"The universe exploding 'cosa of one man's lie"

[The Slow Loris]

Does anyone know what Bono actually means here? I don't think he is saying that Albert Einstein's theory of relativity is wrong, nor do I think he's calling him a liar (though I may be wrong). I have a feeling it's more Biblical than that -- not that the two ideas are mutually exclusive by any stretch. Does anyone know for sure, or at least have any ideas?

 

[LMP]

It's not the universe itself, but the microcosm of a man's life.

The way I see it, it fits within a theme of the album of it being a relationship.

The phone call could be a man calling his wife or girlfriend after he was with a lover.

Think of the song in that context and tell me what you think.

 

[djerdap]

I always thought about Judas Iscariot after hearing that lyric.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Yes, biblical, Adam. The first deceitful act in the history of man. Bono/The Fly is owning up to his own crimes, and burying them in a wide range of excuses, even claiming it's not really his fault because it's just the way man is. The Fly to me is a pretty arrogant song. "I'm very sorry, but at the same time I regret nothing, and it's not my fault anyway."

 

[Utoo]

A sidenote: Best version of the line is when he says it as "the universe exploded 'cause of one man's fucking lie." Don't know why...it just makes it for me.

 

[The Slow Loris]

It's not the universe itself, but the microcosm of a man's life.

The way I see it, it fits within a theme of the album of it being a relationship.

The phone call could be a man calling his wife or girlfriend after he was with a lover.

Think of the song in that context and tell me what you think.

Beautiful. That's exactly the interpretation I was looking for. Bono is telling it like it is...doesn't make it right, doesn't make it okay, but every artist is indeed a bit of a cannibal, a bit of a thief....inspiration is born out of experiences such as these, and I love Bono's wry, sarcastic comment, "Kill their inspiration and sing about the grief"....it makes the point beautifully. When Bono sings, "I'm running out of change....there's a lot of things, if I could I'd rearrange," it reminds me of the idea that sprung 'With or Without You', the idea of contradiction, being at the center of it, where we are torn between two different directions....needing the family, and needing the street, and in some ways, I don't think Bono could possibly rearrange that aspect of being an artist. To get rid of it would be to lose that aspect of himself.

Good stuff....

 

[The Slow Loris]

A sidenote: Best version of the line is when he says it as "the universe exploded 'cause of one man's fucking lie." Don't know why...it just makes it for me.

In the context of a relationship, I can see why that would work well....

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Loris, that's exactly it.

I've always wondered what the Hewson household was like to be around the day Achtung was released.

 

[U2isthebest]

Here is the way I interpreted it because of my faith, and knowing what I do about Bono's thought he may have had in mind when he wrote it: If you read the lyrics in the first verse, "It's no secret that the stars are falling from the sky, it's no secret that our world is in darkness tonight" is a reference to a Biblical passage in the book of Revelations that talks of a time "the stars will far from the sky and the moon will turn red" referring to the return of Christ. Our world is still a sinful one, according to what Believers, well believe, until this happens, hence "our world is in darkness tonight." As for your question "the universe exploded because of one man's lie" refers to Adam's sin in the Garden of Eden that The Bible talks about in the book of Genesis. You're likely familar with the story of Adam and Eve, and how they ate the apple of the tree God told them not to. When they did they hid from God and Adam lied, sin entered the world according to the Bible and Adam and Eve were kicked out of the Garden and forced to pay (and the rest of human kind to follow) for these sins that could only be taken away by an eventual Birth, Death, and Resurrection of Christ, according to The Bible. Hence, "the universe exploded because of one man's lie" It's very similar to a passage in the Bible that says "For if by the sin of one man death reigned through that one man.... through the disobedience of one man the many were made sinners." Romans 7:17 and 19. Obviously, one can interpret the lyrics any way they choose, but that is most likely what Bono had in mind when he wrote it.

Currently Listening: "Don't Leave Me This Way"/Thelma Houston

 

[thelaj]

What versions of the song have that line? I have never heard it with the "fucking"

 

[djerdap]

What versions of the song have that line? I have never heard it with the "fucking"

Majority of versions from the Vertigo Tour.

 

[Varitek]

It's no secret that the stars are falling from the sky
The universe exploded 'cause of one man's lie
Look, I gotta go, yeah I'm running outta change
There's a lot of things if I could I'd rearrange

The key is the third line. It's that guilty (concious is a pest, after all) phonecall on a payphone admitting to that lie that's exploding somebody's universe. The fourth line shows the regret, the guilt.

