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Old 07-27-2009, 04:21 PM   #121
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..






Does anybody sense damage control?

There is an attempt to bury this story and sweep it all under the rug, now that Obama and Gates look to be in the wrong side of the issue.

Lesson: when you cast aspersions, malign a police officer and are wrong in doing so, get both parties together, don't admit you're wrong and apologize -just have a beer and make it all go away.


Sad.

<>
Brother Diamond, I'm afraid I must disagree with you here. The conservative approach should be to resolve issues by negotiation and agreement, rather than a (liberal style) shouting match. These efforts to resolve their differences amicably should meet with approval from conservatives.
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Old 07-27-2009, 04:28 PM   #122
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It really has nothing to do with fucking conservative or liberal it's just the adult way of settling things.
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Old 07-27-2009, 04:36 PM   #123
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But conservatives are more inclined to settle things by negotiation, liberals are more inclined to use lawsuits and the like.
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Old 07-27-2009, 04:42 PM   #124
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Brother Diamond, I'm afraid I must disagree with you here. The conservative approach should be to resolve issues by negotiation and agreement, rather than a (liberal style) shouting match. These efforts to resolve their differences amicably should meet with approval from conservatives.
I was thinking more in the terms of acountability.

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Old 07-27-2009, 04:50 PM   #125
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But conservatives are more inclined to settle things by negotiation, liberals are more inclined to use lawsuits and the like.
You try way too fucking hard. That or you flat out live in delusion.
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Old 07-27-2009, 05:56 PM   #126
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and it's not just american media that cater to the lowest common denominator (of which we have an example present in the thread).
Clearly we have several examples, seeing as how the thread is 9 pages long!
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In the past most presidents would not have touched this type of issue deferring to the local authorities and excusing themselves for lack of knowledge on the case, but not this president.
Past (i.e. white) presidents would never have been asked to comment on a case like this to begin with.
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1-If Gates had become so unmanageable to impede the investigation because of his yelling and unruliness and it hadn't been determined yet that he was suppose to be in the house legally-than that would necessitate an arrest for disorderly conduct.

2-As yelling in a crowded theater one could be arrested for disorderly conduct, one can also be arrested for disorderly conduct for yelling at peace officer who in the process of completing an investigation.
No, if the police didn't believe him to be a lawful occupant, then the charge would've been breaking and entering. And it's clear from both the police report ("I radioed my findings to ECC on channel two and prepared to leave...I told Gates that I was leaving his residence and that if he had any other questions regarding the matter, I would speak with him outside") and from Crowley's subsequent interviews ("The professor at any time could have resolved the issue by quieting down and/or going back inside his house") that Crowley was making to leave when he stepped outside. Breaking and entering is a felony; the police don't just go "Oh f* it, I don't feel like dealing with this jerk now, I'm gonna forget it and leave" if they don't feel satisfied that it didn't happen.

The Massachusetts disorderly conduct statute is quoted verbatim at the end of the police report:
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[On 7/16/2009 was a disorderly person, in that he or she did,] with purpose to cause public inconvenience, annoyance or alarm, or recklessly creating a risk thereof, engage in fighting or threatening, or in violent or tumultuous behavior, or did create a hazardous or physically offensive condition by an act that served no legitimate purpose of the defendant, in violation of the common law and GL c.272.53.
Which is why the police report was stretching to convey the impression that a disruption to the neighborhood they couldn't let slide was transpiring ("When I left the residence" Crowley noted that "at least seven passers-by were looking in the direction of Gates, who had followed me outside" and that these passers-by "appeared surprised and alarmed"). As if "passers-by" don't always stop and gawk when there's a knot of police officers on someone's lawn; as if the police were somehow dutifully intervening in a pre-existing disturbance posed by Gates to his neighbors, rather than one where they "at any time could have resolved the issue by" LEAVING. This is just plain old entrapment: Now that I got you where I want you, a*hole, take a look at these handcuffs and I dare you to call me that again.
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But conservatives reasonable peoples are more inclined to settle things by negotiation, liberals Americans are more inclined to use lawsuits and the like.
Fixed that for ya!




