The Police Tour '07 - Part 3 - Page 30 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Lemonade Stand > Just the Bang and the Clatter
Click Here to Login
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 01-28-2008, 08:55 PM   #436
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: London/Sydney
Posts: 6,608
Local Time: 07:33 AM
Australian stadiums up until the 90s were generally only built in the 45-50K range. They're also large, odd shapes to accomodate Australian Football and Cricket, where the field is much, much larger (and much rounder) then in European soccer or US football stadiums. That also means that the stage is often set much further down the field than usual, or even in the middle and side on to one of the stands, as otherwise the people 'at the back' are just too far away.

It wouldn't surprise me, re the Police holding the record, they were one of the 2 or 3 singular largest bands in the world at the time, but, considering it was Australia in the 80s, to put it in perspective you'd need to look at attendance for continuous arena runs in single cities, and have a look at how few large scale stadium/open air gigs were even put on here up until about 1990, and under what circumstances they were put on. The Police gig at the raceway, I'd suggest, was a very rare occurance. If you'd actually just said that the Police pulled 70K+ to a single gig in the 80s in Australia and not told me where it was, I would have called bullshit, as I didn't think we had any venues that large then and know that it's pretty rare for bands to be able to use other venues, parks etc. Other bands however did that figure easily in single visits to cities, but did them on long runs in arenas. The largest single city tour attendance in Australian history was Dire Straits in 1986 (18 gigs in a row at the Sydney Entertainment Centre = 216,000). Some Irish band did 2 sellouts + another 70% capacity show in Telstra Stadium in Sydney in 2006. That would have come very close, overtaken definitely if the 3rd show had been a sell out.

I haven't seen a published attendance figure yet, but I'm told by those that were there that last weeks Police Sydney gig was nowhere near sold out, and it was in the same stadium as those U2 shows, one that was only built in the late 90s.There have been very few non-festival gigs there that I can think of: U2, Rolling Stones, the Police - surely a few others... It was also well publicised here that Fergie was brought onto the bill to attract a different demographic to the show, as ticket sales were very sluggish initially.
__________________

__________________
Earnie Shavers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 09:27 PM   #437
Refugee
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,943
Local Time: 06:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by phanan


Based on different reviews of shows from the Rumours tour, which mention capacity, it's safe to assume the Melbourne show was about the same amount of people. Case in point is a Billboard review of a show in Washington:



Now, that number was most likely an estimate, but it's a very good guage as to how well their shows were selling. And certainly a better indicator than a music show, where we have no idea where the information is coming from. It's certainly not official by any means. If you could come up with proof that it was the largest show back then, by all means do. Until you do, I don't consider a music show as official statistics.

Rumours was at number one on the Billboard charts for 31 weeks back in 1977, something unheard of by a rock act previously, and certainly not duplicated very much afterwards. The sales of that album were staggering, and catapulted that band into the stratosphere. Considering the self-titled album released two years previously was still on the charts two years later, I'd say they were successful enough by the Rumours tour to have that kind of demand.

Estimates of other shows in other countries have little to do with what happened in Australia. Anyone that has observed the concert industry knows that how well an artist does usually vary's widely between countries and regions. Its a mistake to extrapolate the success in one country all over the world. In addition, your not taking into account the type of artist that were opening up for Fleetwood Mac when they were touring for Rumours.

One of the bigger shows on Fleetwood Mac's Rumours tour was actually a "Co-headlining" show with the Steve Miller Band at Philadelphia's JFK stadium. If Fleetwood Mac were really as popular as you claim they were at on the Rumours tour in terms of concert attendance, they would not be playing a "Co-headlining" show with the Steve Miller Band.

I've looked at the shows that Fleetwood Mac played on their Rumours tour, a total of 95, and I can tell you that the 105 shows the Police played on the Synchronicity tour were on average in larger venues, with no "co-headlining" situations or festival situations. The Police's Synchronicity tour had a higher attendance and a higher gross.

In the end, a music show which analysis the music industry is more official than dreamed up totals by someone on a message board. If the music show is wrong in its statement, than its incumbent upon you to prove that it is wrong and so far you have provided no information that would show that that the music show was wrong in making the statement.

Being #1 for 31 weeks and selling a lot of albums does not mean x artist is automatically a major draw when it comes to touring. M&M has sold more albums than anyone this decade but he can't fill a single arena on his own outside of Detroit.

Also notice that by the time Fleetwood Mac came to their follow up album for Rumours, they were almost exclusively playing arena's. In fact, they have never made it back into the stadiums.