The question for me is, why is it addressed to "Oh Baby Child" and "I'm telling you child"?

(Also it seems to me this thread is destined for It's a Musical Journey.)

 

[Earnie Shavers]

(Also it seems to me this thread is destined for It's a Musical Journey.)

I hope not. Great place for an interesting thread to die.

 

[Varitek]

Loris, that's exactly it.

I've always wondered what the Hewson household was like to be around the day Achtung was released.

Because of the implications of the song? Wasn't it Edge who was going through a divorce around this time? Maybe it has something to do with that, as it does with other parts of the album (So Cruel, one of my favorite U2 lines: "I'm only hanging on/to watch you go down").

All I know is if I were Allie and Bono had just come out with Mysterious Ways and Whose Gonna Ride Your Wild Horses, especially the latter, I'd be a very happy woman.

 

[Varitek]

I hope not. Great place for an interesting thread to die.

Yeah, I know, but that's what the forum is there for: to discuss meaning in song lyrics. If people would only check it more often,; often it has other interesting threads that don't deserve to die...

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Obviously, one can interpret the lyrics any way they choose, but that is most likely what Bono had in mind when he wrote it.

I don't think there's much interpretation room, I think that's exactly what he means.

The opening line, so harsh: "They say the sun is sometimes eclipsed by the moon. You know I don't see you, when she walks in the room." Ouch.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Because of the implications of the song? Wasn't it Edge who was going through a divorce around this time? Maybe it has something to do with that, as it does with other parts of the album (So Cruel, one of my favorite U2 lines: "I'm only hanging on/to watch you go down").

I know one of the rules here is that we're not supposed to discuss the bands personal life or whatever, but I think there's wiggle room when we're using actual lyrics, or quotes from the band. We all know that much of Achtung is supposed to be based on Edge's divorce, but so much of it is from the other side of the coin. We don't know Edge's story - perhaps it was him that mucked up? But there is a quote from Bono in 'At the End of the World" where he talks about his experiences that are relayed into Achtung. Basically says he's not denying the truth in some of the songs, but at the same time he's not going to confirm, out of respect for Ali. Even Better, Mysterious Ways, Who's Gonna Ride, The Fly, Tryin' to Throw, Ultraviolet.... They're not songs about having your heartbroken. They're songs about running a bit wild, trying to reign yourself in, and paying for the consequences.

All I know is if I were Allie and Bono had just come out with Mysterious Ways and Whose Gonna Ride Your Wild Horses, especially the latter, I'd be a very happy woman.

Why? A song about the temptation to choose lust over love, and a song about an affair - did you mean you wouldn't be a very happy woman?

 

[Varitek]

I don't think there's much interpretation room, I think that's exactly what he means.

The opening line, so harsh: "They say the sun is sometimes eclipsed by the moon. You know I don't see you, when she walks in the room." Ouch.

Wait you agree with U2isthebest that it's about original sin and the fall from Eden and you're quoting a line to back up it being about cheating/the end of a relationship?? Or are you saying there's no room for interpretation about the bible; he means it's about a relationship?

And yes, that line is pretty damn clear. A great line, especially the use of sun and moon: the wife/girlfriend is the bigger, supposedly more important one with more (gravitational) pull but yet, the other woman sweeps the wife from his mind.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Wait you agree with U2isthebest that it's about original sin and the fall from Eden and you're quoting a line to back up it being about cheating/the end of a relationship?? Or are you saying there's no room for interpretation about the bible; he means it's about a relationship?

No, two seperate thoughts in one post. Yes, I agree with U2isthebest about the original sin. THEN just a random comment about what I think of that line. Not connected. My fault for not being clear.

 

[Varitek]

I know one of the rules here is that we're not supposed to discuss the bands personal life or whatever, but I think there's wiggle room when we're using actual lyrics, or quotes from the band. We all know that much of Achtung is supposed to be based on Edge's divorce, but so much of it is from the other side of the coin. We don't know Edge's story - perhaps it was him that mucked up? But there is a quote from Bono in 'At the End of the World" where he talks about his experiences that are relayed into Achtung. Basically says he's not denying the truth in some of the songs, but at the same time he's not going to confirm, out of respect for Ali. Even Better, Mysterious Ways, Who's Gonna Ride, The Fly, Tryin' to Throw, Ultraviolet.... They're not songs about having your heartbroken. They're songs about running a bit wild, trying to reign yourself in, and paying for the consequences.



