the wrong path.
All you need to do is to teach people to abide by the law and to accept pluralism. I agree that schools are weak when it comes to discipline--they're weak on a lot of fronts, really--but there's no larger "secular humanist" agenda, and if you want Judeo/Christian ethics and morality to be taught to your children, there's no shortage of churches and Sunday school programs, not to mention 8 hours out of every weekday (assuming 8 hours of sleep) that you're not in school that you can spend worshipping God to your heart's content.

No, why people really want "Judeo/Christian values" in public schools is because they see children as a fertile ground for evangelization and recruitment--even against their parents' wishes. And, I'm sorry, I think that's a terrible idea. I'm sure you wouldn't appreciate one day if your rebellious child, one day, came home and said that he's now a Muslim, because of someone's conversion activities in a public school, so extend that same respect to others.

Quote:
3) removal of activist judges, both conservative and liberal.
And, pray tell, who gets to define who is an "activist judge" and who isn't? This is why we have an extensive court system with a lengthy appeals process--to weed out the "activist" judicial opinions. And, generally speaking, I think it works.

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4) an end to big oil and big auto as we know it. We are slaves to this outdated, robber barron system and I hate it. Electric cars are very patriotic.
This won't have a quick fix, unfortunately.

Quote:
5) the banning and removal of Islamic Fascism.
Easier said than done, since hate speech is constitutionally protected, and you can't single out any one idea for banning. You can obviously target a group for arrest, however, if they are violating OFAC laws or inciting violence.

Quote:
6) extreme funding of green technology. The ROI will be worth it!
This is where presidential leadership is needed. Bush, however, has never been interested in this subject.

Quote:
7) outlaw abortion (this is a brutal and barbaric practice - medical advances will only continue to reveal how truly awful this is)
I've long been on the fence on this issue. In an ideal world, I don't think it would be needed. In the real world, I can't imagine forcing women to have children that they don't want to have.

Quote:
8) mandatory 2 year service for every man and woman (can be military, peace corps, Red Cross...etc)
A nice thought, but, realistically, America's youth is already under enough pressure as it is. "Service" isn't going to pay my bills and my large student loan debt. And, last I heard, the military draft in Vietnam was quite chaotic with a lot of grumbling people who didn't want to be there. I can imagine that a service draft would be similar.

Quote:
9) that we choose to reject the sewage that comes from Hollywood.
I have my gripes about media, but, ultimately, media follows society. When people stop watching the sewage, Hollywood will stop making it.

Quote:
10) that our university teachers stop usuing their position to spread the hatred of America and Judeo/Christian values.
Universities probably need more discipline, particularly on the subject of professors going on political tirades in unrelated course subjects (i.e., a political tirade in a typing course). But beyond that, telling professors that they have to always put America and religion in a positive light, because you say so, sets a bad precedent for academic freedom.
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Old 02-22-2007, 08:35 AM   #114
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Quote:
Originally posted by redhotswami


so...I'm a bit late to this thread...but I'm gonna add my piece anyway.

even as someone who grew up with a Christian background, I have to say that the idea of a government run by one very narrow interpretation of values scares the shite outta me...but that's just me. Christianity is a universal community and therefore VERY diverse. For example, your Judeo-Christian ethics are clearly different from mine. So, I'm assuming you want a government based on YOUR interpretation of these ethics.

I'm really puzzled by how many conservative Christians are so patriotic, yet the government they desire is one that is even more controlling than our current one. Your ideal seems to call for a complete makeover of the First Amendment...which, IMHO, pretty much devalues why this nation was created in the first place.

By the way, welcome back, AEON.

Thank you for the warm welcome

This list is simply a desire and yes, based on my interpretations. I was asked to dream, and so I did. I wouldn't force this, but I would vote for it as long as a candidate wasn't too wacky on other issues.

I would like to point out - the government does control us. It does enforce a value system. It is part of the bargain we have with it. In return we are suppose to receive protection for a way of life most of us agree to. Today that system is Secular Humanism and I want it changed.

I am not one to say "bring back the glory days" - but I'm also not one to throw everything about the past away. I would want to take the "best bits" of the past and combine them with everything that is great and wonderful about the present age to form a "more perfect Union."
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Old 02-22-2007, 08:45 AM   #115
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Quote:
Originally posted by martha
I know. Those of us who are neither Judeo nor Christian are feeling a little as well.
Well I'm Christian and I'm feeling plenty of as well. I also yike at being lumped in with all of that too in FYM, as if all Christians would nod their heads in agreement at all such notions. They wouldn't, and it's not just me-trust me. It would be nice to see the word some once in a while-that's all.
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Old 02-22-2007, 09:00 AM   #116
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It would be nice to see the word some once in a while-that's all.
You have a good point, and it's taken.
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Old 02-22-2007, 09:09 AM   #117
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Quote:
Originally posted by martha

You have a good point, and it's taken.
Honestly I was afraid to say it but I did anyway..
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Old 02-22-2007, 09:36 AM   #118
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But it's true. The strident ones make it difficult for the rest. That's true with any group. And those of us not in the particular group need to be reminded that not everyone in a group thinks the same way.
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Old 02-22-2007, 09:44 AM   #119
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Thanks martha, and I really appreciate your understanding and what you said. It makes it easier for me here, it really does.
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Old 02-22-2007, 09:56 AM   #120
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karma question:

how (or does) karma address the problem of evil, or, why do bad things happen to good people?
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