The latest Police tours GROSS figures are on track to out gross U2's Vertigo tour and will leave Fleetwood Mac's last tour far in the dust. By August of this year, the Police will have the second highest grossing tour in history. Perhaps you should pay attention to that instead of these vague and strange estimates about the past.
__________________

__________________
Strongbow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 09:38 PM   #438
Refugee
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,943
Local Time: 06:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Earnie Shavers
Australian stadiums up until the 90s were generally only built in the 45-50K range. They're also large, odd shapes to accomodate Australian Football and Cricket, where the field is much, much larger (and much rounder) then in European soccer or US football stadiums. That also means that the stage is often set much further down the field than usual, or even in the middle and side on to one of the stands, as otherwise the people 'at the back' are just too far away.

It wouldn't surprise me, re the Police holding the record, they were one of the 2 or 3 singular largest bands in the world at the time, but, considering it was Australia in the 80s, to put it in perspective you'd need to look at attendance for continuous arena runs in single cities, and have a look at how few large scale stadium/open air gigs were even put on here up until about 1990, and under what circumstances they were put on. The Police gig at the raceway, I'd suggest, was a very rare occurance. If you'd actually just said that the Police pulled 70K+ to a single gig in the 80s in Australia and not told me where it was, I would have called bullshit, as I didn't think we had any venues that large then and know that it's pretty rare for bands to be able to use other venues, parks etc. Other bands however did that figure easily in single visits to cities, but did them on long runs in arenas. The largest single city tour attendance in Australian history was Dire Straits in 1986 (18 gigs in a row at the Sydney Entertainment Centre = 216,000). Some Irish band did 2 sellouts + another 70% capacity show in Telstra Stadium in Sydney in 2006. That would have come very close, overtaken definitely if the 3rd show had been a sell out.

I haven't seen a published attendance figure yet, but I'm told by those that were there that last weeks Police Sydney gig was nowhere near sold out, and it was in the same stadium as those U2 shows, one that was only built in the late 90s.There have been very few non-festival gigs there that I can think of: U2, Rolling Stones, the Police - surely a few others... It was also well publicised here that Fergie was brought onto the bill to attract a different demographic to the show, as ticket sales were very sluggish initially.
Stadiums shows that were not festivals were generally rare prior to 1984 just about anywhere. While playing a large number of arena shows that add to the same figure as a stadium show is impressive, its not as impressive as the ability to attract the same number or even more people to a single show. Thats because with the multiple arena night stands, there are many people who are able to attend certain shows who would not be able to attend a single stadium show because they simply could not go on that particular night. Then, there are the multiple show goers which confuse the figures even more.

Its already been noted that the Police attendance in both Melbourne and Sydney is a bit of a disapointment and certainly not as impressive as 1984 in terms of attendance. But, one should note that the Australian shows probably have some of the highest average ticket prices of any Police shows around the world.

Getting 40,000 people to attend a show in Melbourne at an average price of US $130 is still impressive and will give The Police a gross for that single show of well over $5 million dollars which will make it one of the largest gross figures the city of Melbourne has ever seen for a rock concert, even though its not even close to the U2 figure.
__________________
Strongbow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 09:44 PM   #439
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 4,585
Local Time: 06:33 AM
Paul Dainty says 100,000 for FM/Santana in Australia in promotional material.

http://pagesperso-orange.fr/santanamigos/1977.htm
(scroll down to November 13th)

Santana also played down under in the 1976 so one can tell how much of a drew he was himself.

I found another published article that said GNR played to 75,000 at the Calder Park Raceway in 1993. I only mention that as reference.

u2fp
__________________
U2FanPeter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 09:57 PM   #440
Refugee
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,943
Local Time: 06:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by U2FanPeter
Paul Dainty says 100,000 for FM/Santana in Australia in promotional material.

http://pagesperso-orange.fr/santanamigos/1977.htm
(scroll down to November 13th)

Santana also played down under in the 1976 so one can tell how much of a drew he was himself.

I found another published article that said GNR played to 75,000 at the Calder Park Raceway in 1993. I only mention that as reference.

u2fp
More and more this seems like a rock festival rather than a Fleetwood Mac tour. The poster does not say Fleetwood Mac Rumours tour, rather it says "Paul Dantes" Rock Arena tour. The Fleetwood Mac legacy site already pointed out that their shows at JFK stadium in Philadelphia were co-headlining with the Steve Miller Band.

Santana's tour there in 1976 seems like a normal arena tour. The Police played a number of the same places when they were touring for their Regatta De Blanc album and Zenyatta Mondatta album in 1980 and 1981.