Why? A song about the temptation to choose lust over love, and a song about an affair - did you mean you wouldn't be a very happy woman?

Mysterious Ways: there is no indication in that song that it is about lust over love or an affair. It's love, it's the real thing, to "be there when you hit the ground," to "see the man inside the child."

Now what I don't get about that song is what Johnny is doing with his sister the moon and then with his sister in the rain. Thoughts?


I don't necessarily see WGRYWH as a song about an affair. It ain't no happy marriage, either, but I have muddled feelings about the song. I see it as being full of deeply romantic feelings for somebody, not necessarily an affair (one of their best lines: "the doors you open, I just can't close" both about not turning down an opportunity but also having such admiration, such love that he can't do anything counter to her). It might be about a girl who's just out of reach but I see that as "you're above me, you're too good for me, you're so amazing that I have you up on this pedestal" and also "You leave me just out of reach" as she is hard to get, or maybe that she doesn't, well, "you don't know what you want". Now, I can see the playing-the-field in the "gypsy heart" stereotype (and I just saw the opera Carmen). And the accident/piece of glass. But for me lines like "baby can we still be friends" and "whose gonna take the place of me" imply that the song is about the end of a relationship, not an affair, and one that was incredible and tumultuous and romantic and full of deep love...I'm seeing it as an Eternal Sunshine of a Spotless Mind relationship. But maybe that's just me, thinking that this song is full of incredibly romantic lines, so I want it to be about something above an affair. If I were Ali, I'd still be me and feel that way? I dunno if Bono sang this to me I'd just melt away. If I could dance with him for one song it would probably be this one. (oooh good thread topic...)

And yes that paragraph is deeply confused, I know.

 

[Varitek]

No, two seperate thoughts in one post. Yes, I agree with U2isthebest about the original sin. THEN just a random comment about what I think of that line. Not connected. My fault for not being clear.

I don't think it's as strongly biblical as u2isthebest would have it - the reference to original sin might be there in a comparison to the cheating, but not the rest about Jesus's return and the dark world. Where is the savior here? He's dropping a bomb and then his phone runs out of change and he's like "if only I could go back in time...bye."

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Now what I don't get about that song is what Johnny is doing with his sister the moon and then with his sister in the rain. Thoughts?

Just quickly, gotta run and put money on a horse race (Australians know what I'm talking about) but the Johnny is John the Baptist. The story of Salome, via the play on the topic. So it's about temptation. Being tempted into going against something (or someone) you love. I always think that's what the "It's alright, it's alright" is about. Kinda like convincing yourself. "It's okay, you can do it, you can get away with it." Or whatever thought process you have in that moment of temptation. I always have loved how Tryin' to Throw comes straight after Mysterious Ways. Head off into the night and live it up, deal with a serious temptation (and I don't know if in the song he gives in to the temptation or not - hard to tell - "move on this moment, follow this feeling" followed by the far more confident "It's alright! It's alright!" and, live, him reaching out to the belly dancer and taking her headpiece as a symbolic gesture of giving in. Maybe he does fall for it. But of course John the Baptist knocked Salome back...) and then crawl your way back home the following morning wrecked with guilt.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

I don't think it's as strongly biblical as u2isthebest would have it - the reference to original sin might be there in a comparison to the cheating, but not the rest about Jesus's return and the dark world. Where is the savior here? He's dropping a bomb and then his phone runs out of change and he's like "if only I could go back in time...bye."

No, it's just an excuse. A wild excuse. Like the "artist is a cannibal" and the whole "A man will rise, a man will fall, across the sheer face of love, like a fly on a wall - it's no secret at all". He's placing the blame all over the place. I'm an artist, I'm a man, it's not my fault. We are geneticaly built to lie, I have this internal fight, it's the way I/we are. It's not my fault. Denial in a way I guess.

