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Old 03-07-2003, 07:52 AM   #16
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Yeah Margo is on the mark, but she should stick to print, the Fairfax tv stuff is too amateur.
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Old 03-07-2003, 07:57 AM   #17
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Here is an article from yesterday with some good stats on the coverage on US media.

http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=15312
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Old 03-07-2003, 10:39 AM   #18
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Kieran: Interesting articles, can anyone tell me who this guy is?

Scarletwine: yeah if this article is true, it's depressing 414/34 >90% Government propaganda instead of journalism

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Old 03-07-2003, 05:43 PM   #19
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case in point:

today, with hans blix report being released which was anything but a justification of war, cnn.com is giving it next to no play.
instead the firm deadline with a war to follow proposition of the UK is given the headline.
in the lead up to the report, blix was the star however. now i can not even find a story on their main page or world page. you have to go specifically to middle east page where there is simply a compendium of reactions from world leaders to the blix report.
so you can read the, rather dry, text of the blix report or read reactions to it. dont look for any headlines from CNN saying 'blix says iraq is getting better' or anything to that effect.

thank you scarlet wine
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Old 03-07-2003, 05:49 PM   #20
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Sad isn't it.

I find it so frustrating talking to people around me that don't take the time to look further than Peter Jennings or worse Fox news. They are all convinced the gov't is wonderful - doing the right thing - ect. Sadaam is Osama.

I'm starting to fell very isolated in my sphere of existance. Any ideas?
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Old 03-07-2003, 06:20 PM   #21
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Quote:
Iraqis May Pose as U.S. Troops, Official Alleges
Military spokesman contends that Baghdad would commit atrocities and then blame foes.
By John Hendren
Times Staff Writer

March 7, 2003

WASHINGTON -- Iraqi President Saddam Hussein has ordered military uniforms "identical down to the last detail" to those worn by U.S. and British troops so Iraqi paramilitary soldiers can commit atrocities against their own people while disguised as coalition forces, a top U.S. military spokesman alleged Thursday. . (unnamed source)

Senior military officials . (unnamed source) said the uniforms are bound for the Fedayeen Saddam soldiers, a paramilitary force of more than 15,000 from the president's home region of Tikrit and other loyal areas. They described the force, founded by Hussein's son Uday in 1995, as one that deals with public unrest in emergencies and normally patrols and carries out anti-smuggling duties.

"This campaign of fear and misinformation would represent the latest chapter in Saddam Hussein's long history of brutal crimes against the innocent people of Iraq," said James Wilkinson, senior spokesman for the U.S. Central Command in Tampa, Fla.

Human rights monitors said it was hard to evaluate the U.S. allegations without more detailed information.

The accusation follows a series of allegations of planned Iraqi tactics made privately to journalists in recent days by U.S. officials on condition of anonymity, . (unnamed source) apparently in anticipation of Iraqi charges of American acts of brutality against civilians should the U.S. attack.

Thursday's charges came one day after a senior defense official briefed reporters at the Pentagon on the U.S.-led coalition's rules and methods for targeting sites in Iraq. The official said the rules would minimize civilian casualties. . (all dead civilianís will have been killed by Iraqis dressed as Americans)

Fedayeen Saddam troops would wear the U.S. and British uniforms "when conducting reprisals against the Iraqi people so that they could pass the atrocities off as the work of the United States and the United Kingdom," Wilkinson said. . (how convenient)

The force, which a human rights worker described as a private army, is separate from the Iraqi army and reports directly to Hussein's palace.

The officials did not say how they obtained the information or how many uniforms had been ordered, but they insisted they know "for a fact" that Hussein ordered the uniforms and intends to use them to discredit coalition forces. . (is this credible?)

Hania Mufti, a London-based Middle Eastern specialist. (NAMED source) with Human Rights Watch who served as an observer in Iraq following the 1991 Persian Gulf War, said Hussein was not known to use such tactics then. She added that the killings of Iraqi Shiites and Kurds that followed the war occurred after the U.S.-led coalition left.

"This would be quite new," Mufti said. "It is conceivable that it could be a method that the Iraqis could resort to, but of course that is only speculation on my part. Because of the force of public opinion, I think the Iraqis would realize that this could be something that they could use to bolster the already very strong antiwar sentiments that exist in Europe and the United States and elsewhere."

It's hard to evaluate the Pentagon claims without knowing where the information came from, said Joe Stork, a Human Rights Watch Middle East specialist based in Washington.

Iraq's regime "is a government that's responsible for all manner of atrocities," he said. "That said, these allegations don't have any precedence. "
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Old 03-07-2003, 07:30 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by Klaus
Kieran: Interesting articles, can anyone tell me who this guy is?

Klaus
What guy?
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Old 03-08-2003, 04:21 PM   #23
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A little dissenting voice.

http://www.boomspeed.com/scarletwine/LyingUsIntoWar.doc

It takes a little time to load.
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Old 03-09-2003, 02:38 PM   #24
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Kieran McConville:
I'm sorry, i was in a hurry I was asking about Margo Kingstons background, his articles were verry interesting, especially the think tank war article and the control of oil article. So i was curious about his credibility, his political engagement etc.

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Old 03-09-2003, 03:09 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scarletwine
Sad isn't it.

