MLB 2014-15: It's Time for the HOT STOVE

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Rollins is gone. I'm way sadder about this than I thought I would be.

Lol. As if Seager alone is even worth it for renting out Hamels. No thanks. We'll be very happy keeping what looks to be one of the game's best shortstops real soon.

The fuck are you talking about? Renting out Hamels? He has four years left with an option year.
 
Two top prospects and a solid third piece and you take on the whole salary. Otherwise, we'll just keep him. We don't need to deal him. The Dodgers have to include Urias and Seager, the Red Sox have to include Betts and Bogearts. Or no deal. That teams are overvaluing Mookie Betts isn't gonna force us to make a move we shouldn't make.

Betts may be over-rated but there are plenty of good arms to be had either by cash or by trade. Don't think Philly has that kind of leverage with Hamels just yet.
 
Rollins is gone. I'm way sadder about this than I thought I would be.
"The trade is “close” but isn’t yet completely finalized, FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal tweets. The teams haven’t worked out which players will be in the deal and a third team could possibly be involved."
 
Rollins is gone. I'm way sadder about this than I thought I would be.



The fuck are you talking about? Renting out Hamels? He has four years left with an option year.

Because he's under an expensive contract and won't be worth his pay years down the road. It's effectively a way to have another great starter for a couple more years...that's nowhere near worth the potential of paying peanuts in annual salary to someone like Seager.

Glad we could nab Rollins. :up:

Now we just need the Matt Kemp deal with San Diego to wrap up. Dodgers get another catcher in Grandal, an extra prospect or two and free themselves of 2/3 to 3/4 of Kemp's salary. :up:
 
Betts may be over-rated but there are plenty of good arms to be had either by cash or by trade. Don't think Philly has that kind of leverage with Hamels just yet.

Exactly. I'll be astounded if they can even move Hamels anywhere for a single top prospect. A lot of other teams have gotten next to nothing trading high-priced starting pitchers recently. Value divided by cost is exactly how GMs approach these things and Hamels comes with that big annual price tag and too many guaranteed years.
 
Because he's under an expensive contract and won't be worth his pay years down the road. It's effectively a way to have another great starter for a couple more years...that's nowhere near worth the potential of paying peanuts in annual salary to someone like Seager.
Well I'll just reserve hotel rooms at the All-Star Game in 2016-2025 for Seager now then.
 
Nobody's even saying he needs to be that good. If you have a prospect that ends up being the tenth most valuable shortstop in the league while they're under contract, that's a hell of a valuable prospect. Certainly worth more than the opportunity to overpay Hamels years down the road.

On top of that, we were projected to have the worst depth in the MLB at shortstop prior to this Rollins deal, so Seager has a ton of extra value for the Dodgers. Hell, they specifically want Rollins because the idea is that Seager will surely be starting there in 2016 which makes Rollins a perfect one-year substitute.
 
The idea that 5 years of 2 WAR is the same as 2 years of 5 WAR (purely an example, not specific to this exact trade proposal) is a fundamental misunderstanding of how these advanced statistics are supposed to be applied.
 
It depends on the price you're paying and the position and needs...I'd much rather have a catcher give us 2 war a year for half a decade than overpay for a starting pitcher who I know will be ace (5 WAR/yr) for the next two years but iffy after that.

Part of the success of Andrew Friedman (while in Tampa Bay) and Billy Beane is that they're able to avoid having below replacement level players (negative war) actually play for their teams. Sometimes, it's a win just to not have someone that detrimental on the roster as a regular or otherwise. Seager earning 1 WAR a year at basically league minimum until he's a Free Agent would certainly be worth more than paying Hamels that sort of money in 2018.
 
Well, a need is a need, but you are essentially saying you would rather have five years of a replacement level shortstop than five years of an ace who may decline to a number two over the course of the deal, because SAVINGS! As if the Dodgers of all teams are that worried about the payroll.
 
Seager earning 1 WAR a year at basically league minimum until he's a Free Agent would certainly be worth more than paying Hamels that sort of money in 2018.

This is absolutely not true.

He also would not make league minimum until he's a free agent, but only for 3 years. Arbitration salaries after.

There is value in having above average players at low cost. There's much less value in having below average (1 WAR) player at that same cost.
 
Well, a need is a need, but you are essentially saying you would rather have five years of a replacement level shortstop than five years of an ace who may decline to a number two over the course of the deal, because SAVINGS! As if the Dodgers of all teams are that worried about the payroll.

Dodgers still have their limits.

1) For example, look at the Matt Kemp trade rumors. They're clearly trying to unload salary.

2) Look at some bidding wars they've been involved in such as the race for Russell Martin. Dodgers may have money, but they sure as hell don't want to commit to too many years in their contracts.

So, not acquiring Hamels for top prospects would fit their MO. The new front office doesn't like to pay a lot of money for someone's decline phase and they don't like to overpay either...
 
This is absolutely not true.

He also would not make league minimum until he's a free agent, but only for 3 years. Arbitration salaries after.

There is value in having above average players at low cost. There's much less value in having below average (1 WAR) player at that same cost.

Yeah, I know all about arbitration, but I'm figuring a player of that quality wouldn't have their salary bumped up that much.

I agree with your second conclusion, but again, a lot of teams would love a consistent 1 WAR at SS...plenty of teams field worse than that every year. Again, a championship quality team doesn't need to have someone above average at every position.
 
Dodgers traded Dee Gordon for Andrew Heaney. That's a steal for the Dodgers.

Yep, and rumors that we unload Haren as well.

God, between these two big trades and the likely Matt Kemp one, that's so much activity going on for a fan like me. :up:


And I support all of these trades. Selling high on Dee was actually my biggest hope for this offseason going into it.
 
"The deal is Gordon and Haren to the Marlins in exchange for Heaney, second baseman Enrique Hernandez, righty Chris Hatcher and catcher Austin Barnes, Clark Spencer of the Miami Herald reports."
 
I wouldn't be thrilled about losing Gordon if I were a Dodgers fan. That dude is so fun to watch. Love players of his style. Tell me about this Heaney cat.
 
Apparently at least one of the guys going to the Dodgers in the Gordon-Heaney deal is bookmarked for the Phillies in the Rollins deal, which is still not officially done yet.
 
Apparently at least one of the guys going to the Dodgers in the Gordon-Heaney deal is bookmarked for the Phillies in the Rollins deal, which is still not officially done yet.

So that rumor about the three-team deal had some legs.
 
There is some speculation that the Dodgers are loading up on prospects to go after multiple Phillies. Rollins is obviously one. Utley or Hamels could be another.
 
There goes my McCarthy plan. Andrew Friedman continues to annoy me, even after leaving the AL East.

That said, 4 years is perhaps cutting it too close with him.
 
He just turned Dee Gordon into Kendrick plus a prospect. Incredible.
 
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