Anyway, the latest development:

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Police Release 911 Tape, Dispatches of Gates' Arrest; Tapes Vague, Do Not Settle Differing Accounts

ABC News, July 27


The Cambridge Police Department today released the 911 tape and radio dispatches in the arrest of Henry Louis Gates Jr., in which the police are heard saying that the "gentlemen says he resides here" and is uncooperative, and advises to keep the backup cars coming.

Massachusetts police release a copy of the 911 and radio dispatch tapes. In the 911 call, a woman--identified in the media as Lucia Whalen--reports seeing two men break the screen door of Gates' front entrance to enter the house. The woman admits she saw suitcases, and she suggests several times that the men be the house residents. "I don't know if they live there, and they just had a hard time with their keys," she's heard saying. " But I did notice that they kind of used their shoulders trying to barge in and they got in." When asked about the race of the men, the caller said she thought one looked "kind of Hispanic," but didn't see what the other man looked like.

In the radio dispatches, a police officer identifies Gates as the man inside the house, saying he is uncooperative. Except for vague noises in the background, the conversation between Gates and the officers is mostly unclear. Since Gates cannot be heard on the police tapes, the tapes do not settle the differing accounts between Gates and the arresting officer, Sgt. James Crowley. Gates claims Crowley ignored his requests for his name, while Crowley claims that Gates was loud, accused him of arresting Gates because he "was a black man in America," and even made a reference to Crowley's mother. Gates was charged with disorderly conduct, although the charges were later dropped.

...[T]he White House's beer diplomacy may be a challenging task, as the two men are standing steadfastly by their argument that the other is not telling the truth...Gates denied he told Crowley, as the police report states, that "I'll speak with your mama outside." Gates added that Crowley must have gotten that line from watching the '70s TV show "Good Times."
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Old 07-27-2009, 06:34 PM   #127
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Old 07-27-2009, 07:18 PM   #128
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Clearly we have several examples, seeing as how the thread is 9 pages long!

Past (i.e. white) presidents would never have been asked to comment on a case like this to begin with.

:
Wrong, President Bush commented on the Byrd murder case from Texas when asked.

So based on the statute Gates was guilty of 'disorderly conduct' because on his behavior in a legal sense. For political and cultural reasons the charges were dropped.

The elephant(s) in the room that left minded people are choosing to ignore are:

Gates has a predisposition to reverse racism; Gates favors Malcom X's views to MLK's. He saw Crowely as a Mark Furhman type character when Crowley was probably the closet thing to being Gate's advocate as possible-as far as national racial issues are concerned.

Barrrack's latent predisposition as well, by referring to the policeman and dept. stupid-without knowing the facts. He knew it was a white police officer involved and who Gates was. He hasn't shaken the 20 years of Jeremiah Wright sermons from his consciousness yet it appears.

There has been no mention that Gates had donated a 1 million dollars to the Obama campaign. Obama knew this before the question was asked and who Gates was.

The question at the press conference about this situation was pre planned and it backfired on Obama terribly.


I could go on, but why, really. There will be no accountability for this, therefore "fair minded" ppl on the left can rest easily.


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PS-

If Gates were white and came at Crowely the same way he would have still been arrested, however there wouldn't had been a need for a national story. There would be nothing to exploit or manipulate.
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Old 07-27-2009, 07:43 PM   #129
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Why did the white working class cop have a hard on for black upper class educated men?
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Old 07-27-2009, 08:20 PM   #130
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Maybe because he was disorderly, yelled at him, got in his face?