I've seen a lot of GNR figures for their last tour which have only turned out to be overblown estimates.
__________________
Strongbow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 10:03 PM   #441
Blue Crack Addict
 
phanan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: in the darkness on the edge of town
Posts: 25,060
Local Time: 01:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Strongbow
Estimates of other shows in other countries have little to do with what happened in Australia. Anyone that has observed the concert industry knows that how well an artist does usually vary's widely between countries and regions. Its a mistake to extrapolate the success in one country all over the world. In addition, your not taking into account the type of artist that were opening up for Fleetwood Mac when they were touring for Rumours.

One of the bigger shows on Fleetwood Mac's Rumours tour was actually a "Co-headlining" show with the Steve Miller Band at Philadelphia's JFK stadium. If Fleetwood Mac were really as popular as you claim they were at on the Rumours tour in terms of concert attendance, they would not be playing a "Co-headlining" show with the Steve Miller Band.
You think, just because it says "co-headliners" that it makes any difference? Fleetwood Mac were the biggest band that year!

Quote:
Originally posted by Strongbow
I've looked at the shows that Fleetwood Mac played on their Rumours tour, a total of 95, and I can tell you that the 105 shows the Police played on the Synchronicity tour were on average in larger venues, with no "co-headlining" situations or festival situations. The Police's Synchronicity tour had a higher attendance and a higher gross.
We're not comparing entire tours. We're talking about one Australian show. Stick to the topic.

Quote:
Originally posted by Strongbow
In the end, a music show which analysis the music industry is more official than dreamed up totals by someone on a message board. If the music show is wrong in its statement, than its incumbent upon you to prove that it is wrong and so far you have provided no information that would show that that the music show was wrong in making the statement.
Did you even read my post? That's not from a message board, it's from an official Billboard review! I would say their estimates wouldn't be that far off. And its incumbent for you to provide official numbers instead of what a show says. But no, because STING/Strongbow, whatever the hell you want to call yourself, always has to be right, he's not obligated to do so. He'll just hear something from a show and predict it's correct, even if others offer other estimates that he doesn't like to hear and therefore proclaims they are wrong, because, you know, you're never wrong.

Quote:
Originally posted by Strongbow
Being #1 for 31 weeks and selling a lot of albums does not mean x artist is automatically a major draw when it comes to touring. M&M has sold more albums than anyone this decade but he can't fill a single arena on his own outside of Detroit.
Hip hop is a much different genre that isn't nearly as popular around the world as acts like Fleetwood Mac and The Police. That is a very poor example. And like I said before, the absolute astonishing sales numbers of Rumours, and the consistency of the previous album, put them in a different category.

Quote:
Originally posted by Strongbow
Also notice that by the time Fleetwood Mac came to their follow up album for Rumours, they were almost exclusively playing arena's. In fact, they have never made it back into the stadiums.
Who cares about what happened after? We are talking about what happened in Melbourne in 1977!

Quote:
Originally posted by Strongbow
The latest Police tours GROSS figures are on track to out gross U2's Vertigo tour and will leave Fleetwood Mac's last tour far in the dust. By August of this year, the Police will have the second highest grossing tour in history.
Nobody is debating that. Again, you are veering off topic.

Quote:
Originally posted by Strongbow
Perhaps you should pay attention to that instead of these vague and strange estimates about the past.
Perhaps you should stop patronizing other people on this forum and act as a more responsible adult, unless you wish to be banned.
__________________
phanan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 10:21 PM   #442
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 4,585
Local Time: 06:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Strongbow
I've seen a lot of GNR figures for their last tour which have only turned out to be overblown estimates.
Here's a plausible audience figure

www.austadiums.com/stadiums/stadiums.php?id=26

u2fp
__________________
U2FanPeter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 10:25 PM   #443
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 4,585
Local Time: 06:33 AM
I think The Police had videoscreens in 1984, Bowie did several months before. If they did, it makes the Fleetwood audience figure that much more impressive since those int he back could not see anything.

What's not being discussed is complete Australian tour attendance figures. I'm sure The Beatles Bowie and KISS(180,000 over 3 weeks in the late 70's) still slaughter The Police.

u2fp
__________________
U2FanPeter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 10:37 PM   #444
Refugee
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,943
Local Time: 06:33 AM
Quote:
You think, just because it says "co-headliners" that it makes any difference? Fleetwood Mac were the biggest band that year!
Just the fact that Steve Miller was on the bill makes a difference let alone the fact that it was billed as a co-headlining show. Did U2 play any co-headlining shows on the Joshua Tree tour? Nope. Did the Police play any co-headlining shows on the Synchronicity tour? Nope.