I find it so frustrating talking to people around me that don't take the time to look further than Peter Jennings or worse Fox news. They are all convinced the gov't is wonderful - doing the right thing - ect. Sadaam is Osama.

I'm starting to fell very isolated in my sphere of existance. Any ideas?
I agree that mainstream media is inherently biased, but so are so many of the "independent" sources. An example is the article you posted in the "Lies" thread where the writer of an article you posted uses Galbriaths words out of context, suggesting that Mr. Galbriath is against the war, when it fact he supports it, he's simply expressed concerns over the possible spread of "pre-emptive" military strikes into Asia. I'm not picking on you Scarlet, just pointing out that there is bias everywhere in media. The best thing to do is to get as much info from as many different sources as possible, and then make your own decisions.

I also compare views of our Govt with the old anolgy of the half glass of milk. Some see the glass as half empty, others as half full. Some people look for everything our Govt does wrong, and some only look at what our Govt does right. It's somewhere in the middle.
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Old 03-09-2003, 09:49 PM   #26
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Klaus - Margo is a girl.
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Old 03-10-2003, 07:26 AM   #27
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brettig:

Oh, i'm sorry again

So who's that girl?
Her articles were verry interesting, especially the think tank war article and the control of oil article. So i am curious about her credibility, her political engagement etc.

I'm sorry, i never heared that name before, that's why i assumed the wrong gender

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Old 03-10-2003, 09:11 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zooropa

I agree that mainstream media is inherently biased, but so are so many of the "independent" sources. An example is the article you posted in the "Lies" thread where the writer of an article you posted uses Galbriaths words out of context, suggesting that Mr. Galbriath is against the war, when it fact he supports it, he's simply expressed concerns over the possible spread of "pre-emptive" military strikes into Asia. I'm not picking on you Scarlet, just pointing out that there is bias everywhere in media. The best thing to do is to get as much info from as many different sources as possible, and then make your own decisions.

I also compare views of our Govt with the old anolgy of the half glass of milk. Some see the glass as half empty, others as half full. Some people look for everything our Govt does wrong, and some only look at what our Govt does right. It's somewhere in the middle.
I agree wholeheartedly with you. I was aware the Lies article is biased. It was a point that in mainstream media, especially television, dissenting voices are not heard.
The statistics on the percent of people that believe Sadaam was personally behind 9/11 in the article were factual - 42%. It was a New York Times - CBS survey. An ABC poll shows 55% think he provides direct support to Al Qaeda. A direct result of propaganda by the Administration and majoe media. Luckily I have noticed a slight change a result no doubt of the growing number of dissenting customers.
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Old 03-10-2003, 10:03 PM   #29
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this is from FAIR. it is actually from a much larger bulletin regarding msnbc's hiring of michael savage as being 'a legitimate attempt to expand the marketplace of ideas'. at the same time as savage has been hired, phil donahue has been let go, in spite of his network high ratings, under what FAIR concludes are the circumstances as follows

Quote:
from FAIR activism update
His show was cancelled despite having the best ratings on the network; this occurred, according to published reports, after a study commissioned by NBC described Donahue as "a tired, left-wing liberal out of touch with the current marketplace" who would be a "difficult public face for NBC in a time of war" (All Your TV, 2/25/03). "He seems to delight in presenting guests who are anti-war, anti-Bush and skeptical of the administration's motives," the report noted, warning that the Donahue show could be "a home for the liberal antiwar agenda at the same time that our competitors are waving the flag at every opportunity."

Network insiders echoed these qualms. In an email leaked to the website All Your TV (3/5/03), one executive suggested that MSNBC could take advantage of the "anticipated larger audience who will tune in during a time of war" to "reinvent itself" and "cross-pollinate our programming" by linking pundits to war coverage. "It's unlikely that we can use Phil in this way, particularly given his public stance on the advisability of the war effort," the email said.

All Your TV's Rick Ellis quoted a network source: "I personally like Donahue, but our numbers were telling us that viewers thought he has too combative, and often said things that some respondents considered almost unpatriotic."

According to published reports, these fears led MSNBC to "micromanage" the Donahue show. "He was often told what kinds of subjects to showcase and what kind of guests to have. And he was often chided for being too tough on some guests," consumer advocate Ralph Nader wrote (Common Dreams, 3/3/03). "In the past few months, the corporate 'suits' even told Donahue that he had to have more conservative or right-wing guests than liberals on the same hour show."

Given this treatment of Donahue's progressive, anti-war views, it is hypocritical for MSNBC to claim that it is hiring Savage merely to "expand the marketplace of ideas," provide "a wide range of strong, opinionated voices" and "encourage debate." While hatred of "turd world immigrants" is a viewpoint that the news channel seems comfortable promoting, progressive criticism of a war with Iraq is too controversial.
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Old 03-11-2003, 07:51 AM   #30
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On the topic of Margo Kingston again, I'm not really sure where I'd find the answer to questions about her credibility. The thing I find interesting about her webdiary at the Sydney Morning Herald is that for the most part it's not just a journalist's weblog - the vast majority of contributors are ordinary (albeit informed) folk like you or I, some write anonymously if their job perhaps demands a level of discretion. So it's fairly broad in scope.

The right in Australia regard her as a fruitloop, but well, they would, wouldn't they? It's a matter of judgement.
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