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Old 07-27-2009, 08:52 PM   #131
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The police were called out to investigate a possible burglary, correct? They verified that the identity of the "suspect" was in fact the owner of the house, correct? So the 'case,' so to speak, was closed at that point, correct?
I disagree. Something I haven’t heard discussed is what if there actually was a burglar in the house? The caller did say there were two men. What if they had Gates’ wife (assuming he is married) held at gunpoint telling Gates to “get rid of the cops” or she dies? Lets just say he shows his ID and the cop leaves, but the next day the headline reads “Professor and wife shot to death after cop leaves the scene”

I’m not a cop, but I would think they are trained to not take anything for granted and keep all possibilities open.

Just a point.
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Old 07-27-2009, 09:00 PM   #132
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In her 911 call, Lucia Whalen, who works at the Harvard alumni magazine, repeatedly tells the operator she is not sure what is happening.

Speaking calmly, she tells the operator that she was stopped by an elderly woman who told her she noticed two men trying to get into a house. Whalen initially says she saw two men pushing on the door, but later says one of the men entered the home and she didn't get a good look at him. She says she noticed two suitcases.

"I don't know if they live there and they just had a hard time with their key. But I did notice they used their shoulder to try to barge in and they got in. I don't know if they had a key or not, 'cause I couldn't see from my angle," Whalen says.

She does not mention the race of the men until pressed by a dispatcher to describe them.

"Um, well, there were two larger men," Whalen says. "One looked kind of Hispanic, but I'm not really sure. And the other one entered and I didn't see what he looked like at all. I just saw it from a distance and this older woman was worried, thinking, 'Someone's been breaking in someone's house. They've been barging in.'"

The officer who arrested Gates, Sgt. James Crowley, said in his police report that he talked to Whalen soon after he arrived at Gates' home. "She went on to tell me that she observed what appeared to be two black males with backpacks on the porch," Crowley, who's white, wrote in his report.

Whalen's attorney, Wendy Murphy, said her client never mentioned the men's race to Crowley and is upset by news reports she believes have unfairly depicted her as a racist.
So the woman who called in is now insisting that the police report is inaccurate and that she never told the police officer that she saw black men with backpacks.

Interesting.
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Old 07-27-2009, 09:03 PM   #133
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Wrong, President Bush commented on the Byrd murder case from Texas when asked.
Bush as governor personally signed the execution warrants for the two men receiving the death penalty for Byrd's murder, then went on to cite their harsh punishments as an argument against Texas' passage of the Byrd Hate Crimes Act. The latter fact did become a minor campaign issue in 2000, and it was perfectly natural for it to become so, since it directly involved him. I wasn't suggesting this was some outrageous sly trap on 'the media's' part to ask Obama to comment--just pointing out that if he weren't the nation's most visible black authority figure, he would never've been asked to comment on a dropped misdemeanor charge in Cambridge, MA which 'just happened' to have controversial racial undertones.
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So based on the statute Gates was guilty of 'disorderly conduct' because on his behavior in a legal sense.
This sentence makes no sense at all.
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If Gates were white and came at Crowely the same way he would have still been arrested, however there wouldn't had been a need for a national story.
Possibly he might've been--and it would've been just as wrong to arrest him in that case. There's no "need" for a national story either way; it's just that it involves a prominent African-American author, TV documentary host, and scholar being led away in handcuffs, then accusing the police of racially motivated injustice. That sells papers.



The rest of your post is a WorldNetDaily-derived blend of b.s., intentionally inflammatory speculation, and utter irrelevancy (actually all of it is irrelevant to the topic, namely the arrest), none of it worth addressing.
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Old 07-27-2009, 09:11 PM   #134
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It's quite simple, really. With the advent of 24/7 'news' channels, there needs to be something to fill all that airtime, so stories like this get talked about ad nauseum.
true. it's the only reason i can think of as to why michael jackson's death is still being discussed on cnn, though that's another thread.
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Old 07-27-2009, 09:14 PM   #135
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They'll discuss it until they see ratings dip, then they'll move on to the next sensational story. It's a sick fucking industry and I look forward to leaving it.
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