Fleetwood Mac had the biggest selling album of 1977, but that alone does not make them the biggest band of 1977. The biggest band is a combination of album selling ability and concert drawing ability with both considered equally. Even if one considers Fleetwood Mac to be the biggest band of 1977, that alone does not tell you if they had the largest performance in Australian history that year and that they had a performance that was larger than the Police show in Melbourne in 1984.



Quote:
Did you even read my post? That's not from a message board, it's from an official Billboard review! I would say their estimates wouldn't be that far off.
The Billboard review was of a show in Philadelphia, not Melbourne Australia. I'm sure its a good estimate and maybe even an actual figure for the Philadelphia show, but it has nothing to do with any of the shows Fleetwood Mac played at in Australia.

Quote:
Hip hop is a much different genre that isn't nearly as popular around the world as acts like Fleetwood Mac and The Police. That is a very poor example. And like I said before, the absolute astonishing sales numbers of Rumours, and the consistency of the previous album, put them in a different category.
Selling lots of albums does not necessarily translate to large concert ticket sales, especially when the artist is only on their first or second commercially successful album.
__________________
Strongbow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 10:41 PM   #445
Refugee
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,943
Local Time: 06:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by U2FanPeter


Here's a plausible audience figure

www.austadiums.com/stadiums/stadiums.php?id=26

u2fp
The stands only hold a small number of people, 24,000 which helps to put the capacity of the venue in perspective. In any event, its obvious that this alleged Fleetwood Mac show is really a festival based on the information you have provided.
__________________
Strongbow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 10:46 PM   #446
Babyface
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 16
Local Time: 06:33 AM
yeah lol they suck eh
__________________
u2luvr66macphis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 10:53 PM   #447
Refugee
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,943
Local Time: 06:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by U2FanPeter
I think The Police had videoscreens in 1984, Bowie did several months before. If they did, it makes the Fleetwood audience figure that much more impressive since those int he back could not see anything.

What's not being discussed is complete Australian tour attendance figures. I'm sure The Beatles Bowie and KISS(180,000 over 3 weeks in the late 70's) still slaughter The Police.

u2fp
The Police did have video screens for some of their shows on the Synchronicity tour but its really irrelevant when determining attendance, especially back in those days. U2 had some video screens for their Joshua Tree shows and others that did not, but it did not impact attendance for either.

The reason that "complete" Australian tour attendance figures are not being discussed is because they were never the topic. All of this discussion which really amounts to a lot of hot air was comes mainly from the posting of the fact that the Police had the largest show by a Foreign artist with their Melbourne 1984 show.

As for this laughable assertion of "slaughtering The Police", The Police's Synchronicity Tour dwarfed anything the Beatles did on the road, and certainly beat David Bowie's tour of the same time, as well as anything that Kiss did back in the late 1970s early 1980s.

Whats more, Kiss's re-union tour numbers are far lower than the numbers The Police are posting on their reunion tour and David Bowie has not done anything close either.
__________________
Strongbow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 11:18 PM   #448
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 4,585
Local Time: 06:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Strongbow
Whats more, Kiss's re-union tour numbers are far lower than the numbers The Police are posting on their reunion tour and David Bowie has not done anything close either.
How were Stings numbers on his last solo tour of OZ?
__________________
U2FanPeter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 11:44 PM   #449
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 4,585
Local Time: 06:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Strongbow
The Police did have video screens for some of their shows on the Synchronicity tour but its really irrelevant when determining attendance, especially back in those days. U2 had some video screens for their Joshua Tree shows and others that did not, but it did not impact attendance for either.


IIRC, U2 have screens at nearly every US stadium show in 1987. The only exeptions I can think of are possibly Vancouver and the $5 Tempe shows that got filmed. There are print ads that had the words "screens" written quite prominently.

Quote:
As for this laughable assertion of "slaughtering The Police", The Police's Synchronicity Tour dwarfed anything the Beatles did on the road, and certainly beat David Bowie's tour of the same time, as well as anything that Kiss did back in the late 1970s early 1980s.
Did the Police have 350,000 fans greet them outside their hotel when they arrived on the continent?

u2fp
__________________
U2FanPeter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2008, 11:50 PM   #450
Refugee
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,943
Local Time: 06:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by U2FanPeter


How were Stings numbers on his last solo tour of OZ?
Don't know, and don't at all see how that would be relevant.
__________________

__________________
Strongbow is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
the police

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:33 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com