 

[Varitek]

Just quickly, gotta run and put money on a horse race (Australians know what I'm talking about) but the Johnny is John the Baptist. The story of Salome, via the play on the topic. So it's about temptation. Being tempted into going against something (or someone) you love. I always think that's what the "It's alright, it's alright" is about. Kinda like convincing yourself. "It's okay, you can do it, you can get away with it." Or whatever thought process you have in that moment of temptation. I always have loved how Tryin' to Throw comes straight after Mysterious Ways. Head off into the night and live it up, deal with a serious temptation (and I don't know if in the song he gives in to the temptation or not - hard to tell - "move on this moment, follow this feeling" followed by the far more confident "It's alright! It's alright!" and, live, him reaching out to the belly dancer and taking her headpiece as a symbolic gesture of giving in. Maybe he does fall for it. But of course John the Baptist knocked Salome back...) and then crawl your way back home the following morning wrecked with guilt.

Fair enough, and that would support it being about lust, but I haven't ever seen the rest of the song like this. Of course the beauty of a good song lyric (cliche alert) is that it is open for interpretation:

You've been living underground
Eating from a can
You've been running away
From what you don't understand...
Love

She's slippy
Your're sliding down
She'll be there when you hit the ground

could be about a sleazey lifestyle, forgetting/not understanding real love, sliding down further into the sleaze. Or it could be about somebody going through a hard time, running away from whatever, but love is still there when they hit the bottom.

Good luck with your betting.

 

[The Slow Loris]

I personally see a dual (parallel) narrative going on here, and both are intentional. I don't think we need to say it's either one or the other. Bono loves to intertwine God and spirituality, specifically biblical imagery, with romantic love....and quite often you can't tell if he's talking about God or "Woman". And the lines are blurred, I feel, intentionally....which makes sense since Bono likes to portray the feminine sides of God, and has even wondered out loud if God is a woman! This duality runs throughout Achtung Baby and many, many other U2 songs.

 

[Varitek]

No, it's just an excuse. A wild excuse. Like the "artist is a cannibal" and the whole "A man will rise, a man will fall, across the sheer face of love, like a fly on a wall - it's no secret at all". He's placing the blame all over the place. I'm an artist, I'm a man, it's not my fault. We are geneticaly built to lie, I have this internal fight, it's the way I/we are. It's not my fault. Denial in a way I guess.

Yup, "all kill their inspiration" - ruin the best things in life: love - and then sing/complain about the grief this brings instead of being inspired in their art by love.

Still don't get the child - it's a weird nickname for a romantic partner and it's not litterally telling the child, product of your relationship, about the cheating...

 

[The Slow Loris]

No, it's just an excuse. A wild excuse. Like the "artist is a cannibal" and the whole "A man will rise, a man will fall, across the sheer face of love, like a fly on a wall - it's no secret at all". He's placing the blame all over the place. I'm an artist, I'm a man, it's not my fault. We are geneticaly built to lie, I have this internal fight, it's the way I/we are. It's not my fault. Denial in a way I guess.

Say what you want about whether or not it's an excuse, but it makes for one great album, doesn't it? I think that's the point Bono is making, in the end.

 

[Varitek]

Say what you want about whether or not it's an excuse, but it makes for one great album, doesn't it? I think that's the point Bono is making, in the end.

Sorry, can you clarify? What point is he making? (don't mean this rudely, just didn't get it from your post)

 

[The Slow Loris]

Sorry, can you clarify? What point is he making? (don't mean this rudely, just didn't get it from your post)

No worries.... I was just restating what I said earlier about Bono being at the center of contradiction -- requiring his family life, yet gravitating to the street, being torn in two different directions to his role as an artist -- by using the example of Achtung Baby as the art in question. If he wasn't the torn artist, if he didn't live at the center of contradiction, if he wasn't living "with or without" that life, he wouldn't be creating art as powerful as Achtung Baby. So it's the point that he's making in The Fly which is exemplified by Achtung Baby, itself.

Maybe that's why the music has mellowed out so much now? Not to stir things up.

 

[Screwtape2]

Interesting interpretations. I think the song is about a burnt out old man having an affair with a younger woman. The lyrics/phone call is the old man going on a rant about why they should stay together. The bits of wisdom are his way of showing her that he knows the way of the world. As for the specific line asked about in the first post, I don't think it is a sign of guilt. People look at 'exploded' as a bad thing. I think the line is saying the universe has opened up because of the lie. So many new things are possible because of this affair. The song could very well be another song in the line of Deep In The Heart, Walk To The Water & Luminous Times. The suffocation and uncertainty of love is a running theme.